Advice on DH using prostitutes and sex

[oldaninpurple]

Ok. I'll try to be brief as I could do without being outed in RL. Really great relationship, 2 young DC's. DH has expressed frustration that our sex life is perhaps not as exciting as it used to be.

Our children are potentially likely to come toddling across the landing and I find it hard to relax and get into anything 'indepth' and do get a bit nervous about the noise. DH is very noisy! I'm still doing a night feed with the littlest one but thought we were doing ok intimacy wise but it seems I was wrong :(

I've recently found out DH has been using prostitutes. Definately once in the past month but I reckon it must be more.. What do I do? I haven't said or done anything yet.

I'm a bit in shock, I almost convinced myself to book a hotel and whisk him off to recapture our earlier years but WTF? He's paying another woman to.. Well, just well! Could you\would you forgive? Apart from an obvious STI check :( what would you do?

Thanks.

If it was "just a transaction between 2 consenting adults" you wouldn't be so upset and have your GP offering you Prozac.

Just take one day at a time. Does your DH know you know?

Dinah,

I don't give a shit about some of the men I shagged in my youth either, but i disagree sex is just sex.

The difference is, the men I shagged I did for free, because at the time i actually fancied them and wanted to.

I didn't do it because they were paying me and i wasn't pretending to like them. I wasn't in a relationship with someone else and I wasn't deceiving anyone.

That is not the same as a man deliberately trawling the net for a particular woman he fancies or one that will provide him with a specific act that he desires. Doing it secretly behind his wife's back, knowing full well that she thinks they are both committed and faithful. This is an act than is well thought out and planned. I would be the most upset thinking why the hell did my dp do this in the cold light of day, sober and with not a thought for me. Can't even explain the demon drink or woman coming on to him or some bullshit. Totally premeditated.

Having said this though, I do think that some men really(as ridiculous as it sounds) think that they are doing the dw's a favour by only having sex with a prostitute and not a love affair. Some men really can compartmentalise their lives in this way. And I really think some outwardly 'decent' men do believe that they are just fulfilling a need and they are convinced that this is kinder some way. I guess we have no way of knowing if we are married to a man like this until he does what the OP's dh has done. The only difference is most of us, once discovering such a thing would bin him off.

I would be horrified if I were to discover that my DP viewed our relationship so massively different to how I did. And to think he was doing me some kind of huge favour by only paying for sex when actually, lucky for me, he could be in love with another woman. Wow, how thoughtful.

Wow, not only has he done this vile thing but he's completely rationalised it. I think OP even if you believed that prostitution was okay and that women loved it really, can you really every get over the betrayal? You must feel like you don't know this man.

... specialist erotic practitioners ...

Since you've very courageously engaged with the wider topic your problem has sparked, oldan, may I add to it? Your H's (hypocritically made) point is one of the reasons I'm not all for banning sex trades. Sex therapy, for example, is prostitution with a planned, beneficial intent. There are people who might never experience sex without hiring a partner. Some people have such a narrowly-expressed sexuality, their chances of finding a partner who would be both personally and sexually compatible are miniscule. In my view there are good reasons for sex trades to exist, as well as all the bad ones!

It's common for punters to excuse their paid-for abuses with these arguments. But, in a case where the real reason was therapeutic, the transaction would be made openly wouldn't it? It would be no more difficult than discussing a decision to go to psychotherapy or Relate, for example.

Obviously, this is not the case with your devious husband.
He's lied about where he went.
He's secretly spent family money.
He's pretended he wouldn't do it.
He's tried to persuade you it's not so bad.
He's shagged someone else and lied about that.
He's implied that you are faulty.

... All of which are precisely what unfaithful partners have always done, the world over. If he's paid Kinky Kate £150 for her service, that could have been a £150 dinner with Nice Nina, the office admin, or a necklace for Nina. The only difference here is his choice to pay straight out. That he wants you to consider this 'impersonal', he wants you to think he stuck his dick a non-person.

I don't think he did: do you?

Op I do feel so, so sorry for you and the pain must be unimaginable. Why the hell though have you not confronted him properly??

particularly over his reply about using prostitutes!! The man is deluded. He really is one of those men who rather than trouble his lovely little wife with a particular sex act, will buy it instead off a woman that 'enjoys' it. Strewth.

I would be incensed!!!
Err what's wrong with discussing things you like sexually and doing them with your partner? Or if your sexual preferences are so dissimilar then you have to ask yourself if you are in the right relationship.

I could be in relationship with a man who rather than 'burden' me sexually went off and got his kicks elsewhere rather than trouble or offend me. Is this the 1950's or something?

I don't give a shit about some of the men I shagged in my youth either, but i disagree sex is just sex. The difference is, the men I shagged I did for free, because at the time i actually fancied them and wanted to. I didn't do it because they were paying me and i wasn't pretending to like them. I wasn't in a relationship with someone else and I wasn't deceiving anyone.

This is exactly why I decided not to go through with my 'pretty woman' experiment, carmen. I was sat facing this bloke who looked like everybody's uncle: nice enough chap; definitely married; who wanted to pay to use my body as a sex aid. It wasn't just sex all of a sudden, it was cold and repugnant.

It was presumably the 'impersonal' aspect of it that turned me away. The only possible justification this ordinary man could give himself would be that I am not a person. He'd chatted to me for twenty minutes but, nevertheless, he saw me as an object he could use for an hour's fucking. I am not an object. I am a person. Therefore, any transaction would be false ... and I wouldn't have been having sex with him. I'd have been letting him use me. For money.

At least, with a random social shag, the use is mutual and equal. Translating that into money unbalances the equation - he's no longer a sex partner but a user.

Absolutely, garlicbutter. Sounds like you had a lucky escape.

I guess most men who pay for sex are similar the man that you describe. Although many prostitutes claim to really enjoy sex with them .

The thing is, if I really had to, I could put on a convincing display that i was enjoying sex with a man who was repulsive(well maybe not repulsive!), but it would take a hell of a lot of money. LIke a life changing amount.

Objectification is objectification, whether you do it for money or sexual pleasure. If you shag someone to whom you are attracted but neither know nor like as a person, you are using one another as a wank sock/dildo. To me objectification is a part of human nature. Both sexes treat the opposite sex as both a sex object and as a real person. However, some feminists seem to have a problem with this. I think the "diet coke break" ad recognises that females also like objectifying men. The man in this ad was clearly not being viewed as a "real person" but as a rather desirable collection of body parts. I don't think that all the women who enjoyed the ad could not see men as "real people".

Why do men who use prostitutes not care that the woman they are paying to fuck doesn't fancy them or even like them. Would be cheaper, easier and less risky to just have a wank.

They seem to be very cold fish indeed.

This idea that men who pay for sex are kindly souls for not troubling the 'decent' women in their lives to indulge their sexual desires is a big fat manipulative lie. The husband's response also vividly illustrates that he sees women as either those in the 'sex class' or 'decent women'. He can dress it up all he likes by calling prostituted women 'specialists' but he has absolutely no respect for the women performing those services.

He would also cough and splutter if he heard that his wife didn't want to trouble him with her 'specialist' needs so had secretly used £150-200 of the budget on renting out a man who could provide that service. Would he be so benevolent and understanding then?

Men like this don't even want to give their partners the opportunity to have that kind of sex. They cover this madonna/whore complex by pretending to complain about the lack of exciting and noisy sex, but in reality they do not want the mother of their children to be 'that woman'. But they have to manipulate her and set her up to fail by insisting that they have a particular kind of sex at times when they know she will say no. And so when they go off and find a woman who will do those things, they trade on women's tendency to blame themselves for a man's behaviour.

Before buying into these myths about men having 'specialist needs' that need catering for by a 'specialist service', look at this logically.

If you were someone who thought that your wife had sexual needs of her own and accorded equal importance to them as yours, would you instigate a conversation about both of your needs and how they will be met in the relationship? Would you feel the same way as your wife that it's sometimes difficult to have the sex you'd like when the children are around? Would you suggest or arrange babysitters? Would you seek your wife's agreement to some protected, uninterrupted couple time?

Or would you blame her excusively for the lack of exciting sex, never ask her what she needs sexually, make sure that sex is never on the menu when it's possible to be uninhibited and instead use the money that could be spent on babysitters/a night away on a prostituted woman, making sure that you kept this activity and expenditure secret from your wife?

Which strategy is more likely to ensure that both partners' sexual needs are met within the relationship? Which strategy is the most manipulative and disingenuous?

OP you sound cowed and afraid of your husband. You've let him construct a ludicrous defence for 'men's needs' without any challenge. You've also now seen him lie to your face. I hope you get the strength to confront him and challenge his attitudes - and the strength to decide that you are worth so much more than having a man like this in your life.

Ok.. To amswer a few of the questions

Yes he is a liar, cheater, hypocrite and sadly a little delusional. I haven't confronted him because I don't honestly know what I want to do.

My views on the sex trade were naieve, I thought there were those who were coerced or forced into it through addiction or violence and then those who chose to do it and were a little more professional. I was appalled by men who used the first category and held a mild distate for those who paid for the second. I never considered the mind set of a man who used either.

He isn't looking (I don't think) for anything outside of what used to be our sex life. I was his kinky katie before we had our second DC and feel irrationally upset he has replaced me in that regard and is paying for it. Our sex life is now intimate but when he hears "will you just shush" in his ear for the 10th time, he rightly assumes this time it isn't going to be anything more than vanilla.

I won't be taking Prozac, I can cope. I just don't think the GP knew what to say

Can I forgive? I don't know.

Is he the person I thought he was! Nope.
Is this about the sex\cheating... In part
Is this about his view of women.. More so.
If he had been an affair would it have been over? Yes without a backward glance.

This is where I have got to, trying to process what I know.

To those who mentioned Porn, yes there are some sites he has login details to in the back of his diary, but that's not new.

What do you think he would do if I told him I was putting the baby in nursery and going to set up as a specialist erotic practitioner. He would probably splutter into his coffee but if its just transactional, he shouldn't mind too much should he? I won't do it, but I may ask his view? :)

How old is your youngest child?

crackfox 11 months.

Old,

I would just tell him that you have a fetish for very large penises and you have found a "practitioner" who can accommodate you.

By the way, are you 100% sure he was making this booking for himself and not for the friend he mentioned to you?

'He reply confused me even more.. It was long and complex but basically its a transaction between two consenting adults who each gain but he wouldn't personally indulge. He feels there are some men who have desires that fall outside of the realms of a loving sexual relationship and that specialist erotic practitioners (yes he did really say that) are beneficial in those circumstances and relieve loved ones of an uncomfortable burden!'

That's such a cold answer. At least you know now that he won't be sorry for his actions, he thinks he's doing you a favour by seeing prostitutes.

Jesus, OP. Your baby isn't even a year old and such a short time without your old sex life leads him to seek his kinky katie elsewhere. Wow.

What about if it all gets back on track and then you have another baby or there is another blip in your sex life or you get ill or go through the menopause. Will he have to seek help elsewhere again when you can't (temporarily) provide?

Agree totally with hatty.

oldaninpurple has he ever asked you what you want and need from your sex life? If so how does he try to accommodate you?

Why do you think it's irrational to be upset that you've had the opportunity to have the sex you want taken away from you and contracted out to someone else?

Where are your needs in all this?

And yes, he absolutely totally believes that he is doing you a favour by seeing hookers.

Doesn't want to trouble poor little wife with dirty noisy sex when you are busy with babies.

ANd being a thoroughly decent chap, he would never ruin his happy family by having an affair.

Go it makes me mad and it's not even me.

And is there any resonance in my hypothesis that he actually doesn't want you to be 'kinky Katie' and sets you up to fail so that he can get some other woman to perform that role?

Has he ever done anything actively to create the circumstances where you could?

He sounds sociopathic.

Op, what he should have done is use that money to arrange nights/weekends away with you to be together. Not Kinky Katie FFS.

It would be a deal breaker for me.

I sincerely hope you find the strength to deal with this horrible situation he has put you in.

Larry, in reply to your 14:29 post, my personal experiences trump your theories imo. I'm not promoting an agenda so much as telling stories about myself and my friends. I think my experiences are more likely than yours to cast light on prostitution from the workers' point of view.

I could be wrong, though. Do you hire your body out for strangers to shove things in your orifices? How many times have you invited a recent acquaintance to stick his penis in you, just for fun? If I've misread you and you are, in fact, a gay male prostitute, I shall feel bound to honour your opinions rather more than I do.

Sorry, OP, will go back and catch up now!

Oh op!

He has clearly been thinking about it a lot to rationalize and justify it to himself.

I think his reasoning wouldn't suddenly disappear if you told him you knew, he's always going to feel that way i believe. I don't think i could trust him again as he really does think its ok and so will do it again and again.

I think when you tell him you know his reaction will be sad that you are upset but not shame or regret at what he has done.

As for the Dr, they were probably gutted for you.

You could always tell him that sexually he isn't cutting the mustard and you are bored by his efforts........

I mean, REALLY, he could have used the money to pay for a hotel and you both could have reconnected.

However OP I think his kinks might be very specialist indeed because he has gone out of his way to have them seen to.

Are you sure he had sex?

I've been dying to ask but it's rude and beside the point
Does this noisy sex involve him crying out in pain?