first time domestic violence advice wanted

[J4J]

Should he stay or leave? I am so confused. I am married to a usually loving husband and have 4 small children. 2 days ago he became unusually angry and punched me in the face - I was knocked unconscious. It happened in front of all the children. When I came round my 4 year old daughter was holding me and crying shouting wake up. When I looked at her her first words were 'oh mummy I thought you were dead'. This is out of character for my husband. He was initially in denial and told me to get off the floor and stop pretending. It was not until my dad phoned him at work the following day and told him I was in hospital getting x-rayed that I think he realised what he did. This is a first offence so the police after arresting him when he got back from work released him with a caution. Do I let him stay in the house now. Part of me still loves him very much and another part of me is completely shocked and upset. I am really hurting inside and want things just to be normal. Statistically it may happen again but I'm not sure it will as he is a good man who needs to manage his anger but yet he knocked me out....

Stick, it is on the whole now true. They've developed a very hard line against it now.

That is good to hear Lego. Maybe my friend was someone who fell through the net. Hopefully SS will point out all that has been said in this thread.

"He did say in the 10 mins when he got back from work and before the police arrested him on monday that he is fully aware of DV statistics and what other women will be saying but that he won't do it again"

Out of interest, why does he know this?
Has he been spending his time away just looking up statistics that may or may not help his case?

Sounds like a pretty nasty piece of work tbh.

This is so sad to read. You sound like you're in shock. Like you're not grasping the reality of what he has done to you. You're visually impaired too? And he was able to punch you? For god's sake, what does that say about him?

I notice that you're avoiding so many questions. I know it's hard to face the truth when the truth is so terrible, but please, when you have time later come back and tell people the full story. I am certain there must be a history of abuse here :(

It will help to get things clear in your head.

J4J. DON'T LET THIS MAN BACK!

I know you are hurting. I know you love him. I know you want this to work beyond ALL else.

BUT (and forgive me if others have said this)

NOTHING will change for the better if you let him back into your life.

THE ONLY CHANCE you have to get him to see what he has done and to stop it is to make sure that he has NO support, NO-ONE in his corner. He has to see that the consequences of KNOCKING YOU OUT in front of your children, STEPPING OVER YOU and leaving you for all intents and purposes for DEAD* are that he leaves your life.

He may then, once he has lost everything, realise that perhaps that wasn't the best idea he ever had.

I know I am sounding flippant, but these men don't see what they do as wrong. He'll be saying that YOU had a part to play in his punching you so hard you lost consciousness. (you didn't) He'll say YOU drove him do it (ditto, you didn't)

Think about it. You've been cross, angry, furious in your life haven't you? How many people have YOU hit hard enough to KILL?

You realise that a punch that is hard enough to knock you out in one go is hard enough to kill don't you?

You'd be a statistic. you'd be the 1 of the 2 women killed this week to DV.

If he does THIS as a first attempt. What do you think he will do for the second. And there WILL be a second if you let him back.

No abuser believes he is an abuser.
It is not a badge of pride. They all deny that they are abusers. Instead the woman pushed them to it, they lost their temper, they were stressed, they didn't mean to, it was an accident etc etc etc.

I am PM'd you OP

After my father repeatedly hit my mother across the head the other night (he's sixty this year, abusers NEVER mellow either) he said it was her fault because she wouldn't shut up. He is convinced that it is not his fault.

So instead of remorse and horror at what he had done, his first response on coming home was to insist that you had to put his attack behind you.

If he was a good man, he would be honest with himself about the fact that he is no position to guarantee that this won't happen again.

Honestly, I have a bad temper, inherited from my Dad. Since I was a child he has taught me how to control it, how to manage it without hurting other people. If I ever hit out at someone in this way I would be terrified of what I was capable of, because it would show beyond any doubt that I could not control myself.

Really well done for going to see CAB and refusing to buy into his denial.

I can only imagine how hard it must be for you to look at what he has done objectively. But you must. Not a single person reading this thread has been anything other than horrified at what he's done.

My son (aged 5) saw my X (his dad) throw a dustpan brush, so hard it shattered against a door.

It didn't hit anyone. I was no where near.

X left a while after that. When he mentioned to our son about possibly coming back, my DS had nightmares for 3 days and cried and cried at the thought of the shouting coming back.

I had to promise to this boy that the man he loves will never come and live with us again.

J4J, your daughter saw you laid out like a piece of meat. She thought you were dead. You so very well could have been.

End this now. For her. for all the children.

He WILL kill you if you let him back.

Even if he does not kill you J4J, your little girl will be scared that he will...

J4J You might well be reading all these responses thinking "but thats not me, thats not our relationship, it will be ok for us, my DH is different to the men descirbed here". The thing is, all women who are being abused think like that.
When I met DH I vowed I wouldn't put up with the same stuff mum did,so I tested him. I tested him to the extreme. I wanted to see at what point he would snap. He never did. He walked away. Believe me, I pushed and goaded and taunted. I was abusing him - I had been so desperate not to be a victim that I went right the other way. We have worked hard together and I have done a lot of work on myself and my issues.
Do you want your DD to be treated how you have? Or to treat another person the way you have been treated?
Quint Even if he does not kill you J4J, your little girl will be scared that he will... That is one of the saddest things I have read on here, because I remember when we found my mum, one of my first thoughts was that he can't hurt her anymore. I was no longer scared of what he might do to her, because he had done the worst thing he could. He had driven her to taking her own life. I'm ashamed to say that at the time I felt almost relief.

Sorry pressed post too soon. This is why you must do all you can to protect yourself and your DD.
Don't let him stay at home with you. Don't tell him to get help. Don't offer to find out where that help is available. IF HE IS TRULY SORRY HE WILL DO ALL THAT BY HIMSELF.
Sorry for shouting

"because I remember when we found my mum, one of my first thoughts was that he can't hurt her anymore. I was no longer scared of what he might do to her, because he had done the worst thing he could. He had driven her to taking her own life. I'm ashamed to say that at the time I felt almost relief."

mumsnetly hugs to you, Stickafork. Your story has made me so sad.

I was luckier than you then, as my mum waited till I, the youngest had grown up and flown the nest. I was 19, and managed to get to my mum in time. Though, my dad was never violent, they argued a lot, "heated debates" and stony silences lasting for days, and my mum was depressed and emotional and often desperate to the point of wanting to take her life. Or leave, but with kids and no qualifications or other work experience than working for my dad, she saw no options. So when she told me she had left my dad, I knew what she was planning.

well done for haniging up.
do you see how he is minimising it?

"He said I helped you to the sofa"

it is ok to beat you up if he helps you up/ takes you to hospital after?

(and yes some would do just that..show their caring side..)

focus on what your dd and other dc saw and felt - that is the only thing to keep in mind right now

Don't waste your time with the CAB - they are generally worse than useless in these situations as few of their staff/volunteers have any indepth knowledge of dv.

As advised, you should contact Women's Aid who have the expertise to give you appropriate support and advice - www.womensaid.org.uk or google 'womens aid' followed by your county or nearest town for details of your nearest branch. Don't worry - they won't 'force' you to do anything you don't want to do.

I am still seething over the fact he was given a caution - if, in fact, he was - but I am assuming that you made it clear to hospital staff that you would not co-operate by giving a statement to the police. Even so, if this were the case, there are other options the police could have taken to ensure that he was prohibited from returning to the marital home for 28 days which would have enabled you seek legal advice and get the necessary Orders in place.

I can only hope that the social worker who visits your home tomorrow is on the ball and that you will co-operate fully as there is no percentage in you trying to minimise or gloss over his behaviour.

With regard to a social worker wanting your dc to 'draw pictures', you've been able to offload here and no doubt to family members such as your dad, but what have you provided for your dc to enable them to express their feelings and fears instead of internalising them?

Your dc will have the sight of you laying unconscious on the floor and your bruised face seared on their minds forever and, IMO, the very least they deserve is for you to facilitate a means by which they can 'offload' too.

J4J You might well be reading all these responses thinking "but thats not me, thats not our relationship, it will be ok for us, my DH is different to the men descirbed here". The thing is, all women who are being abused think like that.

So very very true Stick.

My grandad once said that he worried for me as my ex and I argued so much. I sat there and told him that i never ever not for even an iinstant believed he would EVER lay a finger on me. We argued because we were both so passionate. That we wound each other up thats all. No way would he hit me. He loved me too much, i was a too strong a woman, And anyway if any man ever hit me i'd hit him back and leave. I was sooo not a battered wife.

well, didn't I eat my words.

No one wants to believe that the man they love is capable of such a thing. we don't want to think that we have failed our children, that we chose a bad egg as their father.

All you need to remember is that this is no flaw on you or your character, HE did this. It is all HIS doing.

You need to let your children draw the pictures. They need to be able to process and communicate what they have experienced. It has been extremely traumatic for them.

and yes, agree also that you should let the SW speak with the children. They may not want to draw pictures or answer the questions but the sw will need to know the level of trauma they are feeling in order to best facilitate them dealing with it adequately.

DS was 4 when we left. He is now 11. At times of stress he will still act out incidents that he witnessed. He has had play therapy and art therapy.
Sadly he was forced to witness violence at a much higher frequency than your children so I would hope that they will find it easier to get past this. One way of helping them at ease with it is to know that mummy stopped it straight away. She didn't allow it to continue (something i feel more guilt over than i can ever possibly describe)

Your 4 yr old DD saw her dad hit you and knock you out and thought you were dead. I have been on MN a long time and that is one of the most upsetting things I have ever read on here. She is going to remember that all her life and will never feel safe with him again.

Please don't downplay things when SS visit. Ask them for advice on local organisations and sources of support for you and your dcs. Ask them for support in keeping you strong and independant. Mostly ask for help for your dcs who witnessed this assault on you. Ask about play therapy and contact centres.

I think you should push for charges to be pressed.

Do not let him come home. Explain to him that he cannot be living with you and the dcs whilst he is working on his issues. Why is he arguing with you about whether or not he helped you onto the sofa after knocking you out cold? Kind of besides the point isn't it!

Do you have family or friends supporting you?

Typical dv script, isn't it? He knocks a woman unconscious, helps her to a sofa or bed, finds a steak for her black eye, takes her to hospital in case he's broken her jaw, and explains to the medics and all who'll listen that she tripped and fell on his fist - while telling her that she asked for it and she knows that her every wish is his command.

Just another kitchen sink drama - until she ends up 6' under and he ends up doing life for murder or manslaughter (man's laughter) if he gets a good brief.

Tune in next week or 10/20/30 years time, folks, to see what becomes of their children?

Agree, it is not fair of you to stop your children drawing those pictures.

What they witnessed was abuse of them too.

They need help with that, they must be traumatised.

As would any children be who saw their father knock their mother unconscious.

Also, you dont know what happened in the house in the time you were unconscious. Only the children knows that, and him.
Did he shout at them? Try to drag your dd away from your limp body? Were they at all hurt?

You cannot stop your children from having an outlet for what they have experienced.

How are you going to deal with them talking to others about what he did? Their teachers? How do you think they will react to you preferring to stay with him (if you do)?

There are so many things to consider, I do feel for you.

I don't think it is about Fairness. Op has refused because she is worried that it will drag back memories she hopes have been forgotten. I am sure J4J has a whole host of emotions and thoughts running through her mind right now and she is only doing what she believes is right. It is very easy to see through the fog if you aren't standing in the middle of it.

One thing that i keep thinking though OP. Whilst your Daughter was crying and clearly upset thinking you were dead, what was your husband doing? Was he trying to console her? explain that mummy was ok? that he was sorry?

In your posts so far it sounds as though he was oblivious to your daughter obvious panic and distress. I think that is something to consider too

btw if you make it clear to SS you looking for their support in ensuring DC safety and keeping your H away from the home for now they can help you with that.

if Dc want tos ee him this can be arranged in safe environment eg contact centre .

look things like MARAC - how this could help - may be further down the line or if other incidents - but best t not to risk other incidents..
eg
www.richmond.gov.uk/domestic_abuse_multi-agency_risk_assessment_conference

Do you feel you couldn't manage without him? Does he 'do a lot for you'?

The SW can help you with that. As you are partially sighted, you could have a PA who can do those things for you.

I have one - only a few hours a week. She's fantastic. We've become friends and it's more like a bit of a social when she's here. We have a laugh, while she helps me with stuff I can't do at all, or can't do on my own. I wish she'd been here when dd was tiny and I couldn't even pop my medication out of it's blister packs, or give dd a bath....

Please don't see SW as the enemy at the moment. They really aren't.

Oh, and your kids could do with someone who isn't directly involved to support them.