Being drink does not mean you deserve it.

[OhNoMyFanjo]

I have been reading some comments on tge DM site re an interview with a women who was raped. Her rapist has just been convicted. She has had many terrible things said about her in her community due to the rapist being a pillar of tge community.

I wanted to share this comment that someone has made as it sums up what should be obvious to everyone but unfortunately there are some people who don't get it.

You don't get raped because you are drunk - you vomit because you are drunk. You get raped because the rapist standing next to you made the decision to rape you and acted on it. The rapist is the only one accountable for going on to rape a person. End.

The rape occurs over hours, weeks, days, sometimes months or years. It is not a sexual act.

Boy, do ever miss the point Larry. Educate yourself.

No, I will not be teaching my children to get fall down drunk, because that is not good parenting. However, to link being drunk with an increased vulnerability to rape is a fallacy - alcohol is a red herring.

Do you ever actually read the thread Larry? Or just come on to spout your own (very mistaken) views.

No larry it shows that you don't understand how to interpret statistics. You don't understand the difference between correlation and causation. Look them up.

Does anyone need Larry to mansplain statistical analysis for them? I've done statistics at degree level, so thanks, Larry, but I'll pass.

But what is your misguided idea about alcohol and risk of rape based on?

Fucking hell larry, if I lie and the couch and eat donuts all the day long and have a heart attack, my lifestyle choices and ultimately I am to blame.

If I get raped while I am drunk it is the man that raped me that made that happen NOT THE FACT THAT I CHOSE TO GET DRUNK.

People who as healthy as can be have heart attacks, women are raped in their own homes by their partners, you are totally right you cannot protect yourself from EITHER of these things.

Why does this persist? WHY do we think rape happens to silly women who take silly risks.

By saying drinking increases your risk of rape (it doesn't) you feed into a rapists entitlement to rape drunk women (they then get women drunk to rape them because the stupid woman was too stupid not to stay sober). You create rapists and tolerate rape with victim blaming larry.

Running,

I am glad you are better educated than me in stats. Maybe you could womansplain to me the stats that show that you are NOT more vulnerable to rape when drunk than sober?

Offred,

I am happy to be proved wrong on what seems to me a very common sense idea. And I will gladly eat humble pie if someone can really demonstrate to me that I am wrong. People generally (as opposed to what some have posted above) less cautious, more trusting and more uninhibited when drunk. And, as people have also said, sometimes rapists spike drinks. Are you more likely to take a drink from a stranger and check carefully whether it has been spiked when you are drunk or sober?

A rapist will not target you as a victim because you have, within your own control, been drinking and got drunk. They need to be in control of the vulnerability that is why they rape.

I am not less cautious and trusting when drunk. I am paranoid and kicky and I shout angrily at people when if I was sober I would have kept my irritation to myself.

"And from the perspective of the victim, a crime and accident are the same"

What the actual fucking, fucking, fuck.

That is vile and deeply offensive.

If I get pissed and fall over and break my leg, that is an accident and if happened because I was drunk, it will be a massive inconvienence and I will feel a bit of a twat that I let it happen.

Lets try that out with RAPE.

If I get pissed and walk home alone and get raped, that is an accident and it happened because I was drunk, it will be a massive inconvienence and I will feel a bit of a twat that I let it happen.

I don't fucking think so and I have reported your post.

You are showing your ignorance if you actually believe that for the victim an accident has the same impact as a crime against the person, Larry. Extremely ignorant. There is a huge psychological impact on a person when a crime is committed against you, by another person.

You may think you know everything about everything Larry, but your views show a pitiable amount of actual knowledge on the subject of rape. You are spouting rape myths in layman's terms, and as a self-identifying intelligent man (I saw that IQ thread) you should know better.

"By saying drinking increases your risk of rape (it doesn't) you feed into a rapists entitlement to rape drunk women (they then get women drunk to rape them because the stupid woman was too stupid not to stay sober). You create rapists and tolerate rape with victim blaming larry."

I understand that you feel this strongly but I don't get it. If I say that I was mugged when I was drunk and that I might have paid more attention to which street I was walking down and who was walking towards me when I was sober, am I blaming myself for being mugged? As a teenager I was taught what was called "street sense" (crossing the road if you saw a gang of dodgy looking kids, walking quickly, not loitering etc etc). I don't think that excuses criminals from their crimes, does it? The alternative to what you say is to not encourage any precautions from crime as it is "victim blaming". Is that what you believe?

Read the thread, Larry, dear - it's painfully obvious that you haven't. I'm almost embarrassed for you.

I'm not going to swear today. But if I were going to, I would be shouting FUCKING HELL

Well four out of ten rapes involved drink so with that every woman should go and have a drink. Note I say drink not pissed

"I don't fucking think so and I have reported your post."

Good. You might try asking me what I meant first. To clarify, if you are a crime victim, you have accidentally met a bad person. You have not done it on purpose. But, relative to you, you have been in the wrong place at the wrong time, whether that is with respect to a brick falling on your head or a mugger being on the same street as you.

I am in no way implying that the psychological implications are the same, although I do think people on these threads make very light of the psychological implications of other crimes and accidents.

"I am not less cautious and trusting when drunk. I am paranoid and kicky and I shout angrily at people when if I was sober I would have kept my irritation to myself."

Well, clearly not drinking does not apply IN YOUR CASE. Most people are the opposite. And that is a fact based on what kind of drug alcohol is and what area of the brain it acts on.

Oh and a bit of a difference between being mugged to being raped. You can hide your wallet how the fuck do I hide the fact I've got a vagina?

With all this inflammatory posting, it's almost as if someone is wishing to derail the thread? Tut tut.

I find it a source of great sadness that a man can come on such a sensitive thread on rape and spout such uneducated nonsense.

Oh and most of the time stolen items can be replaced what is there for rape?

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2784921/

"Abstract.

Before effective prevention interventions can be developed, it is necessary to identify the mechanisms that contribute to the targeted negative outcomes. A review of the literature on women's substance use and sexual victimization points to women's heavy episodic drinking as a proximal risk factor, particularly among college samples. At least half of sexual victimization incidents involve alcohol use and the majority of rapes of college women occur when the victim is too intoxicated to resist (?incapacitated rape?). Despite the importance of women's heavy episodic drinking as being a risk factor, existing rape prevention programs have rarely addressed women's alcohol use and have shown little success in reducing rates of sexual victimization. We argue that given the strength of the association between heavy episodic drinking and sexual victimization among young women, prevention programs targeting drinking may prove more efficacious than programs targeting sexual vulnerability. Applications of existing drinking prevention strategies to reducing women's sexual victimization are discussed."

Conclusion

"Rape prevention efforts targeting women's behavior have been criticized as unfairly requiring women as potential victims to alter their behavior and restrict their freedom in exchange for their safety (see Ullman, 2002). Although the goal of the approach we advocate is to alter women's behavior, it seems difficult to argue that preventing women from drinking to the point of incapacitation restricts their freedom or involves a loss. On the contrary, it offers many additional benefits. Advocating drinking reduction for women as a way of reducing their vulnerability to rape implies neither that women are to blame for their own victimization nor that prevention directed toward male perpetrators is unnecessary. College drinking reduction programs have most commonly been directed toward women and men, and this two-pronged approach, targeting both victim and perpetrator drinking, may prove especially effective in reducing sexual victimization.

We encourage researchers who are testing the efficacy of prevention interventions to include outcome measures that permit examination of the impact of these interventions on subsequent risk of sexual victimization, both alcohol consumption-related and nonalcohol consumption related. Such data can address the hypothesis we have suggested: that sexual victimization can be reduced by reducing heavy episodic drinking in young women. Moreover, results of these trials, whether successful or not, can in turn inform basic research by providing addition additional insight into how women's alcohol consumption contributes to sexual victimization."

Rather means that this is not a "rape myth". Or have these two women confused correlation and causation?

Maybe you would get it if you read the thread. Or any of the literature on rape as a crime or victim blaming, what it is and why it is bad.

Yes, they have confused correlation with causation and have not understood rape as a crime.