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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Need clarification re husband and I was asleep

228 replies

beautifulrelease · 15/03/2012 13:07

So I've been reading the 3 panda's thread and have tried to ring rape crisis just for a bit of clarification. Have namechanged today but I have posted on the other thread a few times (I'm not curiousgeorgie).

Not as serious as three pandas situation but it's still bothering me. I have frequently woken up to find my husband touching me up, breasts, mastarbating me, no penetration. I have asked him not to but he falls back to sleep and carries on.

I have woken up to find him 'in me' but this was very early days in my relationship and he was my 1st and only sexual relationship so I thought maybe this is what you do Blush so I let him carry on.

I have asked him to stop waking me in the night but he says he's asleep, I have little ones so sleep is precious and I still have nightmares about previous abuse and waking up to be groped after dreaming about it is quite alarming!

Have talked this through with someone who I feel I can trust and she says that my DH and sex aren't the issue, it's my past getting in the way of having a healthy sexual relationship. Please can you help me clear this up as I'm very confused whether being pissed off with him is right or not? Thank you lovelies x

OP posts:
BertieBotts · 15/03/2012 13:59

He needs to see his gp if he is doing this in his sleep. They may be able to provide medication or some other kind of treatment.

CailinDana · 15/03/2012 14:02

Beautiful, if you suggested getting help, do you think he would? Or would he call you a freak again? Until he gets help, do you think it would be a good idea to sleep in a separate bed?

malinkey · 15/03/2012 14:02

Do you really think he is asleep and has been asleep every time this has happened? It's just he doesn't sound that apologetic or worried about the effect it's having on you. And I don't think your past abuse is a red herring. I think that should make him treat you extra specially kindly ie if this was a bizarre thing that did happen when he was asleep he would be doing everything in his power to sort it out and be bending over backwards to apologise to you, sleeping in separate beds, finding out for himself how to sort out his problem.

As he doesn't appear to be doing any of these things it seems like he's not that bothered that he's upsetting you. Sorry.

And your friend should know better. Rape in marriage isn't allowed any more

I would try and ring Rape Crisis again for their point of view. The lines are apparently only open at 12-2.30pm and 7-9.30.

garlicbutter · 15/03/2012 14:03

He can tell his GP his sleeping behaviours upset you and ask to be referred to a sleep clinic. Does he do other physical things while asleep, like sleepwalking or holding one-sided conversations, etc? Activities while asleep are called parasomnias, if you want to look it up.

What it sounds like to me is what you thought - lack of respect for your body and your right to choose what happens to it. Sure, he might test the water while half asleep, with a bit of a stroke or a kiss, but if you tell him No or nudge him away, that's you withholding consent and you need him to respect that.

Going on to finger you is out of order - in fact, if you've woken him up enough to hear you, and you've told him No, it's assault :(

I'm hoping he simply doesn't realise that - and will do now - but you're the only judge of that.
Your friend sounds a bit of a twit.

Lueji · 15/03/2012 14:06

Not sure I understand it. He has an excuse (finding you attractive) but he's doing it in his sleep?
How can he explain it if he is asleep?

TBH if ex had tried anything similar while I was asleep, particularly if more than once, I'm not sure he'd still be able to have kids. Angry

Not sure how anyone could think this type of behaviour is normal.

NettleTea · 15/03/2012 14:08

When I said red herring I meant it in the way that it might make her judge something as abnormal that wasnt - ie the inappropriate boundaries, and also the friend saying it was the cause of the problem - might make OP look at hersel as the problem rather than what her H is doing.
I agree though, the knowledge of the past abuse should make hime MORE careful in how he relates sexually to her, and make sure he has very clear messages to proceed.
Also if he is doing this in his sleep I dont see why he isnt voluntarily going to the GP to get help - I would be horrified if I was at risk of bringing up past traumas due to a medical issue. our local hospital has a dedicated sleep clinic, so it isnt always private practice. I would definately insist on seperate beds until he addresses it, you are not a freak by any means

malinkey · 15/03/2012 14:10

Oh, I forgot to say, I did see a programme a while ago about people with sleep disorders and one of them was about a man who was quite aggressively sexual with his wife when he was asleep. He was mortified about what he was doing. I can't remember what happened in the end but I think he was given some kind of medication.

But I'm really not convinced this is what is happening in your case and even if it was, he's still not sorry enough.

2rebecca · 15/03/2012 14:11

Agree with garlic butter. Using "I love you and you are very attractive" as an excuse is pathetic. Loving someone includes respecting thier opinions. If my husband once tried this it would be a sharp slap and him being angrily shaken awake, although I really can't believe you could finger someone whilst asleep. If it persisted it would be seperate beds if I really believed he was asleep and the relationship was otherwise good, separation if he just didn't love me or respect me enough to stop violating me.

attheendoftheday · 15/03/2012 14:16

If he's genuinely doing this in his sleep, then the onus should be on him to go and sleep elsewhere. It's the man's responsibility not to rape, not the woman's responsibility not to be raped, iyswim.

If he was asleep, I'd expect him to be quite horrified by his own actions, was he? If not, then I'd have some serious questions to ask.

Original poster
beautifulrelease · 15/03/2012 14:19

Friend said it needs addressing as 'one of you aren't happy with it'. I'm struggling to type, think and my head is making excuses and basically making me feel like an overreacting whore. That's familiar. If it hadn't been for 3 pandas I wouldn't have questioned it :-( I should probably namechange back now, thanks everyone xx

OP posts:
Original poster
beautifulrelease · 15/03/2012 14:20

I haven't left the house all week Sad poor DS's, must shower x

OP posts:
malinkey · 15/03/2012 14:21

You aren't overreacting and Rape Crisis are there if you want to talk it through with them.

NarkedPuffin · 15/03/2012 14:22

Assuming that he is genuinely, 100% fast asleep, you need to sleep in separate beds and he needs to realise that his behaviour is not a compliment, it's a serious issue. Does he have a history of sleepwalking?

Original poster
beautifulrelease · 15/03/2012 14:24

No sleep walking, sleep talking, just not waking up for work Hmm and sleep apnea x

OP posts:
Charbon · 15/03/2012 14:45

Okay I'm going to be honest here.

I don't believe him

I think he knows exactly what he's doing and is doing it anyway. I think this excuse about a sleep disorder is bollocks. If he even believed it himself for a second he would sleep elsewhere because he would be horrified and he would be getting treatment.

He is assaulting you and he knows it.

CailinDana · 15/03/2012 14:51

I have to agree with Charbon I'm afraid.

Why would you call yourself an "overreacting whore"? Please don't do that. Have you had any counselling for the abuse you experienced?

Charbon · 15/03/2012 15:38

Oh and that 'friend' you're talking to is no friend of yours. She needs to keep away from advising anyone about their relationships, if she thinks this is a normal or healthy sexual relationship, or that it's even remotely acceptable to pass the blame on to you for projecting your earlier abuse on to your marriage. Don't talk to her again about this. Keep trying Rape Crisis instead.

Original poster
beautifulrelease · 15/03/2012 16:15

Just to let you know I have spoken to friend and she isn't condoning it. Sounds like they're (elders) will be coming round to help, probably next week. I don't think I've been clear about what he was doing in the past. I will update but have asked this thread to be deleted as DH is IT engineer and knows I'm a mumsnetter, many thanks though. I'll stay safe and I'll be around anyway, thank you lovelies x

OP posts:
CailinDana · 15/03/2012 16:16

Good luck beautiful, I hope things go well for you.

Smellslikecatspee · 15/03/2012 16:20

Ok while there are sleep disorders where you/he/they do things that they really don?t realise (and I am not including sleep talking/ failing about in your sleep) but actually sexsomnia is extremely rare.

We all had a situation where we?ve nudged or been nudged by someone asleep, it will be one action followed by some muttering etc. to sexually molest or rape someone while asleep takes a series of different actions

And more to the point most sufferers don?t actually remember what happened.

Sleep apnoea, not so rare, but there is no known link between the two. It?s chicken and egg. And as sleep apnoea causes disruption of the sleep pattern while sufferers can fall asleep very fast they can be rouse easily.
I know I not only live with one I also have worked in a sleep disorder clinic.

I can?t imagine how you are feeling right now, and I am so sorry this is happening in your life.

But honestly him claiming to be asleep and not knowing????CRAP.

I made (yes made) OH seek treatment for his sleep issues, he now has Bipap (basically a machine that pushes air down his nose) the 2nd night he had this treatment he went in to a very deep sleep, understandable considering that he hadn?t had a ?proper? nights sleep in years. At one point he rolled over and threw his arm & leg over me. I have a bad back and was complaining the next morning that I was really stiff, he asked why I explained that he had more or less pinned me down and I couldn?t move him.

He was mortified we didn?t have a spare bed at the time so he insisted on sleeping on the floor for the rest of the week till he had caught up.

What he is doing is wrong, what your friend is telling you is wrong

Please be careful and look after yourself. it maybe that once you start questioning that things will be become more nasty, you need to protect yourself.

Gay40 · 15/03/2012 16:25

I think the chances of it being sexsomnia are about 1 in a million. Some men just prefer to fuck an unconscious woman. It honestly is not normal behaviour in a loving adult relationship, no matter how "good he is with the kids".
He's not asleep. He just doesn't want or need your consent.

ledkr · 15/03/2012 16:33

MN today is actually quite depressing.Im in my 40's and presume these 2 threads involve younger women than me.What are we doing wrong to bring up a generation of women who actually have to question this behaviour? Sad

beautifulwho · 15/03/2012 16:36

I agree, I think the OP is off to look at some lighted threads and wondering how long it takes to get a thread deleted around here hello MNHQ?

Heleninahandcart · 15/03/2012 17:07

Beautiful this is not normal. I also think he knows that he is doing and that is getting sex that he believes he is entitled to. It has nothing to do with him being unable to control his attraction for you but shows total disrespect. Worse still he is implying there is something wrong with you for questioning his sick behavior.

I understand you will take advice from elders but pls listen to the wise women or here too as sometimes even those who should know better get it wrong. Many still believe a husband is somehow entitled to his wife's body Sad

babyhammock · 15/03/2012 18:27

If he was 'genuinely' asleep he'd be mortified at what he was doing.. He isn't and the fact that he using you being too attractive says it all... he knows what he is doing :(