Do most married men tell the same stories to the OW?

[Ormiriathomimus]

I am still in the stage of obsessively googling and reading about affairs since the discovery of DH's affair. It will pass but at the moment it's like peeling a scab Painful but satisfying.

I have found some OW forums - and once i managed to stop frothing at the mouth at some of the things I read, I realised that most of them had been told 'my wife doesn't understand me/want sex/love me/ talk to me' etc etc and 'I'm only staying because I don't want to hurt her/hurt my kids' blah blah de blah! And what is more so many of the posters appeared to have swallowed the stories hook, line and sinker.

This has the knock on effect of making the OW angry and frustrated when the man chooses to go back to/not leave his wife - why would he when shes so fat/stupid/bad-tempered etc and I'm so much better?

Are there really so many unsatisfactory, hopeless marriages out there and awful wives? IME there aren't. There are marriages (most of them) that aren't perfect, but most of them have very happy times too. I only know of one without any saving graces (and she's scared to leave).

In which case why do so many OW fall for it?

I don't think there's any 'norm' in these things. Everyone's an individual with their own attitudes and motivations. Whilst I'm sure some lovers engage in the delusion/deception game, conveniently setting aside the lies and hearing what they want to hear etc., I'm equally sure others go into it eyes wide open, knowing the score and simply enjoying it while it lasts.

gloryb is a dedicated ow forum and apparently where my friend's ow used to go to.
oh yes, I forgot that my friend's wife is 'mad' too.

onemorechap I think the thing about a marriage or relationship that's not working is that it is incredibly sad and often painful if it ends but seriously bloody difficult to deal with if one half has been having sex with someone else, before it's ended. It's also the deceit etc that is so awful.

There may be reasons in some instances, and the injured party may well be a complete PITA but one person being horrible & behaving badly never justifies someone else behaving like a shit. Surely it would have been morally better to end things before starting with someone else?

" I'm equally sure others go into it eyes wide open, knowing the score and simply enjoying it while it lasts." Well quite. If i chose to shag a married man (other than mine that is) I am not sure I'd need to gild it with nice little lies - betrayal is betrayal, why pretend otherwise.

It's very common.

Some people who have affairs feel so guilty that they need to convince themselves that their OH is a horrible person. It's pathetic.

Cheating is wrong, there is never an excuse for it. If you are in an unhappy relationship LEAVE (that means before you cheat) and for the love of God don't use the "I stayed for my children" crap.

Using innocent children as an excuse as to why you didn't leave before fucking someone else is beyond sick.

Grow up.

Queenofsiburbia Mon 20-Aug-12 16:43:36
onemorechap I think the thing about a marriage or relationship that's not working is that it is incredibly sad and often painful if it ends but seriously bloody difficult to deal with if one half has been having sex with someone else, before it's ended. It's also the deceit etc that is so awful.

Yes, I agree. Why marry someone who you don't love and why treat them like shit? Oh I see. I ended it because I realised how truly, truly miserable I was. Sex was part of it but by no means all of it.

There may be reasons in some instances, and the injured party may well be a complete PITA but one person being horrible & behaving badly never justifies someone else behaving like a shit.

Looks round. Do you see anyone justifying it? I'm relating what happened with a man going to OW.

Surely it would have been morally better to end things before starting with someone else?

Probably. But then I wouldn't have known how wonderful it was to be with someone who cared for me, would hold my hand, and yes, even sleep with me for our pleasure.

Onemore chap if you had left two years after marrage for the reason u stated above you would have had even more respect. To have children in a shit marrage is irasponsable imo.

AllYoursBabooshka Mon 20-Aug-12 16:49:16
Some people who have affairs feel so guilty that they need to convince themselves that their OH is a horrible person. It's pathetic.

Indeed. And some OH are truly horrible people.

@ ormiria

Whatever the immediate causes, which may well be unrealistic expectations, I think marriages fail because there is no longer any stigma whatsoever attached to behaving disgustingly. As long as you were sincerely doing what you wanted, you are still entitled to feel great about yourself.

I find it very interesting that this is true only of marriage. A lawyer who is busted for drink-driving loses his career as a lawyer, but if he gets divorced for slapping his wife about, nothing stops him remarrying.

Likewise there is little social stigma attached to being either an OW or a philandering husband.

Ignorance plays a part, but where there are no consequences to appalling behaviour, there is severe moral hazard.

Getting married in 2012 means you can continue to do exactly what the fuck you like. The problems arise when this involves having sex with other people outside the marriage, which sadly is only ever a problem for one other person.

Look at today's thread on the poor woman whose husband wanted a BJ so he pinned her down and helped himself. He did that because he expect to get away with it without censure.

anairofhopeFORGOLD Mon 20-Aug-12 16:50:25
Onemore chap if you had left two years after marrage for the reason u stated above you would have had even more respect. To have children in a shit marrage is irasponsable imo.

Yes, amazing how deluded men who love their partners can be. Note, despite XW's best efforts I have maintained regular care and contact with my children who come and stay with me (and current DW) and I stay with them.

Men seem to be able to put different things in different boxes in their heads.

Well, I don't know about all men but this is definitely something exP said to me to explain his affair. He was able to "compartmentalise" his life so that his actions with OW were separate from his life at home with me and DS. Also separate from his friendship with OW's husband.

I'm sure that exP has told OW that we never talked, rarely had sex etc which is true but he probably didn't mention that he did fuck all to try and make it any better...

OneMoreChap

If the wives are really that bad why dont the husbands divorce them first then find another woman when they are free and single

'I did. I left her, and asked for a divorce'

But that was after you had the affair wasn't it?

It doesn't answer the question of why you didn't leave your wife first and then find another woman when you are free to do so.

It sounds as if your relationship was very unhappy but that still doesn't make it ok to cheat. End it first. Then move on.

"Indeed. And some OH are truly horrible people."

So leave, don't go shag someone else then blame your wife.

I guess my original question was worded badly - I think I was curious to know why, when you have made a decision to do something most of us think of a wrong with a capital W, you then have to pretty it up with lies or half-truths.

Onemorechap are you worried your current wife might cheat on you as she has form for sleeping with married men?

And I am aware that in some cases it isn't lies.

Everyone has a responsibility to manage their own boudaries. If a man complains that his wife overspent his money and hired a cleaner etc without agreement, he should confront her, put in place consequences and take stoeps to ensure the offence cant be repeated. He can choose to masturbate where he sees fit, as far as I am concerned, and say so, and refuse to stop. Because he is responsible for himself. He should resist control.

If OMC had managed his boundaries better, then his wife may have been obliged to change her seemingly poor behaviour. I can see the wife also had poor boundaries, but that doesnt excuse MMC from managing his own.

But then, people with poor boundaries think that the best way to manage poor behaviour is not to confront, but to deceive.

That is cowardly, OMC. You were cowardly with your wifes bulling before the affair, and when you chose to evade her controllingness by having an affair. And when you left the relationship only when you had a plan B for yourself. Selfish too.

Too wrongs dont make a right.

About half end in divorce

This really is a myth perpetuated by the liberal intelligentsia who are famous for confusing correlation with causation. It has been repeated so often it is now accepted as 'true', and it is not.

It is a result of lazy statistics. In any given year, the number of divorces are half of the number of marriages. But: the marriages are of that given year only, whereas the divorces are of all the years and decades before! It is right-on bullshit that is quoted to shape social policy, please do your MN bit to dispel this myth.

You would actually have to get all the marriages of, say, 1970 and then track those couples and see how many of them split, 1971 and so on. Impossible.

Marriage is as strong as ever - it is a basic human longing to find the one person who will love you and be there for you. The REAL divorce rate is around 11%.

(Thomas Sowell, Hoover Institution, Stanford University)

Don't believe me? Think about your group of friends. Half of them, really? In our group 2 of us are divorced. The rest of us grit out teeth and soldier on

To answer your question, OP, I guess men have to stick to the script because they are much less likely to be 'successful' if they are upfront and honest.

Script - My wife and I haven't had sex for months
Reality - My wife and I were at it again this morning

Script - My wife shows me no respect
Reality - My wife still scoops up my smelly socks and washes them for me

Script - My wife and I don't do anything together
Reality - I'm here with you when I should be showing an interest in her

Script - I'm only there for the children
Reality - My wife is watching the children while I try to get you to shag me

and so on . . .

Of course some of them will be telling the truth. They are still cheating though. And if they leave their partner for the new one how will they ever trust each other?

I have no idea why women fall for The Script though. Maybe they don't, maybe they know exactly what they're getting into as well and they just don't care who gets caught in the crossfire.

Sorry, got sidetracked but must make that point!

Chap, I know you are being given a hard time, and I can really see that your OH was difficult.

But, imagine instead of fucking someone, you had insisted on going to counselling, and after a while of being in a safe place she revealed to you that as a child she had been sexually abused, had trust and control issues she needed to work on and could you help her and be with her? I know it is a risk because some people will never be vulnerable and let down their guard, but...

Would you have abandoned her then? If she had shown her softer side and looked to you to teach her love and caring?

'I think marriages fail because there is no longer any stigma whatsoever attached to behaving disgustingly. As long as you were sincerely doing what you wanted, you are still entitled to feel great about yourself. '

Marriages 'fail' now because women no longer have to put up with their husbands shagging around. there has always been affairs- it's just that previously men could do what they wanted and didn't HAVE to leave their wives because there was fuck all the wife could do about it, except put on a brave face. She couldn't leave because of the stigma attached to divorce and single women- and often she had nowhere to go and no money of her own.

The idea that there was some golden age of fidelity is a bloody joke

Fairenuff, you have left out the real script!

script - my wife doesn't care about me
reality - I ignore her when she is trying to talk to me and she might have given up

script - I have never felt like this before
reality - I want to get my hands on that big pair of t*ts and that new c t and the forbidden excitement of it is making me on fire - it's all I can think of!

script - you are so beautiful
reality - you don't want anything and you don't talk about kids and bills

script - I love you
reality - this isn't about you, you could be anyone. I love how you make me feel.

script - I can really talk to you
reality - I love the admiration of me reflected in your eyes

script - (to devastated wife) I never loved her, she meant nothing
reality - it was all about me

It seems to be widely thought that all these men cheat and that the OW is a nobody, of course the men love their wives more, the OW means nothing blah blah blah. Simply not true in all cases. Some men and women find someone else who they want to be with more than their wives/husbands.

It's quite naive to think that the man has to lie in the bed he has made for himself. Sometimes that's all he wants and he is more than happy to.

Onemorechap

"Surely it would have been morally better to end things before starting with someone else?"

Probably. But then I wouldn't have known how wonderful it was to be with someone who cared for me, would hold my hand, and yes, even sleep with me for our pleasure. '

Probably? Probably?

No no no, you had a secret affair before leaving your wife. That is wrong. You did the wrong thing and you lied about it. There is no 'probably' about it. The fact that it worked out well for you is not how you judge the difference between right and wrong.

The couples I've known where there have been affairs, I'd say it's been about a 50-50 split on the man or woman who've had the affair.

It isn't always the husband is it?

And the reasons have been similar, growing apart, lack of sex, boredom.