Support thread for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships Number *9*

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

If you find that he really wants to change
I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Hi all,
How is everyone on this Monday evening?

I had the home visit from the HV this morning - turns out it was connected to NSDH's 'incident' in April. We talked about things for about an hour, she's happy enough that DD is fine, but she mentioned that she thought I might have had PND last year when she was little. She gave me the number of a depression service in case I needed it and suggested I go to see my GP. She's also referring NSDH & me to the relationship counselling run by our local children's centre. She also said I can ring her whenever. It was good to talk to her - I could have done with this kind of support last year when DD was tiny!

My exam is next week and I'm freaking out. . And the neighbour's horrible teenagers have decided to have another noisy garden party so I'm stressed about that too - as always NSDH has stuck his head in the sand and refused to even contemplate that their racket might disturb DD's sleep. Such is life .

Tired, but it comes and goes.

Ex thinks he may have found somewhere to live.

AIBU to walk round the house, stroking the walls, and going 'Mine, mine, soon you'll be all mine' in a Gollum kind of way?

I've said it on other threads, but PND may sometimes be plain ol' reactive D - if you're in an EA relationship. The health care professionals see there's a new baby, and label it as PND, but new babies can show up FWH's deficiencies...

Sorry for so many posts in succession - but remember that it is often best to go for separate, individual counselling, not couples counselling.

Lol Pink that's quite an image - make sure the neighbours can't hear you .

I think you're right about PND, but in my case I think it was a combination of both, the whole 'having a new baby' thing hit me very hard and it wasn't all to do with NSDH. He was a major part of it though. At the time part of me know I was struggling but didn't admit it due to stigma.

Hi, my ex has started being really nice again after period of sending threatening and abusive emails and being down-right horrible. He said he wants to put it all behind us and has now been texting me to go for coffee etc. I managed to turn him down but I made an excuse (too much work on etc) rather than 'No f'ing way'. He's mildly getting into my head again by being reasonable. I know it's only short-term but it messes doesn't it? Easier in some ways when he's being down-right unreasonable and horrible.

Pink YANBI my precious
Nini I have come to the conclusion that all the women and multitasking s**t is so much bollocks.
Notice how men, and especially FWs, are really good at concentrating on what is 'good for them'
Moral - focus on your exam - the world will not fall to bits

Sounds about right freedom but stay strong! The reasonableness never lasts.

Pink that's a wonderful image. I too will be doing that soon. I move into my very own house in about 3 weeks, and I can't wait!

I also had the whole PND/D with DS. I think it was just the D coming back because FWX got so much worse when DS was born. I think he hated the fact that DS got far more attention than him. Whatever it was, I was treated for 8 months, and I'm fine now. Shame D comes back though.

freedom that's what they do. If being nasty doesn't work, they turn on the charm again to hook you. And yes, they are all extremely good at charm. As soon as you are back, it'll turn awful again. Don't do that to yourself, you deserve better.

You're right fingers, I'm trying to stay focused. Can't wait for it to be over tbh! But I will do my very best to pass. Passed qualification = work promotion = mega bucks to do whatever the hell I like with

freedom FWs do NOT get to interact just because they can put on a good act every now and then.
Either they f* off and there is no or minimal contact, or they 'get it' regardless of whether we decide to stay with them.

Thanks - I know I know. I've had it for years and managed to break away. These guys really know how to push the buttons though don't they. Thought I was totally over him. No way I would have him back though..be clear about that. But my head does hurt a bit.

I find it difficult too to justify not going for the charm when others haven't seen the abusive side of things first hand. Sometimes I feel like it looks like I'm being unreasonable/unnecessarily difficult etc when I'm just protecting myself from what I know is coming. People try to give me advice about how it will be great if we can have a platonic relationship/get on for the sake of the kids etc. I don't think they realise what this type of relationship is like though and that it's not that simple.

Oh the posts I've written over the last couple of days only for it all to get lost just before the end :(

T'internet connection should be fixed again now hopefully, feel like there's a limb missing without it.

ThePinkPussyCat - you made me with your gollum image. Just got to get rid of the 'tricksy' idiot and the walls will all be yours.

I'm quote happy tonight - in week two of learning a musical instrument from scratch (childhood dream) and my teacher made a comment about me being very negative (about myself) today.

He doesn't know the half of it really but it was useful to hear it.

What I think is my sharp and acidic wit must come across as negative in reality.

Also made me realise just how desperately starved I am of any kind of positive feedback (heck, any feedback of any kind) as was and am so pleased with the bits he told me I do well.

Pathetic really but no surprise seeing the history I've had for so many years.

Need to be kinder to ourselves and give ourselves as much praise with our inner talk as possible I think.

Hi Bibi On that theme (and on many others :)) Lundy has this to say about leaving an abusive relationship:
every loving and generous thought, every act of kindness still exists for you in its perfect radiance. Your loving heart is full of the good you have given.
This is to be read every time we beat ourselves up for having been what we view as such utterly pathetic wusses rather weak.

so today i dropped of the kids at his, its his day but since hes at work all day and i no longer work on a monday he agreed that i could pick them up for a few hours every monday. As doon as i moved out he moved my ex mum in law in. First time she saw me after split (over year ago) she told my then 3 yo son i didnt love him!
over the year she usually hides when i do the drop of it suits me fine but has resorted to telling my ex i slam the doors am rude to her etc I am not shes never there for me to be rude to since shes hiding but he listens to her....
She has also called my mum to try and convince her to convince me to go home tried the same with my dad etc.
Couple of months ago she went back to her home country and posted back to my mother photos of me she had in her house.
Today she saw my mum with me in the car she came out and started saying to her im a bad mother im messing up my kids lives i should sacrifice myself for them im rubbish etc etc i need to come home to my husband.
Its really starting to wear me down my boys are adjusted ars they can i love them to death and the time spent with each parent is as much as possible shes wearing me down how would you all cope?

DH was horrible when we first got married (11 years ago) - unpleasant, flirtatious with others, wished he could leave me, said he came close to hitting me at times (but never has). Sometimes I wish he would, or would have an affair - it would be more clear cut then and I'd know that my family and friends would understand if I walked. He did nearly have an affair once (afaik it didn't happen) and I found a couple of suggestive texts. Confronted him, trembling, to be told they were just jokes (his flirtatious manner, not going to change) and conversation became (somehow) all about me and if I was ok and did I feel I needed more support?

Anyway, cut to the present and I usually think he is much better, but lately I've been wondering if he's just more subtle and confusing about it. He usually treats me as insignificant (leaving a mess for me to clear up as he whirls busily and importantly through; talks over me repeatedly when we're with others - is much more eloquent than me, though); always wants me to wear make-up as I "look so much better with it on", although he says that less now as he knows I hate it; won't let me drive when he's in the car (well, I have insisted - but it's really not worth the effort for the 'helpful' comment). DD1 told me recently that "Daddy understands people better than you" - on enquiry, she said that she and dh had discussed this... DH denied it and seemed horrified by the idea - but he has said as much to me, often says I am not good at social situations or 'reading' people - and where else would she get that idea from?

Well, that gives you a small idea of what we're like - thing is, I'd like to believe it's EA because I feel like I'm going mad, but I can't believe it is, as it doesn't feel anything like being hit, iyswim! I suppose the other options are either that he's hyperactive and successful and I'm majorly stressed by living with a whirlwind and feel inadequate because I'm not as clever or capable as him in sooo many ways OR he's so busy at work that we're not seeing enough of each other and therefore communicating badly. Can you see enough of what's going on from this (rather long now!) snapshot of our lives to have an opinion whether this is EA or not? I don't think I'm explaining very well - partly, because it's a vague feeling of unease rather than specific incidents and partly because I've felt for a long time that keeping a record of incidents that have upset me would be unforgiving and unhelpful - so I don't really know how often I feel uneasy and how often I feel things are going well. If it's not clear to you lovely-sounding experts on the subject, then I'm planning to order Lundy just as soon as I can work out how to get it without dh seeing it first...

Thanks to anyone who's had the patience to read to the end of this - sorry for the length!

wellies treating someone, especially your partner, as insignificant sounds like EA to me. The confusion you feel is the result of that.

We get it about the incidents that upset you and the feeling you should forgive them - each is so trivial-sounding that we just feel like we are moaning if we mention them to our friends, who usually don't really get it anyway. But it is like Chinese torture in its cumulative effect.

Do feel free to describe some, if you want - and I bet one of us will be able to match whatever you put!

umbrella hard as it is to have an ex mil like this, she is of no consequence, she really isn't. You say your boys are doing well, and that is what matters. Perhaps you need a cut-off response (can't think of one off the top of my head - anyone?) - practise it alone so it will trip off the tongue automatically when needed. sorry to tired to think of an example.

Can I just tell you all something that is really bugging me. My delightful ex, who nobody believes could possibly be abusive, went on the local radio a while back to say why he was raising money for the local childrens hospice. It sounded so heartwarming. He spent the sponsorship money he raised and never replaced it. Not one single penny made it to that charity.
It's hard knowing what he is really like but nobody believing me :(

Lostmywellies - yes it is i'm afraid. The book is very good, as are the links on this thread. It is hard to explain it which is why is why nobody else sees it and you end up feeling like it must be you at fault.

Slinking in late tonight as I had so much work I didn't get away till 10pm. But I'm on holiday for a fortnight soon so it's worth clearing the decks.

wellies it must be demoralising to live with someone who believes and has convinced you that he is the important clever busy one and you are the one who clears up. He is "good with people" and you are not.

But manifestly that is not true. If he was good with people he would treat his life partner with respect. He wouldn't rudely talk over you or run you down to your daughter. So he isn't correct. He is either arrogant and conceited or insecure and blowing his trumpet. Either way he isn't very nice!

What are you good at? (Welcome by the way)

Amitola does the hospice have a fund-raiser who might have picked up on the discrepancy especially if it were drawn to their attention?

There were two occasions for the same charity. I don't know if they would care really. I thought about dropping it into converstion with his supporters but they would just find an excuse for him anyway. It is I who is satan reincarnated, he is pure and saintly!
Ugh, horrible man

Amitola - how annoying! Actually, I'm quite impressed by your awareness of his financial shenannigans (sp?!) - or was he quite open about what he was doing with you?

Yes, dh is a strange mixture of arrogant and insecure - he's said so many times, that he comes across badly, as arrogant, because he's covering up for insecurity. I used to think he was wonderful, and clever, and better than me at everything - then I went through a stage (possibly the same time I discovered mn and my expectations rose sharply!) of thinking he was just awful and I struggled to see anything redeeming about him at all for a long time. I'm still not convinced by this EA thing, though - how do I know I haven't just got low self-esteem from too long being an SAHM? Obviously, I'm noticing his flaws more than his good points, so I'm not giving you an unbiased impression. Thanks for the welcome, anyway - and sorry to sound argumentative. Actually, I should probably be in bed now! I might be more coherent in the morning!

What am I good at? I'm throwing all my energy into bringing up my 4 dcs at the mo, and I think I'm good at that, although it's a pretty thankless task for the most part, of course! Apart from that, not much. I used to be good at my job, years ago. It took all my energy to do it, though, so I'm not sure when I'll be ready to go back.

Hello wellies welcome and :( that there is a f*wit in your life.
My first step to realizing that I was not mad was reading the first link at the top of this page.
It opened the floodgates.
again wise women for this thread
Please get both Lundy books.
If you are worried about your FWH seeing it, then could you order it at the local library and read it there?
'Should I Stay or Should I Go'
is also available for kindle if you have, or could borrow, one.