Turning Tavern IV - Down Bi the riverside, near the well of loneliness...

[NotForProfit]

Hi all,

thought i'd be proactive and start a new thread for the wenches of the turning tavern as the old thread's pretty much full...

for anyone new to this, it's a thread for women suddenly finding themselves attracted to another woman, so grab a glass of something intoxicating, pull up a chair by the fireside and we'll try to help one another deal with the elation, confusion and heartache of rediscovering your sexuality.

thanks outmy, I do need moral support as I'm very down about the whole thing at times. Nothing new since my last few posts, as I said I will see how it goes on saturday - if we are alone and there is right moment i will try to talk to her, of not will leave a note when I leave. I do have wobbles when i think i just won;t do it as rejection will be too painful, but generally I'm planning to. Just drafting the leeter in my head now. You never know though, she may put me off in some way from doing this, in which case i will really have to just forget it and move on, as can't go on like this. I feel very lonely on some days, so at least if she's not interested i will start going out and looking for a relationship elsewhere. Been comcentrating on work this week, but I do feel that my personal life is on a sad standstill.

*will give her a note when i leave

how are you? hopefully not looking at her photos as much!

outmy, you see I did say that you should ask your teacher friends - I as pretty sure that in a small town they can well know her (or via someone). This is exactly why i don't like fb - all the rubbish! do people think they are THAT interesting that others want to read mimute detail of their day/tastes etc?
I think you manage to stay in limbo for so long due to being preoccupied with dc, but I just can't anymore as i do feel like a want a partner, though I'm also working on being open to more social life in the new place (slow progress, but at least couple of neighbours are good). I'm just sad about the whole thing because she doesn't feel like helping me a bit with being more forthcoming. I mean she is moire responsive than she was and it took many months, how lof if ever could it take that she actually initiates something even socially? I just think she is not interested, not in reality, even if there is some attraction. And waiting for a rejection soon is no fun! I find it very depressing that I'm the only one making real efforts. Just makes you feel unloveable (even though rationally, it's not personal if she wouldn't consider women).

*you managed

*like i want

yes outmy, you are reading my mind - I thought the same that if I feel too stressed or discouraged by her vibes tomorrow I don't HAVE to do it, and if the vibes aer clearly discouraging then that's it, determined to make a decision to move on. She can always initiate something as she knows where i am and we will continue meeting. If hte vibes aer good I will then leave a note. In either case I've decided to make my decision this weekend and stick to it, though while I'm single I won't be closed off to her if she does something later.
No, I know she can be caring - she definitely likes me and is quite warm overall, and also i can see how loving she is with her grown dc, it's just in a r-ship/intimate sense I feel unloved by her purely as she is not initiating or helping me out with moving further. As I said, I respect that she may have strong reasons which kills her confidence in te future of all this, especially the age gap. She never promised me anything, has she. But when you feel like this and the person is not reciiprocating it's usual to feeel unloved onm THAT level (or to that deeper degree). I'm sure if she did go inti r-ship with me (made that decision) she woiuld not be closed off and then yes she could make me happy, potential definitely there if she had strong feelings. Yes, I was married before and in r-ships and quite used to men I wanted falling in love (not all but a number),so the fact that she hasn't makes it more of a blow - especiallly as my feelings for her aer more intense than to most (if not all) men in the past. thanks for the support outmy, really appreciate it.
Yes I know people write all the rubbish on twotter and fb but do you think anyone reads it, unless they are a hopeful lovestruck person, who wants to know all their taste so that it's easier to win them over OR be at hte same places to engineer meetings? You could have used it to your advantage in early stages if your wiq was telling all what she was doing at w/ends, but even though t's ok for a short while, I don't see how many people can keep reading this about all their friends etc!?
It's great you weened yourself off her page. even if you look occasionally it's not too bad if you have to, just don't be gluedto it , best to go cold turkey if yo can though! hope you will hae more time to do things soon?

thank you outmy. You'd make a great friend to anyone! (probably your rl friends already say this).
I meant not so much dating but any other activities you may enjoy, socially, or new exercise, just to speed the healing. I find exercise even gentle helps to stabilise in emotional sense, also maybe little trips out with dc to other local towns/parks, it's also getting away from familiar routine that helps.
I'm not feeling anxious today so it should be all fine. Best to make these decisions when calm, good that you advised not to put pressure on myself, as I was really doing that. I was thinking similar but if someone says 'that doesn't make you a coward (not doing it) ' helps, as you can get down on yoursekf for lacking courage. But annyway I will still decidethis weekend, just try to chill and sense what's hte right thing to do, and then will stick to it. I'm seeing a friend today before this so that will distract me in a good way too. I may not report until tomorrow eve though as will be travelling a bit tomorrow without laptop.

Just checking-in to see if you have posted, Likea. Very much hoping that your WIQ's vibes allowed you to either talk or leave that note. I'm sure another week of "obsessing" has added to your resolve to get this out in the open.

NotFor- all quiet with you?

Outmy - good on you for dropping the fb stalk!! Being distracted by real needs like children is always a good thing and you know what they say...when you least expect it.....

All good here. WIQ went out on a date Saturday in the big smoke. Major wobbles from her DH and a phone call early evening to interupt us. But as we said we've just got to nurse our men through these situations and keep telling them that neither should be threatened by our relationship with our WIQ. My DH was great; still up when I got home and able to chat about what a pleasant evening I had. It was so lovely to have a few hours together without having to be somewhere else or attend to DCs needs. We perused the shops, found a funky bar with a great table away from prying eyes, drank a couple of cocktails, chatted and took in a film. Then it was home by 11pm. Needless to say we did think about more cocktails and taking a hotel room but no!

that. She obv has a full life and what with the drinking as well I just can't get hHappytit, glad to hear that at least one person on this thread had an actual date with wiq! even a simple first step like htat is just not happening for most of us here, though I think NotFor may have one soon with CW if she knows what's good for her . Still how elusive is htat first date! HappyT, do you think wiq is as strong and secure with her r-ship as you are, and won't go all mushy? did you decide to go on that trip with the dc soon?

outmy, well, nothing dramatic or positive. It all got to the wrong start yesterday as she wasn't alone in the flat. She took some person in to stay over the weekend who is not a friend, but some distant acquintance of a friend/relative, KNOWING that this saturday was a rare chance when we could be on our own for half a day (incl evening). While i was there she never even spoke to this person who stayed on the phone in their room etc - so what i mean she had no reason to invite them and could ve easily not have done so, you may think maybe it was for the money, but she's not at all desperate and they were to stay just a couple of days. This is so obviously NOT the behavoiut of a woman who is interesed or even curious in developing something personal with me! this is, remember, after my nice card and warm reaction to it, and rare chance when no dc visiting and she was in all eve - honestly my eyes were finally opened to the fact that she is eihter afraid or just not inclined towards women at all and doesn't want anything to happen. We didn't have a good timing like htis for a couple of months now and i thought that she would def take the chance if there was anything, even if just to encourage me to say something when no one is there (I wasn't expectong anything actually happening yet). To add to this she was out of it after a liquid lunch - again if she was waiting for me, she wouldn't have done it, she wasn't drunk as she had a nap but was distracted and obv not sharp. Looks like she is a bit addicted as she drinks something every day, though I could live with it as it's not much, still if i were her P I'd worry about these binges on w/ends (for her sake). I thought ok, I won't be doing anything, just will be around while doing stuff on computer, maybe she will try and approach me. She was alittle nice first by giving me a small gift (from her travels, wasn't specifically bought for me but she felt maybe as a tahnk you for b-day gift). Then, would ou believe it, there was another 'lesbian tea' comment - as in, or and i have some of those as friends stayed and left them (gree tea) even though i don;t like it so i declined. The thing is this was said matter of fact without looking at me just par of conversation, i said I liked only some types but not green and just ignored it, but it was honestly not been said as a hint, or if it was then it was very insensitive (almost as if she thought i may be gay but nothingto do with her, OR she genuinely still has no idea in which case it's clear as day that she has no feelings for women WHATSOEVER as if she felt anything at all she wouldn't use it flippantly or without watchig my reaction etc). So the decision now is to leve it as i said, felt very depressed about it most of today, slightly calmer now. I will settle for just liking each other as i have no choice, and i will have to become happy with er to open up to me even as a friend - she was worse than usual by the end of out time there, amost demonstratively misunderstanding small comments i as saying (jst small talk) and making a face 'what do you mean by that' - we had MUCH nicer closer moments before but she's gone very distant by te end this time, almost like 'i don't understand the word you saying'which I found weird and upsetting, possibly this was the hangover. She was sytill nice overall but ther was no rapport like we had at times. I must say i was not hugely positive and not gusjy like i was at times, just thought I'd retreat a bit but i was still open to her approaches if she was doing them, but I just can't go on with this. I'm not seeing her now for two weeks and next time will be brief, so I will now just work on accepting she is either too closed off (and only feels something flletingly) or she actually has no interest in women at all which is easier to accept. Btw my card was the most romantic of ALL she got (they aer all displayed so i looked) even though mine is just one sentence. The man sent her one but it's not eve nromantic just friendly sounding. If after that she doesn't want to even offer me a glass of wine and have a chat, and after ALL the hints and efforts I've done, then it realy is hopeless. You know, outmy you weren't sure whether you wre gay but when your wiq sent you signals you wanted to know and acted on it eventually so I don't believe for a minute telling my wiq wd make her feel what she doesn't. This would work witha gay woman who is trained not to assume anything with straight ones, but she is not gay and more to the point she is not a passive personality, she initiates lots in persona life from what i know and i gave her PLENTY of clues to at least try and chat with me over wine if ther ewas any inkling. She know i madea gesture on her b-day, and still doesn't invite any closeness. Sorry for a ridiculously long post but could as well get it al out. Sorry that it's so long but nothing exciting at that!

soory i was copying the post and somehow part of sentence got in front , it should start with Happytit..)

sorry - jeez!

I meant I don't have a choice of more than just liking each other, obviously I do have choice not to see her at all, but I don't want this at this now, not ready to drop contact now, we'll see how i feeel in a while. If it works I hope the feelings will just cool. They already sort of cooled a bit but at the moment with a very depressing feel to it.

there is another chunk of text missing in hte middle, no idea how that happened, but hopefully you get the gist!

ah right, that missing bit after 'will have to become happy with' should be followed by the bit that got pasted in front of the post: 'that'.
sorry for dripping, tired!

Ok so just found this thread:

I have always been Bi - am happily married now to a man and have a wonderful DS. DH loves the fact I am Bi (I think it's because he thinks he might get a threesome one day if he asks nicely! ) and I've honestly never felt confused, sad or anything about it, well apart from the fact that almost all the women, both RL and celebrity that I fancy are straight! Being Bi is the best and I always have fun watching tv with either DH or my Dad and 'arguing' over who will get which woman and them saying 'hey its ok for you as you can have men too don't steal our totty as well!'

Celeb women I like include:
Simone Lahbib (Bad Girls, Wire in the blood) - Sexiest woman on the planet fact!
Mandana Jones (Bad Girls) - joint sexiest woman on the planet! fact!
Sue Perkins (Comiedienne) - oh those lush legs!
Jo Frost (Supernanny) - she could manhandle me over to the 'naughty step' any day.

There are more but those are my top few - I'm not so into your typical supermodel type!

Ladies love your 'Bi-ness' and embrace it. I always describe it as 'keeping my options open!
Yes I've been lucky to be so comfortable about my sexuality and have such support from family and friends - I've never, and dont 'come out' to anyone, I just don't hide the fact I'm Bi either. My parents know simply because I've always been comfortable, for instance, watching a programme and saying stuff like "Ooh Jim and Gemma make a nice couple, I wouldn't kick either of them outta bed!"

Ok so hope it's ok for me to join you ladies as I'm so comfy here in 'Bi-ness' but would be great if I can!

(btw sorry if this is rambling.... I've had a busy day out and am really tired but can't be bothered to go to bed yet so appogies if my post makes no sense and/or is full of typos!)

hi outmy, what you said in your last post is exactly how i feel too, about still thinking she feels something but as there is zero encouragenent I just ran out of steam to be making efforts and making steps, I just feel 'spent'. Iwouldn't say I'm stunned as you said earlier but definitely a bit lost and at times feel depressed but i had a bad feeling for a while so it's not a shock), just so depressing when yo uput your time and hopes and energy and nothing really to show for it, also all the feelings you've put into someone aer suddenly just in te air with nowhere for them to go just have to wither, very sad really but it does happen to most people at some point.
I really wouldn't call her rude generally speaking - there were a fe moments of that, but she was also very caring/thoughtful in her actions, and she did chat to me at times with a lot of eye contact and it was genuine. It's just - I don't want WHAT it is - but ther is a bloody barrier which she doesn't want to move. Either she is just quite cold by nature as i said as tbf she isn't VERY close to anyone in her life now, she has a couple of close friends to whom she is very nice on the phone etc but they don't meet/chat that often, ther are men but again noone she is in daily (or almost) comtact with, sam with dc. Maybe she prefers to keep everyone at a distance and his is not rude it's just somene's nature - I'm a lot like that myself ironically UNLESS I'm in love. I do need a copule of friends but wouldn't need more than a weekly contact. She seems to rotate a number of people and activities and does go out a lot but it's all very 'set'. Again maybe at her age it's usual and it's not rude of her to stick to her existing life. BUT it is quite cool and standoffish , what she does. She maybe simply very snobbish secretly, and even though she is VERY polite and nice on the surface to people (I've seen her with lots of different non-close people) and she is liked by them, she just doesn't want anyone closer unless they aer part of her quite small social group, who really do seem to be of a similar social type, and similar age too! I did think that Saturday could be a step forward, as even if before she wasn't inviting me for a chat due to being cautious, she had a perfect chance to offer me a glass as it was her b-day last week and because i left her a present/card, it made sense to offer a celebratory dribk andthen see whether it leads to any closer talk. Even though there was this gust around, she could have offered it to me as mainly the guest wasn't even out of the room - in fact if she was worried aboyt me getting drubk and making a pass, it was perfect as I wouldn't go too far with someone around.
The lesbian tea thing was actually rude if she meant that i was gay - but i can't assume htis. Ok, even if she (miraculously!) never even wondered about me, surely she could have offered that drink as a friendly gesture?! And really she is wordly enough and what with the vibes when she was drunk I don't think she never wondered even if didn't know for sure. So wtf was that comment about? if she wanted to raise the sunject in this awkward for me way, then why not continue the theme somehow? Not sure what you meant that she could have let me down gently if we talked about it instead of dropping hints/being rude - you mean she should have started that talk? as obvioulsly i never did, yes it would be nice if she did but i couldn't just expect it. I would have started the talk if she was kinder to me and offered something as to a friend (or potentoial friend) - THEN I could ve told her at the right moment and knew that if she let me diwn gently she was still open to friendship. But as i say, she just doesn'y wat to get closer as a friend. It;s true that none of her friendsaer my age, they aer all 15-20yrs older, and possibly she is the type who does everything 'correctly' in social sense and just isn't open minded - you can't blame someone if that's hteir mindset but what a bloddy shame. You do feel rejected even when not personal, just for he fact that you wre not given a chance. I invited her a couple of times to exhibitions as you remember and that also met a poite refusal, even though she did say she would go in future if the thing interests her more. I'll pM you outmy with another info.