Absolutely LIVID at what Mother-in-Law has just said to me. What to do? please help.

[almosttoolividforwords]

I have name changed for this one.

I have 2 DC aged 6 (from previous relationship) and nearly 3. My marriage has been very up and down and if I'm honest I think we would be be out of the relationship had it not been for the DC.

MIL has been very interfering from the start but I have let it go, despite different friends and even my counselling lady (for trauma I had in past) having said that they are worried about how she acts. MIL has intimated on a couple of occasions outrageous things like -

5 years ago when me and H moved in together I overheard a conversation where she asked H if he really thought he should be moving in with someone who already has a child, that she "never thought he would" and was he really sure it was the right thing for him etc . And also telling him that he would "always have a home here you know that" . double .

Also once she expressed disbelief that I wanted to go back to work after my maternity leave (having no idea of our financial situation at all) and she said in a phonecall to me "Money means more to you than children" !

H does backshifts and I do days so he often brings the youngest to MIL's during the daytimes. Tonight I got the following text message from MIL when DC back home and in bed -

MIL "How is (dc1) and (dc2)?"

me - "fine. how was (dc1) today when at yours?"

MIL "fine but to be honest he didn't want to go home so that makes me concerned"

me - "what do you mean exactly by that statement?"

MIL - "what do you not understand what the word concerned means?"

MIL - "I'll put it in simple terms to you so you maybe can understand. little (eldest dc, nearly 7) is sick of doing house work that her mother should be doing, she is 6 not 16. and as for (youngest dc) you deal with the bonding before you leave it too late. and maybe cut down on your shouting in front of them"

WHAT IN THE NAME OF ?!!!!

I in no way force my eldest to do too much housework at all. She does age appropriate things like hang up socks, quick swish of her sibling's highchair with a baby wipe, "help" me clean out hoover by holding open the bag, tidy away toys etc. If anything, it was MIL who spoiled H and now he is a lazy sod!

As for the bonding thing, I have no idea what she is on about. Perhaps she is deranged. I had PND with my eldest but I didn't even know MIL then and I was terrified I'd get it a second time but didn't get it, but thankfully I never and have a lovely relationship with DC always cuddling and kissing him, maybe not so much publicly in front of her.

I do shout, but no more than most mothers I know!

All I can guess is that it is her way of trying to undermine my role as a mother. Because there really is no truth in what she says. H has a nasty habit of saying (nasty) things to me in arguments about my parenting but is generally more loyal and did stick up for me when she had her comment about me going back to work.

Does anyone have any advice on this? It has really quite scared and intimidated me. Should I cut down her contact by drastically cutting work hours (she does see them a lot) and not allow her to see them on weekends or anything if she is obviously just gathering "ammo" to use against me? I have been shaking with anger for ages over this. Phoned H at work and told him but he is busy and gave a curt "It's none of my business" response .
aaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhh

Alice8, that is mainly what I am scared of and the only reason I'm even considering staying with someone who does not even challenge his mother saying those things to me. If H and I split, it becomes an us (H and MIL united) vs me situation. Whereas now, it is like that at times over certain issues but not nearly as strong as it would be if we split. And I keep thinking that if I can get H to spend more time here with the DC rather than taking them up to MILs then it is more likely to push her out than splitting and them going up there every time they see dad.

Part of me is thinking I should just stay with H for the time being anyway, because I think splitting with him now would just aggravate the situation, even more so than calling his bluff about the job. That I should just remain calm at all times and keep the only issue to be resolute or even forceful about , as me having as much time with the DC as possible, alone or with him. and just let the other issues and resentment I have with him fall by the wayside. At least until I'm in a better position as main carer, and have all ducks in row.

Do think it's a matter of when not if we split though, someone who condones their partner being spoken to like that (he saw the texts) without blinking an eyelid is not someone who respects their partner.

Argh. Don't know. Brain is pickled.

The thing is though, if u wait till your ds is 6 and old enough to have a say how do u know that mil won't have 'brainwashed' him into saying he wants to stay with his dad? Personally I think u should get out ASAP and go with the aggressive solicitor u saw, this situation is v damaging to u and your dc's. What an awful situation for u.

I don't think you should lie to your H about anything. You'll get found out and it might add to the 'manipulative' tag.

I really think the new job is a distraction and that you can progress your career another day. Right now the clear focus is on your DC and their home life. They need to be secured to you. Bedtimes and bath times are going to be relevant and if you take a job that requires out-of-hours chi,d care rather than standard daytime help I think you are strengthening your h/MiL's position.

is it possible you can say to the employer that you would be available for this job in 6 months, if there was an opening - for personal matters which you cant go into you regret you have to turn down this offer but you really really want the job in say 6-12 months time as it is your dream job. they may well keep that on board and get in touch later. worth a shot. from what i have read it sounds like you need to do this piece meal, slowly - for your own peace of ind if nothing else. so youve cut your hours down, now cut down hours spent with wicked witch ... and work on keeping relationship with your husband cordial whilst you work on the next step ... in all of this, in all of this upset enjoy your children because you know how it is, time flies so fast wish you luck stay strong dont let anyone battle you down you have every right to do what you want to x

and dont tell your husband anything he doesnt need to know

Take the job and employ the childminder 4-9.30 drop dc off on the way to work and pick them up on the way back, if you're struggling to afford it then I'm sure your Dad would help out short term until you were a loan parent and qualified for help.

Another good solution would be that your Dad or sister collect the dc from the childminders one day per week (either each or alternating) at 6pm and bring them to your house and put them to bed. It would strengthen the bond and give you moral support and your h/MIL wouldn't know.

Does your DH object to your Dad/Sister visiting your home? Would he object if they came and looked after them 6-9.30pm? Again it would be a short term solution until you have established yourself as having rights to your ds and main carer!!! If MIL won't come and look after them in your home that's her tough titty that she won't get to see your ds and your side of the family will instead.

Residency etc tends to be based on nights, ie who looks after them overnights. If you were looking after them all their waking hours bar 15 hours per week who in their right mind would take them away from you...

Reduce your current working hours as of now, start saving madly, take the new job, start doing things to avoid MIL having them. Don't tell your dh that you've planned to do x y z at the weekend, just get up and go out and say btw I've decided the dc and I are doing x today would you like to come, I'll let MIL know ds isn't coming over. Matter of fact etc etc

I'll let MIL know ds isn't coming over. Matter of fact etc etc

Yes, exactly. Matter of fact. Hold your nerve, no matter how much she may shriek, cry, object etc. Hold Your Nerve. Don't waver or change your mind. Keep thinking / saying "I'm their Mum, I'm doing xyz with MY children. Mine."

You've been bullied for too long OP and it is exceptionally hard to not feel fear at their reactions, I realise that. But you must.

FWIW, my own Mum and brother are like this. Exactly like this, and I've escaped that whole psychology, finally. But I too, felt real apprehension and anxiety when it came to doing something that they didn't agree with, so I understand how horrible this is for you. Break the cycle. Live freely. You and your DC deserve that.

Loony I think that would bring huge confrontation and the H would side will MIL and after all the H does have the right to take his ds to visit his Mum.

I think the op needs to be more subtle, assertive yes, unwavering and innocent which would not be achieved by creating a huge row. She needs to have herself established as primary carer before she rocks the boat.

There are incidences of Mum's doing all the day time care but the exH is the primary carer and has residency because they sleep at his house.

Random, yes of course, you're right.

I meant subtly - but OP has to stand her ground somehow. It's easy to wilt under such aggression. I s'pose the key is to get a bank of inoffensive phrases at the ready so that MIL can't act the victim and get H on side.

I didn't explain that too well did I? I've read this thread from the start and been unable to contribute. And all the while I've kept it at the back of my mind, that this pair are strikingly similar to my own family set-up.

If residency is based on nights then I really CANNOT have either H or MIL caring for them 5 nights a week until 9.30pm, as then if we split DS would automatically go up to MIL (where H would be living) 5 nights a week and then that would really really harm my case, no matter how much time I had with them during the day.

I think really the only option (if I was to take job) would be to split with H immediately and apply for benefits until my job starts. Enlist childminder at home service if can to care for them when I start new job. Then go to court regarding residency and let the cards fall the way they fall.

I don't think there is any way I could feasibly stay with H and take the job too. As he is completely against childminders in any form, and would have a hairy fit if any of my family came to the house to look after DC. The only way he would agree to it would be if he/MIL could care for them but that would leave me in a very very precarious position regarding residency- wouldn't do that.

I think that it's either stay with H, don't take job and probably end up splitting anyway but I'll be in better position for residency by then. Or... bite the bullet, split with H, get interdict against removal very soon (solicitor says I could get one as there is enough concern for parental alienation but would mean starting legal action against him) and use childminder.

Why is he so against your family being involved?
Or is he parroting what MIL says?

Yes I don't think I can stop H taking DC to his mothers himself, but H works all weekend 2 quite long nightshifts so has never been around much for DC at weekend as he sleeps all day so I can certainly tell MIL where to go at weekends.

In fact, I just have.

Just got a text from MIL there (first since nasty ones earlier in the week) -

"Will be down at 1.30 for children. could you look out clothes for DD since i dont have cloths for her and sweater for DS."

at the assumption I will just hand them over after what she said to me!

I replied

"We are going to summer fete at my work today"

(we are actually, but I'm dreading it and really don't feel like it with all this going on, feel like becoming a hermit but only have to stay an hour)

H is against my sister because they had an argument when DS was born (both at fault, probably more my sister at fault than H actually, but I think to still hold a grudge and refuse to let her have a part in DC lives is over the top)

MIL has, predictably to character, hated my family from the moment she met them in the hospital when I had DS. For no reason I can fathom. My dad and my sister both think she is a basket-case.

Well done - HUGE well done for sending that reply. Are you expecting a fall-out now? You've done well.

Go, most definitely GO! I know it's the last thing you want to do, but go for an hour, then go and do what you all want to do then - park, cinema, walk. Anything.

No probably just sulking from MIL. Could be wrong though. H can't do anything because he is on nightshift and sleeps on Sat and Sun during day so isn't bothered, knows he can't do anything about it. Weekends it is easier for me to tell her where to go because H is sleeping and not going to fight her corner than as he is tired and isn't bothered.

Don't feel like doing anything AT ALL at this point in time. But then DC will want to go to nans because "she takes us places". Having the conversation with H about the new job at 2pm apparently then going there 3 - 4.30 ish , back for dinner.

He can't have it both ways, he can't refuse your ds to have a relationship with your family yet insist his mother does.

Take the job (do not tell H), delay the start as long as you can. Give up your other job immediately or just one shift per week. Leave your dh the week before your new job and move in with your Dad taking the dc with you, sort out childcare and get H to leave the house before you return. Obviously take up the first solicitor and do not allow contact until something legal is sorted due to your fear of H/MIL not returning them and her parental alienating behavior.

That would be my advice. You will have established yourself as primary carer, you will be able to sort out your childcare, yes move as far from your MIL as you can as your Dad suggested.

Don't have the convo with your DH or just say you are undecided (or lie??) where are you going 3-4.30 the fete or MIL?

I would suggest you grit your teeth and take your dc to visit MIL occasionally over these few weeks but do not leave them there, stay with her and ensure you visit at a time when you will have to leave after a short space of time - she has to walk the dog, dc bedtime etc.

Your mil is totally toxic. How can she just assume she will come and have your children during the weekend when you are off from work?

You really need to become a greater part of their life and push mil out at the weekend. She has them enough in the week, you want precious time with them when you are not working.

Spoke too soon.

Just had phonecall from H and could hear MIL acting hysterical in background.

H said that I should have told MIL that I had something planned so she wouldn't plan something with the DC and waste her food etc. and get all upset . I replied well perhaps she could have asked me before planning something and I wasn't going to contact her anyway after the texts she sent me. H then said he had seen the texts and mine in return to hers were actually more nasty since what I had taken them to mean were not what she really meant !!! (haha , how else would you take them? a bit see-through!). He then said could I let MIL know in advance of what I'm doing at weekend in future (as if she gets them every weekend or something - far from it!!!)

I mentioned our discussion of the job again planned to take place at 2 when he usually wakes up and H again reiterated that "you do what you like, but there is no way DS will be having a childminder either outside or inside the home and I have changed my hours around last time when you got the bank job to accommodate you, I'm not doing it again (that is actually true, I'd forgotten he did change his hours for me to get current temp job)" and hung up. Now his phone off.

I am still absolutely livid at H for condoning what she said to me, it makes me hate him tbh.

but I am livid at her .... a grown woman acting like a child screaming in background because she didn't get away with treating me like that this time then getting H involved and getting him to call me

She is behaving like a loon. Can you take a few days off and go and visit our family with the DC and use a couple of days away from them to think things over and decide on a plan?

My lord, its sounds as though she has completley took over!!
They are not even her dcs and she is dictating to you and begging for you to tell her where you are going in advance-what a toxic loon.
Your H is awful for allowing it to go on-put your foot down and decrease visits until she hardly sees them, ive had to do it an i do not regret it one bit