"But We Took You To Stately Homes!" - Survivors of Dysfunctional Families.

[garlicBread]

It's November 2011, and the Stately Home is still open to visitors.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010
March 2011

Please check later posts in this thread for links & quotes. The main thing is: "they did do it to you" - and you can recover.

Sorry this has happened Preheated perhaps you could go there?

Hello All. Been avoiding this thread for a bit, which is odd. I think it's to do with Christmas coming and me not wanting to think about it!

Anyway, in amongst it all, I just wanted to say Puppy-VALIDATION!! What a feeling that can give you, you must be feeling so relieved. I remember when my DP said to me how proud he was of me, out of nowhere, because of the work I do, and how knowledgable I am, and how people always come to me for help! Well, I blubbed like a baby!! How ridiculous! No one had ever said that to me(no one in my family-even my dear Dad), and my Mother had been and remains positively scathing about my "abilities"(while in public boasting to all and sundry about her lawyer daughter, silly bloody woman). It's the validation that made me cry. Shocked me too, that I felt such a wave of emotion, bottled up all these years I expect.

Anyway, as you were

I was once spoken to by an old family friend who said, rather bluntly, I never understood why your mum did what she did and I can't think how it must have been for you.

Thanks for this, duvet. I've been wondering what constructive things I could say to my nearly-adult nieces & nephews. That's perfect! I'm still waiting for someone to say it to me!!

I'll say it to you if it helps, Garlic?!

This whole crap families thing crap isn't it. I'm feeling especially crap today. My more reasonable sister emailed last week to say we should talk to sort everything out. Like a fool I emailed to say I would like to talk, if we can work out a sensible way. Now she hasn't replied, it's been a fair few days now. I feel they do this every time, dangle just enough to get me to try a little, then slam the door in my face. I'm so sad, I did want to sort things out with just her so I could see my lovely nieces. Maybe she will come back to me but tbh, it just makes me sad that I have a family who I don't trust to get back to me and never have.

My husband used to wonder why I used to take anything other than instant reply as a rejection. I never realised I was like it til he pointed it out. It's because in my family I often was just ignored if they didn't like what I was saying or how I said it. Which is bloody knackering because you then have to draft exactly the right thing in first place to ensure not getting ignored. So many frustrating, annoying hoops. My mum was forever saying 'It's not what you say it's how you say it' which meant she didn't have to fucking listen to what I said, because she could critique my delivery - too grumpy/blunt/wrong time or place etc etc etc.... GGGGGGGRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!

Cheers, duvet

Yes, being able to tell an actual rejection from less-than-total-enthusiasm is still a struggle for me. It's helping to notice how my mum behaves - if she doesn't get the effusive welcome, she's all snitty and desperate. I don't NEED lavish praise like she does, but still have a very poor barometer of what's acceptable. I'm either too quick to find myself unwelcome and slink away, or not quick enough and barging around like a Labrador puppy, getting on everyone's nerves

And YY to delivery anxiety, too! I managed to saddle myself with husbands and friends who did exactly the same thing: "You're sticking your jaw out, I'm not talking to you like that!" and/or "I'm not speaking to you when you use that tone of voice!", "Don't look like that!" It's really bloody tiring to have to check your facial arrangement, body language, timbre of voice and precise choice of words before speaking. And pointless: if someone's that eager to find fault with you, they're going to find it anyway.

Oh, Garlic, you've just reminded me I can be a bit like that with my DH. Not to that extent, but a bit picky.

I'm reeling from the constant stream of revelations now I've shoved my family out of the door. Sorry, did that come over a bit melodramatic? I can't really explain the difference, I have, this week for the first time ever, stuck to a diet. Because I do need to lose a bit of weight, and I no longer need to rebel against my mum's nagging. I've also received a small cash bonus and haven't blown it. Because I am able to think clearly instead of fulfilling my given role of family wastrel. It's weird, not seeing them. It's like there's more air around me all of a sudden, fresh air.

Oh my God duvetday! The wastrel thing! You too??!! I had (almost) forgotten about that aspect of my general badness!! Yes, recognition over here! I am "no good with money", I "waste it", "know the cost of everything but not it's value". Hell that last one was a favourite of my mother's when I was younger-I had NO idea what she was on about!!

Never mind that I have lived away from the family home since I was 17 (now 43), and she has no idea about how well I look after the household and 2 small children!!

I tell you what, it really is a good thing to come here and recognise the unfairness, and realise it wasn't us! Hallelujah!!

Me too, except I have always been good with money, and I'm the only one who hasn't borrowed from her over the years. Strange.
I'm dirty, untidy and slovenly too. Except, I'm not. My house is clean and tidy, not spotless, but perfectly acceptable. I hoover, dust etc. in fact all the things I did when she was sat on her arse ordering me about when I was ten.
Trust me, there's not a lot worse than being ten years old and having to wash your mother's underwear by hand.

Why do I always feel guilty when I write on here. I only do tiny bits because I'm worried about overwhelming people, or myself, but even those tiny bits, I feel massively guilty, almost as if I'm making it up, but I'm not. I wonder if it's a need to be believed?

Yes Dawndonna, I feel it too. It's a need to be heard too isn't it? I always feel apologetic for posting, in my head. Think I'm boring people and they're humming or looking over my shoulder, metaphorically speaking. It took me a long time to post on here at all, all very odd.

Don't feel guilty! You are ok to say what you like. That's the nice thing here. I feel guilty too, my experiences seem small compared to other people's. But really how bad does something have to be to be bad? And if it's really bad, does that mean you can;t talk about it?

Sad, but hardly surprising. All those formative years of being told it's not that bad, it's our own fault, we should be grateful, etc, etc. Like many others, I was punished for telling anything about my family outside the home. We had to present our "What I did at the weekend" essay at Sunday dinner, presumably to make sure we didn't blab.

On top of all that, there's the huge weight of social pressure - but they're your parents, surely they wouldn't hurt you, didn't mean it, you misunderstood, etc, etc. Anything but say your parents were bad parents.

FOG: Fear, Obligation, Guilt. I still get it, too, but at least I know what it is now - and kick it into touch.

Dawn and Peppermint, I agree with Garlic about the brainwashing into the family role...but here and now-you can be your authentic self and not fear a punishment for it.

Don't feel guilty (or fear, obligation) for declining the family's role for you and shredding the script. You deserve respect (and perhaps even admiration and friendship) from other people just because you exist as an independent civil person.

You crossed the boundary into your true existence (in public! - ) and that triggered the trained response to keep you in line. Forget about it. It is a left-over piece of crap from your past that just doesn't apply to you anymore...as you survive and heal.

This is a wonderful thread.
It has always frustrated me, more than saddened me, that my entire, yes entire remaining family totally abandoned me after my mother died.
I recently wanted to purge the frustration and wrote this 'letter' to them on my blog - it was enough, I don't need to see the buggers to tell them, and it felt cathartic.
It contains bad language so don't go there if such words upset you, otherwise it's just an example of getting it all off my ample bosom.
nightmareontinystreets.blogspot.com/2011/11/why-i-love-my-family.html

Puppy,wasn't here yesterday and have only just seen your post from Tuesday. I'm sooo pleased for you- I remember how much you were dreading telling your aunt and uncle your true feelings. What a result-such validation and guaranteed support for the future!
Dawnand Peppermint, I too always feel guilty posting here-don't feel I really warrant being here-not like others do! I also feel no-one would be really interested in me. I know its not true,everyone here is so nice and supportive, but thats how I feel. As for the 'wastrel' thing Duvetand Peppermint-can't believe it- thought it was just me who squandered money and 'hadn't a clue'. This thread is such a revelation-such common traits by so many of us. What a great club!

I've realised how many negative attributes have been attached to me, not just a money waster, I'm deemed forgetful, irresponsible, hysterical, anxious, crazy, embarrassing, overemotional, difficult, argumentative, obstinate and on and on and on.

Weirdly I act up to some of it round my family. That's probably why it's best not to be around them.

I actually can't remember any discussion of positive traits, except 'clever'. That always felt like a not-really positive thing, because my mum hated being clever and talked a lot about being pushed too hard. I used to wish and wish I could be nice instead of clever so my mum would like me.

It's horrid, I tell my kids so often if they are generous, kind, clever, thoughtful, brave, friendly, polite, fun. I'm going to do it more and more.

duvet, my parents think I'm a total shambles too. At the weekend, my brother's girlfriend was talking about getting fitted for a pair of running shoes and having her gait assessed professionally. I have been a runner for the last 2 years and chimed in about how important it is to do all this so you are well prepared and protected from injury etc. My dad turned to me and said 'so did you have this done too?' with a shocked look on his face. I said 'of course' and he said 'what, properly done, in a proper place?' Yes, I can actually manage to take care of myself and be a responsible adult you know. I'm almost 32 FFS!

I think it makes my parents feel more comfortable to imagine me as a helpless child rather than a fully independent adult. It's horribly hurtful and undermining though. I don't have children or nieces/nephews (yet) but I have a cousin who is 8 years younger than me - I would never ever say anything to hurt her or make her feel foolish. I delight in her successes and in congratulating her on all her achievements. I understand why you make such a point of using positive language with your kids - you sound like a great parent

'So i just have this awful guilt all the time like I cant just leave them, what will happen when my dad passes away etc etc'

Welcome to the FOG club! There are lots of us on here who are sick and tired of having our lives ruled by Fear, Obligation and Guilt. She sounds highly toxic piahigsy and like you say, you don't need all this stress, especially at 6 months pregnant. You don't need to make her happy, you don't need to do what she expects you to do, you don't need to make up for the fact that she has pushed all her friends away. It sounds like you've been conditioned (like a lot of us here) to put yourself at the bottom of the list every time, and to put her needs first. As you say, you have your own family now and it's time you put them, and yourself (never forget yourself!) first.

All easier said than done of course! It sounds like you have been very brave - these people are fearsome and the FOG can be crippling but trust the instinct that you have deep inside to protect yourself and your family. Do you see a counsellor at all? I can't recommend it highly enough - my therapist is helping me to change my life. I couldn't do it by myself but of course it may not be for everyone.

My therapist charges £40 per session (50 minutes) which I think is about average. There are some counselling services where what you pay is based on what your salary is - have a Google and see what you come up with. It certainly is worth every single penny. I earn a good salary and don't have DCs and I'm well used to spoiling myself but seeing my therapist feels like the very best thing I have ever done for myself. It's hard work, gruelling at times, and there are no quick fixes but it's helping me so much. Good luck whatever you decide and congratulations on your pregnancy x

Piahigsy if you read back over Bear1984's recent posts you will see that she has recently had a similar issue with regard to her DM having access to her DC and you may find this quite helpful.She may even be along herself soon and will no doubt be able to offer you some good advice. Good luck1