Mixed culture relationship problems

[furiousgrantobe]

My daughter and her bf have been together 7 years but it has been complicated by the fact that he is of Pakistani origin and she is of english mother/brazilian father mixed race. I have been aware of the relationship from the beginning as I am very close to my daughter and whilst it wouldn't have been my choice of partner for her I have always supported the relationship as her happiness is of paramount importance. His family became aware of the relationship at the beginning due to him unfortunately being sent to prison and my daughter and I attended the court and his family were amicable towards us. She has fully supported him through 2 stints in prison, I believe in giving someone a second chance and since his last release 4 years ago he has been a changed person.
The relationship has been almost hidden from his family and my daughter has never been to his house but has met his sister and got on well with her.
My DD found out 8 weeks ago that she is pregnant and due to medical problems in the past was told that it was almost impossible to conceive naturally. They were to begin IVF treatment next month! Obviously she was shocked but delighted with the news as was her bf.
Now the real issues begin. BF has admitted the relationship to the family which they begrudging accepted on the condition that DD learns urdu, she has no problem with that.
BF then has to admit a week later that DD is in fact preganant and as you can imagine all hell broke loose. His sister even phoned DD to plead with her to have an abortion not realising she is in fact 14 weeks pregnant now. She has since apologised but I still find it unforgiveable.
His parents then say they will accept 'things' if they can marry quickly, ie in the next few weeks! My DD was not against this although it was not what she would have ideally wanted but then came the further demands. After the wedding she had to move in with his family, this was flatly refused. DD has always maintained she wanted to stay at home until the baby is born and for a few months after and then either buy or rent a house together. His parents will not compromise. They have not contacted me which I find very disrespectful and feel that it them making all the demands. I realise it is a cultural thing but surely compromises have to be met?

BF has now not contacted DD and she is very down and upset, he said some very hurtful things to her in anger but feels she has compromised enough in agreeing to marry but sticking to original plans. I would welcome anyone views on this situation. BF family have said they will not accept DD or baby if they are not married before the birth and living together.

Please help!!

How can anyone say what the future holds?

DD has said she doesn't want to deny him seeing the baby IF he is going to be consistent, reliable and certain measures are put in place to guarantee safety/abduction issues. If there are no guarantees that will happen then she would rather raise the baby alone with no input (including financial).

How do SS expect her to answer a question that she honestly can't? She has no ideas of his intentions and given his past track record I wouldn't rate any of the things she is asking as being his 'strong' points.

If I am asked my opinion I am told I am biased because of my past, if I don't offer an opinion I am accused of being uninterested, I am in a no win situation.

Surely SS want assurances from your daughter that she will do everything to keep the baby away from their father?

diddl, that is exactly what I have said to her.

As SS have made it clear that they will be telling him what her intentions are regarding baby I think to some extent, she is still scared of upsetting him which is why she is reluctant to say what I am sure they want to hear.

Meant to add, I strongly believe that whatever she says now about not denying him the right to see the baby will fly right out of the window the minute she holds her baby in her arms.

Nothing is stronger than the instinct to protect our children but until it happens it is hard to explain to anyone!

Poor FG2B, this is just what you and your daughter don't need - more pressure. Have the useless SS people seen your daughter's witness statement? Even if she doesn't think she's suffered abuse, her witness statement should make it clear that she has, particularly to SS, who should be used to dealing with situations like this. And have they considered his criminal record, for goodness' sake?

They should be doing their level best to make sure he doesn't even find out where she and the baby are living. Am I naive in thinking that child protection trumps everything else?

They should also know that women who have suffered abuse are often reluctant to act, and are usually still afraid of the abuser. There's plenty of literature on the subject, FGS.

Yes, let´s hope so!

Is there anything that they need to put in place & that´s why they need/want an answer ASAP?

When you are on the outside it just seems so simple & so hard to understand why she wouldn´t just want nothing more to do with him & to keep her baby away at all costs.

I think the underlying issue is that she knows the she is always going to be in some way linked to him via the baby. She has suffered 'control' and abuse for so long that until that is addressed I can't see a way of moving forward. I believe she feels that even when she has the baby he will still have 'control' to a degree.

SS have made it clear they have to expain to him about parental responsibility, which I think is wrong. Let him pay for legal advice, as we have had to, if its something he is interested in.

I had faith in the SS after the initial visit but now am not so sure. I have looked at the 'Pre-Birth core assessment' which is what they are doing but there are no 'right or wrong' answers it will depend on how the individual interprets what is said to them.

Another factor is that when I was was pregnant with DD I left her 'father' but it was not due to abuse of any kind, I just woke up and realised what a waste of space he was! He remained in contact during the pregnancy and was with me at the birth and made regular visits to see us, but I knew the relationship wasn't right. He did try and exert some control and being from a different culture I could foresee insurmountable problems if I returned to the relationship.

After a disagreement one day he made the remark, 'you do realise I could take DD to [...] and you would never see her again. That one comment was enough for me to disappear.

I then met and married a wonderful man who lawfully adopted DD and was a fantastic father to her and eventually her younger sister. The marriage didn't work out but he remained a good father throughout.

DD has said she has to a degree always resented me for not letting her 'biological' father be a part of her life. I got in contact with him when she was 18 and gave her the choice of what she wanted to do. She has seen now that he is a waste of time but still doesn't comprehend or understand why I did what I did. It was purely and simply to protect her.

DD doesn't want her baby to resent her if she doesn't allow contact which in a way makes sense but the circumstances were so different.

OMG I don't believe it....

Ex has managed to get her new number from Orange and just called. She is distraught but didn't have time to talk. She has begged me not to tell the police because he has now broken the terms of the injunction, I need to know what to do???

Please someone advise me, I don't want to abuse her trust but neither do I want her upset like she is now.

Furious I'm so sorry this terrible situation is still up and down. Unfortunately, until your DD has her baby it will be really difficult for her to know what she wants or make any decisions. She is probably holding out, however irrationally, for some happy family scenario deep down. Until very recently, that is what she expected. She has had to make the transition from that to recognising she has been in an abusive relationship, that the relationship is over and that now her baby may not have her father in her life.

Even when she holds her baby in her arms it might still be difficult to realise that her ex is a threat as she has been conditioned out of trusting her own judgement for years. The natural idea that having the father around is 'best' for her baby may also prevail for some time. What will give her a light bulb moment, is the first time she feels the threat of him taking her child away from her. No way will she ever let that happen.

I guess what I'm saying is that it may be some time before your DD has come to terms with all this and is confident in her own choices for her child. That time will come, meanwhile you have her corner even if she doesn't always realise it.

I do hope you are finding a way to get some support or counselling for yourself? You continue to be the one anchor throughout all this, just amazing and I wish I could send you virtual strength.

OMG, that´s terrible.

The police should be told imo, but how to convince your daughter?

"How do SS expect her to answer a question that she honestly can't?"

TBH, an Abuser is an abuser. To the rest of us, we KNOW that this man will never change. We KNOW she has to keep him away from her , from you and from the baby. in any and every way she can.

HER past clearly HAS influenced her thinking on this. HOWEVER, if you have the chance to explain that due to ONE threat you had to act to save your DD, and that her Ex is categorically dangerous to her, to her unborn DC and to you. He/his family could do untold horrors to any one or all of you.

As far as a future plan I think the best thing is to say that she is going to act in the best interests of her DC at all times and that if (in accordance with the thinking of SS) that requires legal measures to keep him away from her, she will support that. If this Ex has a valid case and reason to be allowed contact through court, that she will also seek legal advice and see what the options are.

WRT the telephone call, you need to explain that SS will NOT trust her, the police and courts will not trust her if she is not 100% honest with them.

That call IS against the law, he is now intimidating her, he has no respect for the law, he's been inside TWICE, he knows the system. He doesn't care for her safety, her feelings or the consequences of authority. This makes him EXTREMELY DANGEROUS.

Is your DD with you? can you go to her? You need to remove the Orange sim and get a new number AGAIN.

I am EXTREMELY concerned for you and for your DD. Please call Gerrie? you need to get some metaphorical big guns involved. She may be able to help you, or at least point you in the right direction.

Just seen your latest post Furious. Dreadful situation as you're stuffed whatever you do. Maybe there another way of it being reported without you overtly doing it. Would it be possible to register something with Orange that says the number must be changed and cannot be given out because of threats to personal safety. Maybe they have some system where they have to tell the police when there is an injuction involved?

Hissy they were my thoughts exactly. If I contact the police then SS may 'lose' trust in her ability to parent her baby safely. Have texted her told her we need to speak extremely urgently as SHE has to make the call, as a last resort I will but would rather it not come to that.

Hissy is right, SS have to know you are 100% honest if you are to keep them on side an DD has to have confidence in her own decisions. Ignore my previous post, possibly the line to take with DD is that protecting her baby starts NOW.

call WA for some anonymous advice.

OK.

Thinking like a twatface here.

If he calls her and she takes the call and doesn't report it...

They go to court. He produces PROOF of his call, and her failure to report it. IT COULD BE USED AGAINST HER.

He may have done this on purpose to deliberately undermine her case, or simply to see how much MORE intimidation he can exert on her.

She has to show him at every single point, on every single second that HE IS TO STAY AWAY FROM HER.

Hissy they were my thoughts exactly! Are you sure we weren't twins seperated at birth?

We are sisters of survival love, we both have the power to read what these vile little men could do, worst case scenario.

I'm sure he probably ISN'T that clever, but WE are. We have to see the bigger picture. We have to crush the BUG that he is.

You may not like it, but I do start to wonder about her hability to protect the baby and herself, from what you say.

Could you tell the police that she has shown you the evidence of the phone call (so she hasn't hidden it), and is very scared and upset, and so too traumatised to go to the police herself?

Exactly what Hissy said. You have to tell the police "on her behalf" otherwise she might not be taken seriously in the future.

All this "upset" has happened over a relatively short space of time and she must still have feelings for him and her emotions are on a knife edge.

As to what Lueji said, that is a very good point, if she is not seen to be taking his threats seriously, SS will wonder if she is able to adequately protect the baby.
What an absolute nightmare for you.

Good news! Am so proud of DD she has been to the police and reported it. They are due to come any time now for witness statements.

DD said quite firmly his hold over her ends here and now and she will never allow him anywhere near her baby.

Please everyone keep your fingers crossed that the maximum sentence is imposed of 5 years in prison for the breaking of the order.

fingers crossed here. People like her ex often believe that they are above the law, and need evidence to prove otherwise.
Although I would imagine his version will place him as the victim.
So so glad that your DD has reported this, you must feel very proud of her for being so brave.