Turning Tavern IV - Down Bi the riverside, near the well of loneliness...

[NotForProfit]

Hi all,

thought i'd be proactive and start a new thread for the wenches of the turning tavern as the old thread's pretty much full...

for anyone new to this, it's a thread for women suddenly finding themselves attracted to another woman, so grab a glass of something intoxicating, pull up a chair by the fireside and we'll try to help one another deal with the elation, confusion and heartache of rediscovering your sexuality.

OMG, Likea please tell me you deleted this page on her internet history!! oh god, that'd be awful if not. How come you're spending so much time together anyhow? You must be fairly close to her already? I've just realised i'm not entirely sure how you met, or what your relationship to one another is at present. I know you said she helped you out during difficult circumstances. if the details would give u away don't worry about it.

Didn't see CW today. not to worry... we do bump into each other fairly regularly anyway so i'll just chill out about it and see what happens.

Outmy - i'm sorry you're feeling crap about it all. I hope in time not seeing her every day will begin to have a restorative effect on how you feel. I'm new to this, but definitely feel worse again after I have contact with WIQ.

Hello everyone I'm one of the old timers from the early tavern days. Haven't been around much recently but finally got a chance to catch up with developments, good and bad.
Outmy - sorry to hear about your WIQ and how unfriendly she's been towards you. Maybe she found it all too awkward and self-concious making at school. My guess is she's still intrigued by you (still staring). Is there any chance of you bumping into her in your n'hood and swapping numbers? In the meantime, I'd try and focus on finding another WIQ. You need a healthy distraction!
Likea - hello. Glad to hear it still sounds like there's a possibility with your WIQ although sounds like she blows hot and cold, depending on her mood. Very hard for you to read.
NotFor - great you have option 2! CW sounds more promising. Didn't like the fact WIQ1 was chatting about you behind your back and bragging about her fan club. Hope that hasn't made life awkward at work. Good your DH is so accepting of your crushes.
Emma - look forward to hearing more about your WIQ and any developments.
My situation has been very hard at times and quite emotionally exhausting. All well with GF but ex-H made sure people got to know about it so I've had all sorts of reactions from family and friends. My mother intimated she is disgusted and traumatised on behalf of my DCs. Still wish it was more acceptable in society in general. I have to say that even a couple of years down the line, I still don't consider myself a lesbian. I'm probably 10/90 in favour of men but then for me it's all about the person and this is the first woman I have had a r-ship with but is amazing how two women relate to each other. From my limited experience no stone is left unturned. This means you really get to know them very well on every level, particularly emotionally and everything gets analysed carefully. You only have to read this thread to see how analytical women are. I can't imagine men getting into the nitty gritty of every nuance of a woman and her behaviour. Likea - stop worrying about the sex side of things as I knew nothing when this all started and with chemistry, you soon figure it out!

not gin !

Or maybe gin would help!

Hi Outmy - I haven't talked to the DCs yet although worried someone might 'accidentally' blurt something out and get there before me. Will have to cross that bridge when I come to it. Agree about people thinking because you like women, somehow you suddenly like ALL women. It's ridiculous really as you don't fancy every single man you meet. Keep that barge pole handy

Loveis - hiya! yes, CW feels promising but i'll have to be patient now the summer hols have started... funny how i was bumping into her outside school hours all the time before i started to register the attention she gives me- those were the days! Have decided my relationship with WIQ1 will be nothing but civil, professional and distant from now on. much simpler.

Do tell me a bit more about your story - how did you and GF start out together for example? How did things develop? I'm so curious about how

sorry, posted without finishing what i was saying!

Meant to say 'I'm so curious about how a mutual crush could progress into something more.'

Hello Outmy and Notfor - I met my gf through a mutual friend and we got to know each other over 6 months or so. We had an instant connection and were mutually intrigued by each other. She was openly bi whereas I had never entertained the idea of kissing or more with a woman. EVER. I suppose we totally clicked so it didn't feel weird or alien when things finally took off. It felt totally natural and impossible to stop the feelings. It is extremely intense, much more so than any r-ship I've had with a man. I always say she is the only one as I am not sure I am properly 'turned'. For me it's about the person and the chemistry you have rather than the gender. I always think women's sexuality is more fluid and understand this very much now! It is easier to get emotional depth with a woman but be warned if you go in with the intention of just having a fling, don't be surprised if your feelings have other plans!

I do know roughly where she lives (in the road behind my house!) i'm not sure which house is hers, which is probably just as well. We do tend to bump into each other fairly organically most weeks, at the park etc, outside of the school run, so I don't think i need to engineer too much. I do sometimes wonder if she can see my bedroom window from her house though . Like in 'American Beauty'. but with two thirtysomething women...

I know what you mean, as Likea hasn't reported back for a day or so she's probably just having a great holiday but part of me is wondering if she's had some big showdown with WIQ about the thread! unlikely, i know.

Loveis- that's really interesting. Thanks for that. I already get what you mean about the intensity (even though i've yet to progress past eye-contact with either WIQ). I think my big 'confession' (if you can call it that) towards WIQ1 came about mainly because of how quickly my crush turned from physical to emotional.

it's hard even now to put it back in the box, but I suppose as the whole thing only started just over a month ago, perhaps that's not surprising. Without getting a grip on myself, I can see I would continue to fall for her in this unreciprocated way, and I don't like the way it makes me feel (powerless). I know exactly what you mean about falling for the whole person rather than the genitals!

With CW it feels like it could be more equal, although far too early to tell! Was it sparks and fireworks for you and GF from the word go or did you expect initially to be platonic?

You're bound to bump into CW if you live in parallel streets. With my gf it was sparks more than fireworks in the beginning but what was really noticeable was the nonstop communication. Now it's full blown Olympic fireworks. She is my soul mate and I've never felt this close to anyone.

wow, that sounds amazing. the thing which gets me is, with WIQ1 I was always unecumbered by small children, so the ability to actually have a conversation was there. and dammit, i felt like i just wanted to go on opening up and having her open up to me. never felt as though a conversation was properly 'finished', i just wanted to go on and on getting to know her... and now i know i can't do that.

with WIQ2, opportunities for conversation are always bookended by us both looking out for our small children who are invariably attempting to run under buses... so difficult to really communicate in words. In other ways we communicate rather a lot...

i know, it is odd that i don't know which house by now! I think i've been deliberately not asking that question in case it leads to me standing starkers at my bedroom window with the lights on!

Hello Taverners!

I haven't been here in a while, and thought it was time for an update. Just been catching up with what's going on with the various WIQs and CW. I'll try and frequent the thread more often now.

Since WIQ went away at the start of June, and I confessed that I loved her, we spent the whole 6 weeks of her holiday in constant touch, through email, Skype, texting and talking. It was lovely. She sent me photos of everything she'd been doing, and despite missing her terribly, I was delighted by how much she kept in touch.

She returned on Wednesday last week, and invited me to her house as soon as she got back. I went over with flowers and a bag of stuff I'd collected for her while she was away. It was so good to see her. We hugged for ages, and I took her face in my hands and kissed her cheeks. We spent the whole evening together chatting, and again on Thursday, and on Friday.

Friday night, things took a new turn. I had French braided my hair, and she wanted me to do hers too. She has the most amazing hair - I've always loved it, so this was like some sort of dream come true for me. I was quite drunk (she makes really strong drinks) but she was only drinking herbal tea. I was on the sofa, and she sat down on the floor infront of me between my knees. I started playing with her hair, and stroking her neck and shoulders. She was talking, but every time I touched her skin, she stopped talking and kind of held her breath. We spent about an hour doing that, then I decided it was time to leave because I was way too drunk.

I went over on Saturday morning, and straight away she asked me to braid her hair again. Her maid was there cleaning, so we went into her bedroom and she closed the doors. We sat on her bed and I played with her hair for ages. We spent the day listening to opera and talking, then I helped her get ready for a concert she was going to. She got completely undressed in front of me as we were choosing her outfit. I was sober, so my inhibitions were sky-high... I didn't respond or say anything. She saw me looking at her, but I didn't want to come across as a total pervert, so I averted my eyes.

I'm so confused! Maybe she's had intense female friendships like this in the past, but I never have. I'm not a touchy-feely person, and I've never been so intimate with a friend before.

I'm going over to hers later to watch some DVDs and have dinner. I just don't know what to do. The last thing I want is to ruin our friendship, and maybe I'm reading way too much into her actions.

I've been dipping in and out of this thread (and previous threads) for some time. I'm in a relationship with a woman who was married when I met her and had no intention of leaving husband....we started having an intense friendship which then led to us falling in love and her leaving husband. She had never even kissed a woman before whereas I had had a longish relationship with a woman, but previously I had only had relationships with men.
My first boyfriend was bi-sexual and I hung out in gay clubs when I was younger so I kind of grew up being open to homosexuality and I went to Pride every year from about aged 20. I only really started sleeping with women in my 30's which is when I met my first girlfriend. It wasn't like I suddenly had a lightbulb moment, I felt exactly the same being myself in a relationship with a man or a woman....and so all this labelling stuff still eludes me.
So....that brings me back to my point, which is for Cao. Your situation really rang a bell with me as it sounds very familiar. My current relationship started like this, with constant communication - texts, emails and Skype/phone calls ALL THE TIME. We just couldn't get enough of each other!! It definitely made the boundaries blurry for me, as I questioned whether this WIQ was just being extremely friendly or if she had feelings for me, but I was terrifed of asking as she was married so it seemed inappropriate. I kept reading into things and analysing absolutely every detail....and I knew I was falling for her and that it was more than platonic friendship.
I think in your situation, she knows you are gay/bi right? Well, my WIQ knew this about me, and there is no way she would be behaving like this unless she also finds you attractive. No way, I think just go with the flow and don't panic about your feelings, as she has them too.
I didn't fess up to my WIQ as I didn't want to be rejected, but she fessed up to me and it was so amazing....

Just a quick hello from me after trying to catch up with this thread.

All is well here. The conversation with DH has now established that I'm currently bi and its not something I can put into a box and forget about as I appear to have done for the last 18 years. I feel so happy that I have got this far but I need to continue the talking.

Seen WIQ twice and can't stop myself from snatching kisses. Intense? It certainly is! I'm aching for her and yet am content to wait. It really feels like not if but when. And that when HAS to be with both DHs consent.

Likea - I've decided not to spill about sex...the experience of now is so different from before...don't worry about it...don't compare with male/female sex...if you know how to pleasure yourself, you'll certainly know how to feel your way around...read responses...let yourself go...women don't always need the big O to enjoy or be satisfied.

hi all! can t remember it being so busy on here for a while! can't work out some features on this notebook so that was supposed to be a smiler!
outmy, sorry I made you worry! I did delete this thread page but not mumsnet r'ships page - cont.in next post.

phew so much fuss with hotel internet! have access now but will be a bit irregular.
Anyway I deleted this thead page from her History, but mumsnet appeared many times for some reason (relationships) so didnòt bother, as I reasoned that she generally just wouldnàt look andsheàs not acomouter expert - she would ONLY look if she is seriously interested in me and we know outrmy that you give it 30% but it can even be less for all i kniow (if not zero)! Otherwise she s really thetype to be looking out of curiuosity as she is just too busy! IF on the other hand she is interested she will see mumsnet but will haveto trail through all threadto find and guess it?s me - well if she is bi curious she may notice this thread, but then it's not a big disaster is it? it meAns she will know without me having to confess and is interested so I will survive! silver lining! this is all unlikely though. After my last post she said she was going away soon too for a few days, and I asked whether she s going with someone to which she said yes and looked down i.e. didn't want to elaborate - normally if she talks about trips with friends she says by own accord that she is going with friend - it sounds like it may be with a man! i thinkshe knew what i was as

asking and went into silence as in 'that's theendof this conversation' - i don't get it why wouldn't she just say she wasgoing with a BF it's not exactly embarrassing unless shhe knows i'm attracted and feels a bit defensive or secretive or not to upset me? or just not my bussiness if she has no cluebut normally she is a bit more forthcoming.

posting in bitsas computer about to discharge.
Loveis nice to see you! I reaLly admire you for the courage! you aer the one on this thread whose H didn't know that you were bi and is not happy and your mother against it and yet you did it! inspiring for all of us i'd say! the main thing is that GF is with you and that you are happy with her - please value it, i can only dream so far!

Great to be back on the thread!

Follow - thanks for the advice. It's good to know that your relationship started out along the same lines.

I spent this evening at WIQ's place. Her best gay guy friend was there when I arrived. I hadn't met him before, and was really pleased to see him. They've been friends for 15 years. We got on really well, and as he was leaving, he told me to "look after" WIQ. A couple of threads back, I mentioned two gay guys who were staying with WIQ, in whom I confided about my feelings about her. They are also close friends of this other guy, and I wonder if they told him anything...

Anyway, so he left, and WIQ and I made some drinks and she cooked dinner. We started talking about my exboyfriend (broke up with him about 2 months ago, and she has really helped me through it). She started talking about her own romantic situation (which she hasn't done for a LONG time), and she said these exact words:

"Darling, I have to tell you that there is no MALE in this city who I would have a relationship with."

I just sat there on the kitchen stool not knowing what to say.

We had dinner, then went to the lounge to drink and smoke. She asked if I would braid her hair (which I did - it's kind of become our "thing") and she started talking about how she's going to redecorate her house in blue. I said "I guess now I'll have to bring you blue flowers instead of red ones", and she gave me this utterly beautiful, disarming smile that I've never seen before.

As I was leaving, she asked what I was doing tomorrow, and suggested that I come round in the afternoon to do some work (we're both freelancers) then have a DVD session in the evening. She also suggested we take two trips to surrounding cities over the next few weeks.

I honestly don't know what to think. I reckon it's time to make a move...