Support thread for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships Number *9*

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

If you find that he really wants to change
I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

sceram?! scream obviously

I can't do detach until i'm ready. I've tried but it turns out I need to kick up a big stink first. I feel indifference to my parents now, after years of struggling over it, but the situation with my ex is still raw and I have emotions.
I'm very emotional and wear my heart on my sleeve. I know most people don't do that but I figure things are better out than in.
I don't like to show abusive people that they have got to me, but sometimes it does feel really good to direct it at the right people

Hello, quick post, no time to catch up on today's posts, just to say that I am having a whale of a time, and have got to know lots of neighbouts recently, through having my BFF's DS(13) to stay. He came yesterday, and stayed overnight. BFF had a well-earned rest :)

FWEx is packing. So is DD (early 20's). My bedroom is full of charity shop finds, ready to take the place of the enormous Airfix kits and DMIL's vase collection

DCat is asleep on my bed, and she is snoring.

Not long now!

Catch up with you all tomorrow. Keep strong.

Just curious, does anyone else get sick frequently? I am down with another (I think) sinus infection and am so fed up. It actually happens a lot at peak times when things are going badly, its as if I am being sabotaged as I am standing up for myself, making plans, and then I just lose all my energy and have to take to my bed for a day or two. It's exhausting. :(

Hope everyone had a reasonably good weekend, I'll catch up on the posts later.

Way to go Pink :)

Oh, poor you bidder - sorry you're not feeling well.

• Like your phrase "a reasonably good weekend"

Yes, thanks, I did have a "RGW" - Went to DD's dance show twice which was lovely, parents came up for weekend (to see the show too) and was good to see them. D?H helped me tidy the house (so is looking a bit brighter now) - and has only been completely unreasonable and upset me three times since Friday evening, and DS once (stress of tidying was possibly a factor ?) Going to read the Lundy book now which arrived on Friday to try to get my head around what is going on. Have been detaching slightly and D?H not liking it - possibly upping the ante a little ?

i think that i at least withdrawn from him. which obviously he can't bear, so has to twist the thumbscrews tighter.

i have told him countless times not to shout or swear at me in front of the dc. despite being a bit of a disney dad, he cannot put anybody else before himself, especially when it is really needed. so of course he shouts at me in front of the children. loser.

last night i said we needed to talk. if he started shouting or swearing the conversation would be over. i said that we couldn't go on, and that he needed to start taking some responsiblity for the state of our relationship. guess what he said?

'what about you' what about you taking responsibility

i said, you did raise your fist at me 'oh no i didn't'
i then said that he was abusive. 'how can i be it's not in my nature'
because you are very angry.

i also said that i still loved him enough to help him through it all.

i literally saw him swallow his rage and walk off.
which i suppose is progress.

today i am cool and polite, and trying hard not to put sarcasm into my voice.

why is is so difficult for people to love?
all this is such a waste of energy. it's a beautiful world. the birds still sing. we are here for a heartbeat.

baskingseals - so sorry for the pain you are going through, and everyone else. the whole thing is just head wrecking, as someone said earlier. its so hard to think clearly. you handled things in that situation so well. im glad you can see the beauty in nature and the small things, it is these things that will keep us going.
i am trusting in God, seeing thing kindness in others, the miracle of the life of my new daughter, and these things are keeping me going.
dh emailed me back and says he is trying very very hard. he wants me to stay and that he will change. i do see improvements, but then things can blow up still every once in awhile. im hoping that the blow ups will get less frequent and fade out as he 'learns' proper behaviour. or at least, gets the strength to do it.
he is going away for a week with his friends sometime over hte summer. i am down that i can't go (i refused to go away with him as i don't want the stress) also it will be too much for me with the baby. i would love some sun. i am thinking i might book myself some beauty treatments instead while he is away. im worried how i might cope myself with the baby - afterall, he does do a bottlefeed before she goes to bed every night and i need my sleep. but i will be glad of the peace too. i am worried that if i find it too difficult, it will wreck the confidence i have in being able to leave if i feel it has come to that.
hope you all have a good week. i just done a fake tan and it made me feel a bit better- my confidence is an all time low! i feel i look like i have aged about 10 years since i got married 3 years ago!

im so upset. my counsellor just phoned and did an exit interview with me... i told her i didn't want to come back because i found it too stressful and was afraid to talk about stuff.

she told me to go and get my own counselling to empower me and give me some confidence and a voice. she said it would help me get some more skills to bring to the relationship.

it made me feel like its me that has to do all the work. i can't stop crying. we have been seeing her for ages. why didn't she pick up on it? so the problem is my lack of confidence? i feel awful. i feel i have no support now. im not going to do my own counselling. im fed up of counselling. ive been to loads of counselling in the past.

Just remember that no matter who you are, nobody has the right to bully and abuse you, whether it be verbally, physically, mentally, or in any other way.

No real man would ever hit a lady. Fortunately there are far more of us, than there ever will be of the other unspeakable type.

Just don't put up with it. You only live once, and you deserve to have a proper and happy life.

Stay strong to yourself, and do whatever it takes to achieve that. It's worth it in the long run. I know.......I've been there, only in my case, suffering systematic abuse from a lady!

Daddyogre, everything you read about abusers and narcissists presumes they are male, but funnily enough one of the lightbulb moments for me was talking to a male friend who seemed to be suffering a similar fate at the hands of his high earning, well respected DW while he was a SAHD to 3 children. She belittled him, was financially abusive and seemed to treat him as a bit of a joke

Somehow seeing it happen to a guy pointed out how wrong it was, but still he only split up with her when she kicked him out (swiftly moving onto another man)

^just don't put up with it. You only live once, and you deserve to have a proper and happy life.^

true and there are lots of us who can testify to a better life on the other side of an abusive relationship.

jan the problem is that you ^are^ the only one doing the work. This is because your relationship works just fine for him...he is not looking for a partnership, a meeting of minds, a person to complete him. He thinks he is perfect already...he just wants to be looked after with as little fuss as possible..to look like a great and good man in the eyes of those he respects and emulates (not you obviously).

The couples counsellor might have seen it if he/she was looking for it. But they often come with a de-facto presumption that if both of you are there both of you are admitting responsibility and looking to change.

I am in the process of writing to the relate counsellor who saw us before I split...she showed no understanding or clue about how our relationship was(n't) working...and kept asking me to do more. It did help me...in the end I threw up my hands and said I could do no more.......another step along the road to freedom

jan2011 it is good that you had an exit interview. It seems to me that the counsellor was saying that your priority should be to work on yourself. Having counselled the two of you, she cannot then continue to counsel you on your own. You could ask her if she could recommed another counsellor, if you were feeling brave!

I think counseling can be very variable jan
If you don't feel it's for you at the moment then I think that's fine.

Some people have said here that if your partner is abusive in any of the major ways joint counseling may not be helpful. I feel counselor's should be more on the look-out for unequal or abusive relationships, rather than always seeming to assume that if you both work on the relationship it can be improved - sometimes it's not that simple IMHO.

But juggling that's what I'm saying. The counsellor has noticed it is an 'abusive' relationship and knows you need to start again with a different counsellor who will just listen to your side of the story, without knowing his version of things which would ony muddy the waters.

Counsellors have to have regular supervision sessions from a peer, if they are themselves inexperienced it needs to by someone who has done it for longer - at least, that was the case in the 1980's and 90's, for registration. These supervisors wil give their opinion on how the counselling is going, in general terms, and give advice accordingly.

Friends and neighbours can also be good to have a chat to, even about the weather :) They won't understand about abuse, though. Most of them are lovely men and women who understand about sharing, and give and take. That's how it should be

And people who are abusive, and abusers, are often very sly and practised about giving anything away to a counsellor, if it doesn't show THEM in a good light.

I've worked in care, and seen some real abuse, and reported it all. There should be no hiding place for cowards and abusers. Drag them out into the open, preferably where all their friends can see them for what they really are.

I won't bore you with a long story, but years ago, my MIL was highly sceptical about her dear daughter having a serious drink problem.

Until one sunny afternoon, after a furious argument, her lovely daughter laid her out with a massive haymaker, kicked her in the face and and broke her nose, and it took her husband and myself to pull this howling demon off her.

She started to believe then!!

I agree. Somer relationships, like it or not, can't be repaired, and it's best to move on for both parties.

jan I think pinkpussycat has hit the nail on the head.

It might feel like YOU have to do the work. Perhaps thats because you are a lovely person and you can be made stronger and there's work to be done with you. Your partner on the otherhand...silk purse and sows ear maybe? Hope I'm not speaking out of turn.

I see we will be ready for a new thread soon.

no of course you are not speaking out of turn - thank you for everyone who has replied. my head just won't think clearly today. i don't want another counsellor right now im just sick of it all.... maybe in a few months. thanks for listening

Sorry ladies, I promise to come back and read posts I've missed tonight, but a very quick & quite urgent question - how do you have 'the' conversation where you tell him you're not happy and something has to change?

I've put it off for long enough but tonight this conversation has to happen. I'm seeing my counsellor tomorrow (and I can't go to her with nothing in motion again), and I'm also going to our nearest childre's centre afterwards to talk with someone there about what we as a couple need in terms of advice/counselling. I need to talk to him about everything that's been going on but he's been avoiding having the conversation. Any wise words of wisdom?

You don't need any counselling for a while. Do you have a treasured book from childhood that you can re-read? or maybe have a look on YouTube for Ant and Dec on SMTV live in the 80's (tis hilariously rude, but DD then aged 10 or so didn't realise at the time...but we mothers did ) Or Horrible Histories? or the Chuckle Brothers? Enjoy your children, the summer holidays are just around the corner

Nini please please be very careful about counselling. You don't need to do anything just because you think your counsellor expects it.
Healing is all about getting better - not jumping through hoops.
As has been confirmed here more than once, couple's counselling is to be avoided at all costs when the relationship is based on one partner's abuse.

Thanks fingers, I know. I do feel like these are things I need to do anyway and the counsellor is giving me a nudge in the right direction, a bit like going to weight watchers if that makes sense.

I'm not sure what the lady at the children's centre is going to suggest, but she is aware of our situation and that physical abuse was involved, so she may not even suggest couples counselling. I'm not sure.

Just back from a few days' holiday with Nice Boy. He is very very nice. He is so calm and reassuring. We spent the entire time holding hands, even when asleep. :)

It's been seven months since I left. FWH was originally telling me he was suicidal, that I had destroyed him etc. He is now mainly living with a new partner and her children, having dinner parties with our old friends - and despite saying he has no money, employing FOUR staff to do things like gardening etc.

I am struggling on my wage, but I can pay the bills, and I'm happy. Very very happy. But I do find his "moving on" just utterly baffling. He made me suffer SO MUCH about leaving, and he has just moved on and introduced his new partner as the children's step-mum within such a short period of time - after nearly 20 years! Poor woman.

ANYWAY all is good, and I never NEVER thought that he would be 'ok' and that made me stay for TOO LONG. But I really think it was losing control of me that upset him, and nothing else. I don't think he LIKED me at all.

A ramble really. But love to you all. XX

Wow, a happy ending after all this!

And even now with his FuckWittery, you know you've got the best deal here, a lovely, calm, reassuring, nice person with whom you are comfortable and compatible.

That's really something for me to aspire to TheBigHouse, thank you.