Chutney

[LouP19]

Where do I go? My thread has gone?!!

Bit upset by the soap opera comments, but understand it probably came out wrong. I like a quiet life. I like reading. I like staying in. I like cats. I like gardening and looking at stuff in Dunelm mill. This is NOT me at all.

Is there a way to check whether this is a genuine letter from a legitimate counseling service?

Given his previous form drawing up an itinerary of his supposed work trip with his boss, could he have invented this as a way to get into the house?

Just thinking about what others have said about the way counseling services usually work.

Please be careful! He does sound very unhinged and possibly dangerous!

Delurking to second what TheDreadedFoosa has said. I'm worried that, taken together, all the 'you might never conceive again' and 'keep the baby' posts add up to an awful lot of pressure. - even if that's not the intention.

The BPAS/Marie Stopes websites have good sections for teenagers giving useful things to think about to help clarify things in your mind. Not saying you're a teen OP but your situation is such a difficult one.

Lou, can I suggest this for the text if you must send one ?

Chutneywanker, I am texting to inform you that my solicitors are Msssrs Markby, Markby and Markby of 9 The High Street, Upper Piccalilly, Branstonshire. Any future communication will be made through them. I will not be attending the counselling session. I have redirected your mail to the address you provided. Please do not attempt to contact me via this phone as of 00:00 tomorrow the number will no longer be in use. Have a nice life

Yes, he couldn't have turned out to be an utter knob at a worse time, I think is more the point.

Yes, OhDearNigel's text is good.

OhDearNigel hit the nail on the head.

Thinking of you this dreary Aussie morning Lou xx

Hi Lou

So sorry about your situation.

It occurs to me that it might be better if you find a counsellor yourself and arrange a session for you both (or just you) to attend.

Make sure they are BACP and UKCP registered.

Of course if you like the look of whoever your husband has chosen then go with them (if you want to) but if he's serious about wanting to have counselling together then he shouldn't mind if it's someone YOU'VE chosen!

Thinking of you.

I think 20weeks has made a good point gently.

Lou, I terminated a pregnancy when I was 25 because I just didn't feel ready. I have never regretted that and it was absolutely the right think for me at the time. BUT I was young enough to have more children.

You say you want the Family. Well you can always find another guy and the right man will love your child. But given how hard it was to get pregnant and your age you may very well not be able to have another baby.

Even if you get over dickhead in six months and meet someone else I assume you'd want to get to know him for a while before trying to conceive with him. That would take you to 38 or older and your chances of having a baby then are so much less.

I'm sorry to be so blunt but it's a fact. This baby might be your only chance to have a family - and it doesn't have to be a family that includes wanker either.

How would you feel if you terminated this pregnancy and couldn't get pregnant again? Would you be happy to live with that? I can't think what I would do in your position and as I say I did NOT at all regret my termination. But I wonder how much that is down to the fact that I now have 2 beautiful kids.

I know this may sound bizarre too and i will probably get flamed but I was betrayed and abandoned too by my ex and I think in some small part of my mind I wanted my babies because then I would never be alone or abandoned in that complete way again. I am an only child with little family and I forsaw a time where my parents were gone and if I ever got betrayed and left again I would have no one but my cats in my twilight years. That scared the shit out of me.

Hard work as my kids are they give so much light love and fun and they are my blood, my family and always will be. I've enlarged the circle of care and love in my life by having them which was always the idea. If their dad leaves me or vice versa I will have them to cuddle to love to cherish. A husband is (sometimes necessarily) replaceable. Children not so easily.

I'm sorry if this is too close to the bone for you. I'm just sharing my own experiences and feelings to give you perspective. You must do whatever is right for YOU - but for both your long term and short term happiness. You are such a great person, based on your writings here, I'm completely sure everyone you care about will stand by you and support you and live you over the next months and years no matter what happens in your life.

I found one of the most amazing parts of going through this kind is trauma is findig out just how much people care and how many are there for you. It's something you never forget.

Perhaps we should leave the pregnancy talk and decision making to Lou?

I'm sure she's stressed enough.

Hi LouP,

You are doing so very well. It may not seem it but believe me you are. When I was in a similar position 14 years ago I was literally suicidal, saved by a passerby and my awesome gp, but thats a totally different thread.

As for having a baby holding you back and stopping you meeting anyone else;
When I was single in my 30's I was not put off a female if she had kids, most men understand that at your age you often come as a package and that was not a problem for me... as it turned out when I eventually met my future DW she didnt want or like children much but was happy to take me and my 2dc as a package (thankfully)

Any man who doesnt want to take you on as a whole isnt worth having.

You will find happiness. It may not seem like it at the moment but you will just when you least expect it. In the mean time before you find mr right, you can have a lot of fun with all the mr possibilitys.

Keep calm and eat chocolate.

You are an inspiration to us all.

A very late de-lurker, adding my support to you, Lou. I can hardly add to everyone's opinions of your "lovely" husband as it's all been said.

I am however concerned at the not-so-subtle exhortations on here to "have the baby, have the baby, babies are lovely, have the baby". The OP has made it more than clear that she wants (or wanted) a family but is no longer sure to continue with the pregnancy as she would be tied to this twat of a man for years and years. Terminating a pregnancy is not something any women would undertake lightly, as we all know.

I'm just not sure how it helps to keep pro-baby baby message to the OP (someone said up-thread that it borders on the manipulative and I agree).

Lou - hope you're OK. Please don't go to counselling with him.

Gah, the solicitor is bloody right isn't she, about antagonising him and the mortgage.

Are you still planning on seeking a second legal opinion by the way? Think that would be a good idea (though appreciate you've been overtaken by events).

If you stick the counselling forms in the internal mail that at least forestalls ghe house visit, though it still puts off the moment when you pull out ( assuming that is still the plan).

Re: the house. I don't want you to start going through figures on the internet, but is keeping it on your salary possible with some extra income and some living on soup, or is it an impossible dream, do you think? What about the lodgers idea? Postgrad students tend to make considerate quiet lodgers (I know, I am one ). Or is sharing your space just not appealing at all.

I get ridiculously attached to bricks and mortar myself, I totally understand how you feel, and in a way I think it is positive that you are feeling fierce about the house - to begin with you saw it as the place which had been violated. Is there anything we can do/suggest/look up/work out for you that would help you plan how to keep it?

Dear LouP

Just a simple message of support from someone who checks in every day to see how you're doing.

Amongst all the great advice you're getting, do try to zone out the emotive baby-talk, however well meant it all is. Your decision and yours alone, and with RL support you will make the right choice.

Goodness knows you have been through enough. Hang on, and know that for everyone who voices their support on here or in RL, there must be scores more who have not spoken up but are also right behind you.

Good morning LouP. This is the first time I have posted on your thread, but I have read every single one of your posts over your two threads. The only time I have read with such shock that someone could behave like that was when UnlikelyAmazonian first posted when her cunt of an ex left.

What strikes me is that your H is trying to appear to behave in such a logical, considerate way now, when his actions preceding this have been anything but. To strip your home of every last bit of his existence there is very extreme behaviour to say the least. But he still tries to dangle a carrot stick more like of reconciling. The only reason why I can think of - which has been said loads of times on here - is because he needs to appear to the outside world as the good guy, that it wasn't his fault that the marriage ended. But that is so at odds with his actual actions. It's very odd and very, very scary. You unfortunately are not married to a rational, reasonable man.

Please do not go to the counselling. I cannot see how it will benefit you. Counselling might, but not with Chutneycunt. It will be harmful to you, and he will try to manipulate both you and the counsellor, leaving you feeling even more frustrated and angry. Really, at the moment the only person you need to concentrate is you, to sort out all the crap you have been landed with, to be able to function in your day-to-day life and to start to mend after the years of emotional abuse you have had at the hands of this man.

Please everyone, lay off the advice and opinions about LouP's pregnancy. She seems a pretty intelligent woman to me, who will know all of what you have said. This is one decision only she can make and really no-one should try and influence her one way or the other.

LouP, you have been amazing. Keep going, one day, one hour at a time. You will get there - without this man - I promise you.

Much as others are trying to sugar-coat things (and I know they're being nice and sharing their stories to make sure this is YOUR decision alone), you're seeing things very clearly. You WILL be 'stuck at home with a baby', at least for a while. And he will be in your life, probably continuing to make it hell, for another 20 years or so. You can try to limit his involvement, but chances are he'd get visitation rights, weekends, holidays, every other Christmas, etc, and you'd be reliant on him for maintenance and possibly the roof over your head.

Having a baby will also limit your opportunities to immediately become financially self-sufficient via a FT job and yes, it will affect how easy or possible it is to meet someone else and move on with your life. There will be no clean break if you have his child.

OTOH, this could be your one chance to become a mother.

Sorry, just read that back and realise it sounds very cold and clinical and it wasn't meant to, at all. I also have no agenda to push re: abortion, which I'm actually not a fan of, at all, unless the circumstances are dire.

Please don't rush to make a decision - you have plenty of time to mull over all the options.

Delurking (and I've read all of both threads too) just to say: you worry that if you decided to keep the baby, you would blame it for having its father's genes and thus fuck it up. I am not posting to tell you whether or not you should keep it, because as others have said that's your decision to make, but to say that you should give yourself more credit than that. I am quite sure that anyone as intelligent and thoughtful as you are would be able to love a child for itself - if you did actually end up with a baby, I think you would find maternal feelings were far, far more powerful than the understandable feelings of revenge you are experiencing now, and I am sure you would be well able to be a good parent. Not to say that you should feel you should take that route, but just saying that if you choose to, you should trust yourself to do it well (or as well as any of us ever do, anyway). Good luck with whatever you do.

Thanks for everyone's comments. Woke up at 5am, it just hits me like a pain in my chest, can't describe how hard and solid it feels. And at the moment I'm not really able to cry, I just have this rock in my chest that I just want to lift off and throw away.

I've read everyone's comments about keeping the baby and appreciate what you have all said. Right now this feels like more of a pressing decision than what I'm going to do about him and solicitors and filing for divorce. I have got another provisional appointment with a solicitor on Tuesday afternoon, but that is after the hospital scan and counselling, and I'm not sure if I can cope with both of them on the same day.

I still can't believe what he's done and HOW he's done it. Waking up in the middle of the night and mornings are worse because the reality slowly sinks in again. And I just want him to be there, so I can talk to him about what the fuck is going on. Why is he going to counselling? Why did he lie to me about Italy? Where is he living now?

Everytime I look at the cats I want to cry, because I'm so worried about losing them. We rescued them last year after they'd been in the shelter for 7 months (the longest residents) and I could not face the possibility of having to let them go. I could never forgive myself. They couldn't live at my parents because they've got a dog, most rental properties don't let you take cats. They're both very nervous and anxious and have only really settled in during the last few months, plus they only really trust me. I just don't want to fuck up their lives and again it would feel like something else I may have to lose.

I'm crying now, may be that's a good thing. Going to work today, driving in on my own, and then my Mum is coming round this evening to help me with some housework. Cousin coming to spend the day with me tomorrow as I've booked the day off as leave.

Thank you all, you're helping weigh up all my options. I just feel in complete pieces now. All my clarity of last weekend has gone.

Oh Lou it is normal to feel in pieces. You have been badly hurt and betrayed and you have to adjust to a new kind of life. You have a lot to grieve, big decisions to make and it has only been a week!
The clarity will come back. Don't feel bad about having huge feelings - it is huge stuff to deal with.
Fingers crossed you can come to a legal/financial/ domestic solution that continues the cats with a safe home.

Lou - just a thought, but I've been in a similar situation in the past, and I took the termination route (partially my choice, partially under pressure of my awful ex) I'd also suffered miscarriages and while I think it was the right thing to do at the time I often wondered if I had ruined my one chance of having a family, I eventually (completely by surprise - was on the pill) fell pregnant a few years later, having met the man of my dreams, and now have the lovely family I always wanted.

If you want to talk to someone who can give you the good the bad and the ugly on terminations, please PM me. x

Morning Lou, big hug.
Your being very brave about going to work, you should be so proud of yourself.
Before I moved back in with my folks I panicked about my dog terribly, he's my best friend without him I don't know what would have happened.
Please don't worry about the cats, you can find places to take them with you. I did before I moved home. With my ex we worked long and hard to find somewhere we could have him.
HA do take cats, and most landlords prefer cats to dogs remember. Please don't panic.

I personally wouldn't choose to proceed with a pregnancy had I been in your position LouP. I say this only to provide 'balance' to all other posts to the contrary. Juneau's points raised, resonated with me more than any others.

Your decision obviously. Sorry you are in such a difficult position. My heart aches for you. XxxX

Im so sorry Lou,

I found out something devastating in January of this year, completely different to this but it absolutely destroyed my world, every morning, I'd wake up feeling exactly as you describe.

For a month I couldn't breathe, couldnt eat, couldnt sleep.

The pain was intense and I never, ever thought I would feel any happiness again.

Although the terrible thing is still with us, I have learned to live with it, on my birthday a few days ago, for the first time in 8 months, I actually felt happiness for the first time, it shocked the hell out of my.

You will get there too, I promise.xxx

Re solicitor, I know you want things resolved, but a few weeks isnt going to make any difference -if you need time to think about the baby first.

Baby baby steps will get you there.

What is ttc? And am I right that this pregnancy is a natural conception even though they have had some IVF cycles? (Just for my own education). Listen everyone, I don't think that we should talk about this, firstly because it is early days and secondly we should not impose our beliefs on someone in such shock.

LouP I think Garlic has hit the nail on the head. This is the best advice you have got all day:

I do think he manipulated you into a position of financial dependence, which is biting you now. I agree it would be good to keep the house as you love it and have fab neighbours - what will it take to do that? If you went full-time, got a lodger and changed to a mortgage with lower repayments, could you do it?

When you said: he doesn't have much of a relationship/they thing he is the golden bollocks - hmmmmmmmmm! Read up about narcissism when you can. Narcissists are MADE, not born. Good parenting (reassuring a child about their inherent worth instead of 'being someone', allowing consequences, pulling up on selfishness) is what matures a child towards thinking of others. So please don't think your child comes from 'bad genes'. This is a family dysfunction/parenting thing.

Another thing re Garlic's advice: I don't know what academic establishment you are at, but if it is noted, you can join something like ownersdirect where people rent your house out for a week whilst you move to parents. They live in your house and though it is their own and I hear behave very well. In some counties you make a tidy sum.

Lou, I've been reading your threads and I can't believe what's happened to you. What a godawful mess.

I really don't think you should attempt to do the solicitors on the same day as the hospital. The divorce, frankly, is a trivial matter compared to decided what to do with regards to your pregnancy and I would not put the stress on yourself right now. You would be better spending the time accessing all the advisory services and counselling which will help you make the right decision for you about the pregnancy. This is much more time critical than sorting out the divorce.

I have allowed cats in my rental property before, so don't rule it out. The agents bunged on some extra conditions about the cat being declawed (it already was - and this was a second floor flat, I would never have insisted on this for an outdoor cat as it would be highly cruel) and a bit extra on the deposit.