Support thread for those in Emotionally abusive relationships number 7

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Financial abuse Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.

p.s.s the post i was talking about was by findingmysong (i honestly could have written most of it myself!) when you said He always said everything was fine unless I was in a mood and there were no issues in the reltionship except the ones I created
my ex p actually made me go to counselling becasue he said i was depressed and i was teh one ruining the relationship. even after we split and he apologised saying he realises how bad he treated me he says it´s still both our fault . i now know he isn´t sorry because 2 weeks after he said that he assaulted me... wanker!! but remember there is no exuse for their behaviour!!! u deserve better. xxx

thebighouse remember that your ex saying he is suicidal etc is another form of abuse. he is trying to contorl you by making u feel sorry for him.
my ex is also ´depressed´and used it as his exuse for a quite a while, along with being tired and stresed out from working so hard to look after me and DC. i feel for it for a quite a long time. until he got more and more agressive and i thought..u know what i´m tried, i work hard, i get up through the night while u snore away, u piss me off too but i don´t intimidate u, throw things at u, push u, shout in your face. ... ahh and relax

sorry for hijacking btw lol!

sunrise, not possible to hijack this thread, it has many subjects running at the same time. It belongs to everyone. I frequently crash in and spill out all over the thread... well not so much as I used to thankfully, but you know what I mean. You'll see if you read back on the previous threads...

Sunrise, please start with reading the links at the top of the thread. This will show you that we ALL live with a charming man to others and hateful to us, the suicide thing, the blah blah blah... they are ALL the same.

I would also suggest that you do the Freedom Programme, it will reinforce how abusers are all cut from the same cloth, and how it's not about you at all.

Once you realise this you can start to heal.

I'd also suggest you read WHY DOES HE DO THAT by Lundy Bancroft. It's a marvellous book and will really help you understand what happened to you.

Welcome love, please feel free to post whatever and whenever you wish.

a1b2 I do realise btw that them complaining can be subjectively a big deal, if one has not yet attained detachment. And of course with DC involved him complaining can make it worse.

hello sunrise :)

and also IMO detachment comes and goes...I'm ok most of the time and then wollopIi'm all over the place again....the gaps are getting bigger though!

Hello again, wrote long post but it dissapeared.

To summarise, it's not just he'll complain, he'll do something to show he can control some other way.

e.g after he started argument where I just said no to an unreasonable request (paying one of his bills), as little as possible words, he started tiride of abuse, about how lazy I am, only work part time, etc etc. he wouldn't leave inside hallway, when I finally got him to leave he kicked the door. (First time he had ever done anything like that, presents himself to the world as very respectable and calm.) Children were upstairs upset and comforting each other. I then told him he must collect kids from doorstep, in future, not come in.

So he waited a few weeks then started another argument, would have meant I had to either give in or say something. Usually nowadays I have learned to ignore. I started shoutingmay have raised my voice a little, that is what he wanted. Then he told children he won't come to the door any more as mum always argues. He texts them (not me) when he is a little way down the road and I watch to check they get to him ok, he texts to tell me not to spy on him.

Another time as i said upthread, and I think this is the worst thing recently and means he'll do things he wouldn't previously relating to dcs, he ignored my "no", tried to just take dc. He told another DC to fetch something he needed for DC he wanted to take, overiding me. Not taking no for an answer.

So what will he do next time I say no to something (this holiday)? Take them in camper van anyway, by asking to have them day before and not bringing them back? Come in car for afternoon outing then say here's a surprise children, we are going to drive to the camper van and go anyway? Text them to say meet me down the road and don't listen to/or even don't tell mum? Something else entirely?

This has always been the problem, what will he do next?

Oops turned out long post again.

a1b2 you need to get a bit of control back. He is not the boss of you!

You should take the plunge and get the contact arrangements set out in a legal agreement. Then if he breaks this and doesn't bring back your DC when he should you can ask the police for help as I understand it. Don't let him dictate how he wants it to be.

Have you got their passports and Birth certificates safely somewhere? Just for peace of mind!

hello sunrise btw.

onthe, pink. I do see what you mean about detatcment. I find it's ok for a while then really it is sort of "wallop". At first I couldn't detatch at all, always had to try to get him see my point of view. Also tried to placate him. I think in Lundy B, it says something like however you try to explain it (to an abusive man), in however many ways, he will never see your point of view.

Thank you so much for your help today.

x posts little house.

hi

Shameless hijack here.

My emotionally abusive ex is due to pay me the financial settlement that will terminate our relationship and allow me a fresh start by 4pm tomorrow (Monday)

as I completely expected, he threw his toys out of the pram last thing Friday.

I can tell it's killing him to perform the final act that will make me free from him and end this once and for all.

I haven't risen to his bait and he has no ground to stand on but I am still on tenterhooks until 4pm tomorrow.

Hand hold please.

It will all be fine it will all be fine it will all be fine!

snoop have you got plans? And as Hissy said you cant hijack this thread it belongs to everybody who needs it

I'll hold yours if you'll hold mine

Not so far along that particular path, but Form E's due in this week.

snoopdog he threw his toys out the pram because for once, he cannot control things in exactly the way he wants. Think how far you have come and how long I should think it has taken, and all the difficult things you have had to do to get this far. And then think, not much longer now, nearly there, in a short time. Tommorow at 4pm you can finally move on properly. Even if he tries to delay, which he probably won't because it will make him look bad to official people, (I bet he cares how he looks to others?), there will be steps you can take, it will take a tiny fraction as long as it has already taken. Still yet, really, it is most probable that in just 17 hours you can start to make that fresh start, and feel such relief. (I have had similar experience re settlement).

littlehouse I know you are right and if I had put the wheels in motion before, I wouldn't be having to worry so much now.

snoop. I am not wanting to scare you, merely trying to prepare you, so that you can remain as calm as possible.

I know you are nervous, I know you are scared. Both of him perhaps, but of the future.

Things could get an awful lot weirder as far as he is concerned before the settlement happens, so be ready.

Starting now you have to detach. Know that there may be a show being put on tomorrow, and that it'll get strange for a while until it's over.

Learn to observe your situation and him from afar. SPECTATE YOUR LIFE UNTIL THIS IS OVER. Treat it as a case study. Watch what unfolds as you'd watch something on telly.

Get the legal bods in place. expect him to delay/try all sorts of shit. ideally let THEM deal with it. Issue your requests/instructions with sub-zero calm. The more crazy things get, the more cool you will get.

You are hours away from the Grande Finale. Expect a show, but make sure you are observing, not participating. Once the show is over, you will be home and dry and more importantly FREE.

Come back and post here when it's over, you may need to decompress. If you are able to talk to us, we will be here to hear you.

Good luck love. Welcome to the start of the rest of your life!

How exciting snoopdog good luck for today

a1 I think you need to have a talk with dc's about the texting thing. Something along the lines of, you need to know what daddy is organising, if he suggests meeting etc, mummy needs to know, even if daddy is saying don't tell mummy. Secrets should only be about things like special birthday suprises and things and not about going out for the day etc. I haven't thought about the specifics, but in essence what I mean is reduce the possibility so far as possible, without scaring them, of plans being made that you are not party to iuswim. Snoop good luck today.

yes parsley, that's a good suggestion, to talk to them about telling me about arrangements he makes even if he says don't tell mummy. He hasn't so far as far as I know but:-

He once asked to take youngest DC to nearby park. He went in car, I thought "how lazy". Then he sent a text with something like "we have been a
bit naughty, not going to park, going to (somewhere further away) for a treat"

Right, I've got the women's centre number. Going to ring for solicitor appointment. Why do I feel nervous, even to do that? I'm ok for ages, then he does something to reduce me to a gibbering wreck. Must pull myself together.

cos he's playing mind games, and deliberately trying to wrong foot you. His intention is to spook you. Normal, nice people do not do this.

yes , parsley, intention is to spook me.

Women's centre gave me number of legal helpline as it's a while before appointment (made appointment as well).

They said I would be within my rights to say no to holiday re seatbelts.

Harder to argue about holiday re not giving address although I can say no to overnight re address as it is reasonable for him to give address. I should really make legal arrangements re contact and be able to argue then that he should give address. Which I am going to do at local appointment.

In any case if I say no to holiday or overnights, he would have to apply for specific issue order. (and then presumably they would agree seatbelts is a safety issue, definately, and probably re address as well).

They also said, it's the children's right to see their father, but I'm not stopping contact in general, it's about safety for this occasion.

So now I need to word a brief text to say (nice of him to want to take them on holiday?) but due to not enough seatbelts and also he still refuses to give address they won't be going. But say it in an assertive but not harsh way.

Post your draft here and we can have a look before you send it?

yes, Thank you. That's very kind. Will think and do it soon. I know no one can make decisions for me but good to have ideas and support.

Hi all. Not posted in a few days as am worried that h is cyber snooping again. At work now though so posting safely. (but quickly! Need to keep my job so I can support me and dc in our new home- the one I keep dreaming about but have not yet taken any steps to achieving )

Hello to new faces. Snoop I'll be waving some virtual pom poms for you, keep going!

Have a lot on my mind. What if its me being unreasonable, and really the problem is that we have just drifted along and now I don't want to drift/put any more effort into improving our relationship, so he is the "wronged" party? That he hasn't done anything unreasonable at all really, nothing thats worth kicking him out over? I know it shouldnt matter what the reason is for being unhappy, that if things are this miserable then I should "allow" myself the right to divorce him, but it feels so messed up. I feel like I'm badmouthing him when I talk to friends about whether or not our relationship sounds "fair", so I just dont anymore and whilst on here we are all so so supportive (I couldnt get through this without you here) I am aware that we are so attuned to seeing our husbands as emotionally abusive that we might have a bit of a skewed world view. Not suggesting that you are all raving loonies like me though

I don't want that last bit to sound offensive because it really isn't meant to be, but its something thats been on my mind.

Hope MOnday brings peace to us all in some way x

EW I actually think we are (in real life) skewed to looking for the good not the bad...that's part of how we get to be here...also why a thread like this is valuable...because others can see other abuse (even if we have difficulty seeing it for what it is in our own lives). Also we are attuned to minimising as it is how we "get by" day to day...it's much easier to see the wood for the trees once you are on the opposite hill!!!!

The dream is important, it keeps you going....but making that dream a reality would be so much better.....