Feeling lost and lonely (ex had an affair, left us)

[Dee34]

Hi All,

This is my first post on these boards, though I have posted my story elsewhere......I just cant seem to stop thinking and mulling over things and searching for answers :(

Bit of a long story, but to start from the beginning, on Tuesday 28th Dec my ex announced that he was not in love with me anymore (usual cliches about being best friends, love you but etc). This of course sent me into a tailspin as I had just endured an awful xmas at his parents in Scotland that he insisted we go to (dont get on with his folks as they have never helped us out with DS and ex always seemed to avoid confrontation and would never raise any issues directly with them which made for an increasingly tense atmosphere). For background, back in November when I knew I would not be able to hack another xmas there and so I suggested we stay here and have a little family xmas, he told me that I was playing with people emotions by changing my mind and that I could stay here at home if I wanted but he and DS (2.5 years old) were going to Scotland regardless!! I guess I should have sussed that something was a bit iffy but I just brushed it off at the time (by Nov, affair had been going on for a month and actually between Oct - start of affair - and the bombshell in Dec, there was a difference in ex's attitude which I only really pin-pointed in the last few weeks). Anyway, we had a terrible night on the 28th - lots of crying, very emotional etc. I asked him if he was seeing someone else and he said no. I asked him to swear on DS life (childish I know, but said this in the heat of the moment) to which he replied no, he won't swear on his life as he doesn't do that sort of stuff but he held his hands up and promised he was telling the truth. I of course believed him as for me this was all out of the blue..On the Weds, I was quite teary and by lunchtime ex was saying that he was confused, needed some space etc. I said how about he stay in a hotel nearby and come round every day to see DS, take him out etc. I even phoned up several hotels for him to check rates and availability! This was during DS nap and by the time I had gone upstairs to get him, ex had done a spreadsheet and had decided he wanted to go to San Francisco instead. Some fluff about always liking San Fran from work trips (he has been there several times in the past year for genuine work reasons). Again, naïve fool that I was I agreed to him going. We drew up a list of issues that we would both think and work through (usual - lack of sex, though we were trying for baby number 2, arguing, his parents etc) and agreed not to tell any friends or family about what was happening until we knew what was happening ourselves so no one could 'influence' us. So ex went to San Fran and DS and I stayed here (everyone assumed he was here with us during whole period). Anyway, as soon as he was in San Fran his tone and attititude completely changed and he became very distant (he was relaxing and not looking at the issues or given them any thought etc). I finally 'broke' on NYE and asked him what was going on etc and that's when he said he had met someone but that nothing had happened between them, which was actually a lie.

To cut a long story short, he came back on Weds 5th Jan, determined not to work things out. Over the weeks I have learnt that other woman lives and works in San Fran, they met on a work trip in mid Oct last year (in a bar - only kissed - met on the second to last day before he headed back to the UK), had DAILY contact from the time ex returned home, started sleeping together during his next work trip out there in early Dec (a 5 night work trip) and that he was with her all along when he abandoned us over NYE to go to San Fran - he was having a lovely holiday, planning his life with her, whilst I was here like a muppet, trying to get an appointment with a sex therapist (as I obviously had 'issues'!). She is 30 (7 years younger than us) and had moved to San Fran from Nashville in June last year, so seems to me like there were a couple of lonely fools that met over some cocktails? Ex keeps banging on about how she is leaving her life over there (not quite sure what she is giving up bar a job and accommodation compared to what he is gambling with) to be with him, how he loves her so much, never felt like this before about anyone including me - starting to make me a bit sick if I'm honest. If you added up all the days they had actually been together from mid Oct to just before that post xmas trip, it amounts to around 6-7 days actually physically together and they weren't even together 24/7 as he was actually working on these two work trips (have confirmed with a colleague). So it was just hooking up at night and having lots of fresh and exciting nookie? Rest has been built around a deep emotional attachement from their daily calls/text/emails/webcams etc (probaby worse than having random one night stands I think). I think that even now tally of days is around 16 or so when you add on the NYE trip. But that is enough for her to give up her life and job and move here to be with him and he reckons she will be here in 3 months time (until then they will be racking up airmiles). I just dont understand it at all......I guess they are soulmates or star-crossed lovers that were destined to meet?! Everyone keeps telling me that he will one day wake up and see what he has done or that they will break up as soon as she gets here, but the flipside is that they may be together for a long while and that is something that I am now trying to reconcile with - esp as she will effectively be playing stepmum to DS even though ex doesn't really know anything about her bar what she has told him and shown him during their limited time together (of course there is the very real possibility that he is even lying about dates and that this all started way before Oct. I don't know and to be honest, don't care now as all it would prove is that he is more selfish and a bigger cheat and liar than first thought)....

Throughout all of this, ex has been going on about he need to be happy and how he has acted out of self preservation. And he has variously been unhappy for the last few months, 6 months, 9 months, 15 months, 18 months depending on what mood you catch him in when you speak to him.....unhappy for so long that I didn't notice it and yet only gets the balls to leave once he meets someone else? I can accept that we didn't have a 100% perfect relationship, but we had been together for 11 years and of course share DS so am shocked and hurt that it ended in this way. For his part, ex varies between assuming no guilt and saying that the affair was symptomatic of our relationship to wanting to do 2010 over again and make different choices and regretting going to the US over NYE and for making us go to Scotland over Xmas (apparently, as I made the atmosphere so tense for everyone, this was the last push towards making him decide to leave us.....though he hasn't commented on how his dad did his usual show of drinking 2 bottles of wine on xmas eve and not bothering to get up until gone midday so we were all sat around waiting for him as usual...).

Anyway, since then things have lurched along. He has said some horrid things to me and treated me like a fool at the best of times. I think he is so deeply entrenched in his feelings for the other woman that he has forgotten I am DS mum (again, keep asking myself, how and why can he feel so deeply for someone he has spent barely any time with?). For me, the hardest part now is facing up to the reality that I will no longer see my son every day as we move towards shared access and custody. Also hard is the fact that this other woman will be interacting with DS as and when he is staying with them. I do secretly hope that they both go back to the US (surely to happen if and when they have kids and don't think she will wait around for long as she does seem besotted with ex for some bizzare reason - her FB profile is a pic of them in you guessed it an aiprort!...) and ex only comes back here on his tod to see DS for holidays (selfish I know, but I can indulge a fantasy I guess).

Is he deluded or am I???? He has been focused on work a lot and seems to have lost a lot of his friends and social life - which I had noticed and tried to encourage him to get back up again. I am just heartbroken that he could do this to us - esp the cold and calculating way he abandoned us to go to San Fran to be with her over NYE and the fact that in the last 7 weeks our house has now gone on the market (cant afford it myself) and I am now out looking for any old job to support myself (oh, forgot to say, that I had taken voluntary redundancy from a very well paid job last March with his encouragement! When I called him up on this he said, 'oh well, but you didn't like that job anyway!!!')......
I
Inbetween all the crying and anger, I do feel like I am going crazy........This is playing on my mind a lot now as he has just flown out today to go and see her in San Fran (6 night holiday, so will take their tally up to 21-22 days or so). It pains me that he will be taking her out for meals, whereas I had to practically nag him to death to book a babysitter for our anniversary in Dec ('nagged' him, as I usually arranged everything and was in need of some attention after his work trip - of course, I now know why he wasn't that bothered...). He will be having cosy conversations and intimate chats planning their future for when she moves here and talking about our son.

Does it get better? Does anyone have a crystal ball and can tell me they wont last....??!!

And how can I move on? I have tried the whole no contact thing - which worked for a while, but then I broke and sent him a long message about how he had ruined my life.... :( . I have read a ton of post affair books (including not just friends) but still struggle to make sense of it all some days. I know that he will definitely not come back as he has said this several times as he no longer loves me and the deep feelings he has for the OW. Trying to be positive but it is so, so hard some days........

Hi dee darling - hope your silence means you are doing well! Don't feel obliged to reply but do pm me if you fancy Xmas meet up - all a bit ho hum here - ex being arse re house & won't contribute to necessary new does for ds despite huge salary and mo tenant here so we are struggling - que sera xxxx

yes, where is that blimmin girl, that so and so

Hi Dolly - as entertaining as ever. thanks for the Hemingway quote - I sometimes wonder if I am a patchwork of 'broken places' and don't want to become rigid and stiff.

I know what you mean about missing your lo. I hate to say it but every time they went away to ex's I felt it, right till they were grown up and (just) gone - my youngest has just gone off to uni and the house is e-m-p-t-y. oh!

I am still here! Packing like a mad woman as fingers crossed moving in next two weeks!

Not so sure about doing well - lots of mixed emotions as been up and down as I sort through stuff and pack up. Go from highs of elation thinking forward to new life and new setting for DS and I and then I have lows where I literally walk from room to room wondering why ex did this and how I ended up in this position......but, on the whole am hopeful that this will be a good move. Will cost me a small fortune though (yet more digging into savings, but glad that I have them to use in the first place) as need to pay for removal firm, new white goods and a whole host of fees and deposits etc. Also worried how DS will take the whole process. Will start to broach the subject with him over the next few days and will make a few suggestions on how we could decorate his new bedroom. Bit daunting really......Dolly - unfortunately, he is claiming all that he paid for or says he paid for. I honestly could not remember if I transferred x pounds/50% to him after he paid for the washing machine. I am only remembering the things I paid for as I recover the old reciepts whilst packing. All the nice Habitat mirrors and picture frames, the £1k spent on photos of all three of us at a professional sitting and prints on canvas and boards, the sideboard that cost as much as the dining room table and chairs. And you know, I would have been just as happy to go through each room and divvy stuff up (goodness, he has the fridge freezer I paid for - meaning I have to go and buy another one now) and he is still laying claim to the dishwasher and tumble dryer as he paid for them.....makes me feel like sh** that he can think this way, but on the other hand, he can take whatever he says is his and I can at least be safe in the knowledge it wont be upcasted to me in the near future.

Ex is off on holiday this weekend - goes tomorrow. May have already mentioned it? He dropped DS off this evening and asked me if I could have a look for the poker set in the garage so he could take it with him tomorrow. I must obviously be giving off the stench of someone who has nothing else much to do with her life bar pine after ex and do his bidding (I have loads of packing to do now!). I was particularly cheesed as I thought why should I poke around the garage for something that belongs to the two of us (though he can have it) so he can take it on his weekend away with new gf......until he said 'oh, she's not coming, its a lads weekend away'....Hmmmmm - didn't bite and ask what was on the tip of my tongue ('how come you are off on all these lads weekend away - he went on one in July, he claims, though still doubt that - when your soulmate has just arrived in this country (been here 10/11 weeks now) and she spends all that time traipsing up and down to London and then at the weekends, she spends at least one day with our son and you?'). I guess weekends spent in romantic European citites can wait - or he is lying and he may well be off on such a romantic weekend away....hmmmm!!

I think he is at least going camping - whether it be with her or his mates - as he came round on Saturday night for his camping gear. Had a bit of a to-do (instigated by me, as I had had a bit of an emotional day all round). Ex said that he had regrets for his actions and that he was not aware he was treating me badly (this was in the evening and yet that morning, he had told me on the phone how whatever he and new gf would be bringing into their new relatonship would be split 50/50....nice for her as she is on a 1/3 of what he earns. I was majorly cheesed off as he has made out I am some money grabber when he wanted to diddle me on the basic CSA amount he should be giving and despite my paying into the joint account for my share of the bills, mortgage from my redundancy package every month and I still had to pay for my own toiletries, petrol, car bumpf, clothes etc from my savings. Not complaining as obviously I agreed with our set-up, but as said, not impressed with this devotion to all that is good and great about ng whilst I am left to look like the baddie.....). He also said that he was indeed living a superficial life and that he missed family life. Not sure whether to believe him as he seems to be doing a very good job of enjoying his so-called superficial life. I did have a little pang (sorry Springy - will toughen up!) when I felt a bit sorry for him, though on reflection, I wonder if this was me feeling sorry for myself? And the thought of what could have been if ex had never gone down this path. I did get the 'you said you would never forgive me' line which he has repeated in the past. I did say this, but only after he physically pushed me away and recoiled from my touch and told me he was dead from the waist down for me, he did not want to be with me, he had lost nothing, he now felt happy and alive and I did not appreciate him.....jeez....he is lucky that's all I said I reckon! I think it is a bit of boo-hoo for him so need to educate/remind myself that he is not my problem and my once natural instinct to help him, soothe him, make him feel comfortable and okay is not part of my job description anymore.....

Still no news on the wedding of the century - not expecting an invite, but am sure he will want DS to be part of the proceedings.

Off to bed - am aching! Dolly - will reply properly tomorrow!

PS: Think ex is going to faint when he sees what he still has left to come and pick up! He will need a van of some sort to move the rest of his stuff. I am hoping to move out 1-2 days before he comes round to move his stuff......though just had a thought about the keys! Got the locks changed so will need to give him a set now so he can enter as he likes (once I have gone).....hmm, how to explain that one

Camping in late September? Hope it rains on his parade!

As you'll be moving your stuff out first, I hope there's a nice mess for him to clean up (or for him to get Miss fancy-pants to clean up).

Hi Dee Darling

Firstly - and I'm sorry if this is pointless/too late to say this - I have some lovely well being friends who are full of advice to me on the financial side of things despite the fact that we are legally sorted with the split of things which irritates me as as nothing I can do know - BUT I'm not up on the law in the UK if you were not technically married but whilst he may WANT to take the things 'he' bought he may not legally be entitled. You were in a long term defacto relationship you have a child together and he was the primary financial contributor at his / both of your decisions. He has chosen to walk away but its not that simple is it - he encouraged you to take redundancy and your financial earning capacity have taken a hit - and will do for a while as you can't do the long hours etc due to child care....so if you haven't already taken legal advice it is worth doing.....to me (possibly as fellow wronged partner) it seems like you should be able to retain some of your joint possessions to adequately furnish your child's primary residence....anyway, that is my two pennies worth. Possibly as my ex and I were going to take the things we had bought before we were married and then chose one item each in turn when the financials started out - anyway to cut to the chase during our solicitors roundtable - where he was an arse and awful - it got to the end and he started (we were in sep rooms at this point as my solicitor refused to have him in the room as he was being a dick) to say what he wanted and my solicitor was 'fuck him - you need the furniture stop being so reasonable - and I was pissed off - I did play hardball and all he is getting (aside from some things he took in immediate aftermath) is an admittedly very very expensive painting, antique side board and mirror (the most expensive things we had - about 15K pounds worth) and I am taking the rest....will likely sell a lot of it as this is a big old house and probably a bit petty of me really but you know what he left, he is living his dream with mistress so to the far side of fuck he can go.....grrrr tiger dolly at play.....anyway OF COURSE he is trying to make you feel like money grabber - he knows you are a decent honest person and is playing on that to get as much as he can. remember he also has the OW in his ear (who presumably didn't bring her sideboard over on the plane) urging him to get as much stuff for their dream life.....don't buy it darling...I don't think its far he gets his big fat wage, is tight on child support, a new life and the fucking sofa....anyway rant over.

As for the emotional stuff - its hard to say if he means it - a bit rich of him to expect you to listen to him saying he misses family life etc at the same time as setting up home with OW - and does smack a little of manipulation so you are reasonable if you you see a glimmer of hope/remorse/sympathy. My ex did this with me - a bit like if you give me the [insert material item] it will show me that you are reasonable and maybe I will love you again but if you are a mean bitch then there is no chance ever for us. I bought that for a while and then woke up to myself....at best he seems very self absorbed and can't see that you are a person outside of his projection of you and how you orbit around him. Really how dare he stand there and tell you of his new financial set up and then question his decision and take his frickin' fondue set (metaphorically speaking) at the same time. I want to slap him for you lovey. Finally on the locks front - possibly petty but give him a set and tell him you need them back and can he go to locksmith and get them copied at his expense...you are not a concierge service as well.

All a bit ho hum still - I think a bit stressed re impending divorce and house stuff (it really is a clusterfuck over here) - don't have DS this w/end which always pisses me off (can you tell ; ) but do have nice pizza night with mothers group and a ton of gardening / house stuff to to here so hopefully will go quickly....was going to kick the 'loveer' into touch but had a fairly nice night on Wed so may see him again....he does seem to think we are in a relationship of sorts though - he has his girls for a week as school hols over here - and has asked if I want to go to lunch/dinner etc with them - errr no thanks! Passes the time though at least till we go on hols in a week or so which will be a nice natural break.

Also agree with Grapes - hope it pisses it down and his tent collapses (gosh am on a petty roll tonight girls)....huge love Dolly x

I have to say you are being too nice to him!!!!!!!!! and lots more.
Do NOT please please let him take all the white goods etc. Take what you need of what is left. Get legal advice if necessary, they give you a free half hour.

He is not being reasonable, your son needs a washing machine etc. Please do not waste more of your money on this sponger.

Please!!!!!

oh I heartily agree with mummy.

also, ime, when it comes to the division of goods, things go at a cracking pace and what you lose you won't get back in any settlement. The courts will not be concerned to furnish him with all necessary goods but will be very keen that you and your son's needs are catered for.

Someone sent me something the other day which I foudn very helpful re if you are a compassionate/caring type, you are attracted to what are essentially takers - and takers are most certainly attracted to you! (you giver, them taker). I can see that I have almost trained people to be takers in that I've been so generous that they honestly think that's how it goes, that it's ok like that. Boundaries, my dear! Get rid of some ruth (as in, less ruth )

It is only to be expected that you are going to have lows.

This is the house that you were planning your future in. More children, watching them grow up, being together on cosy family evening etc. Plus all the memories it holds anniversaries, birthdays, christmases even arguments and make up sex all ruined because he was 'unhappy' for 11 months 23 days 4 hours and 12 seconds so decided to jump into another woman

Although your ex has been left a while now it is the final end of those dreams. You have to let them all go. It will be upsetting.

You have an amazing bright new future. Nothing in your new property to remind you of times with ex. Never having to pick his skiddy shorts up off the bathroom floor, clean the sink/bath/toilet after him. All shiney and new for you and your son.

I would imagine that your ex doesn't have many more if any receipts than you do.

Take what you think is fair your son needs a working household to live in and he must have one after all these months elsewhere. Take a list of what you take and what you have left.

How exactly is he going to get it out of your new place? If he does go to court whinging they will laugh him out and tell him to give you your fridge back when you prove you own that.

It all just shows how much bigger a person you are and always have been that this twat. You were really wasted on him. There is no way he has or will ever have better!!! The idiot.

Good luck /hugs

PS Promise us that when he comes sniffing around because things are no longer rosy you will not be allowing him over that threshold? You know it won't be because he 'loves you and made a mistake' but because he is bored and thinks you are stupid enough to fall for it. I think we should take bets on how long until he does..........

Sorry by 'he must have one' I mean your ex not your son. Bad English!

As Xales says

Install them in your new place, if he complains, remind him that he took your fridge! Aye, posession is 9/10ths of the law and all that!

I bet he'll be sniffing round before the new year!

...install the white goods I meant

Hello Ladies

So. Bad day here. Ex had DS for w/end. Despite him saying many times I will let you know before he meets OW, I get a text 30 mins before he is due to arrive back saying 'we spent the weekend in [different state] with OW & [name of her son] and it went well'. Now maybe I have to suck it all up but he did say he would tell me and two seconds after walking through the door I have to deal with DS who when saying goodbye to ex (we did not talk) said 'Daddy when are you going to live here again'.....then inside 'I slept next to [son]' in the morning we both went into Daddy and OW bed and had cuddles....she gave me some chocolate money. you can have it if you bring daddy back here..can you come next time so I can have cuddles with you and Daddy and OW....can [name of son' live here....does Daddy live with OW....if he lives in [city] will we move there too...etc etc fucking etc.....no question he had a nice time but 5 hours drive each way and I'm the sap that has to deal with it all now with 30 minutes fucking warning. Rightly or wrongly FURIOUS and i'll admit heartbroken at the cuddles with Daddy and OW (although nice for him). I know this is our lives now and I have to get with it but I don't feel ready at all....maybe just a shock even though I knew it was coming....maybe better I couldn't stress about it - I don't know - but all over the place really. Also feeling a bit vulnerable as called up a friend to talk - she has been great but I got the feeling finding me a bit wearing - christ I am finding me a bit wearing so valid - and when I said sorry i'm phoning to moan (after initial chit chat) she quite kindly said that honestly she was finding it hard listening to me after a year and it was very wearing and draining for her etc etc - although kinder that it sounds written down - I backed off and apologised but feel probably 3 things 1. pissed off at myself as I know I'm in danger of stretching friendships and have been trying not to moan but with no 'old' friends or family and my time zone it is hard and whilst a bit better now I have sometimes just had to talk to people and it has been a lifeline although probably annoying at times for friends 2. a bit hurt if I'm honest even if i shouldn't 3. a bit isolated as now feel I can't talk to anyone in case I piss them off too. I know its time for big girl pants but I am feeling isolated and lonely at the best of times and my self confidence is a bit on the floor. anyway. hope you are having a better day Dee xxx

You have to laugh or you will cry (and drink vodka) - me trying on 'new' top arrived from ebay "what do you think DS, does mummy look pretty" DS 'a little bit. but [name of OW] is prettier than you mummy. she is young and she wears more necklaces" Me outloud 'That sounds nice sweetie' Me in my head 'does the necklace say homewreaker?' .....slopes off to find cooking sherry and save for more botox...

It doesn't matter what someone looks like on the outside Dolly, it's what's on the inside that counts and we know her morals .

I am a lurker here and would like to say how much I admired you ladies, how you are handling things in very trying circumstances and you should take heart from that fact. You will have nothing to reproach yourselves for months/years down the line unlike your exes.

FWIW, my DH (yes we got back together) introduced our DC to OW when I didn't even know there was an OW! I cannot describe the pain and betrayal I felt . My solicitor told me there was nothing I could do to prevent it and the wise ladies on here told me that the boot would be on the other foot when I found someone else and H would then feel the same pain when another man enters his DC's lives.

Keep strong and dignity at all times

dear Dolly - HUGE hug winging its way across the world to oz.

I remember the devastation I felt when I heard, over the phone, OW ask ds if he wanted a bacon sandwich. it nearly killed me - I can't imagine how painful this must be for you. So, so unfair and unkind of him to have done that. As for ds's comments - sweetheart, as 10 says, what's on the outside is not the sum of a person. Though let's not be disingenuous - that was one OUCH moment. another major hug flying your way.

As for your friend saying that after a year it's all got too much for her - well, I guess she was honest instead of slowly blanking you (far worse imo). Are you seeing a counsellor? That's one way of going on and on to your heart's content - though not the same is it? A counsellor won't say 'what a cow/cunt' (though some will...). Perhaps you could ask other friends if they think you are going on too much - at least then you won't be feeling paranoid, second-guessing if everyone is thinking omg Dolly shut up. imo you have every reason to be 'going on' - he has certainly dragged this out hasn't he . Bless you sweetie

I think your friend was a bit harsh on you Dolly but people who haven't been through it probably don't truly understand how traumatic and devastating it is. And don't forget, you are only really a few weeks on from discovery (of OW) and that will take you right back to the beginning again .

Just keep being kind to yourself, one day at a time and all that , this too will soon pass .....

Take care.

So much to write but on an iPad so can't. Huge huge hugs to you dolly. I really feel for you. I think though thatbthis is the worst of it - ds meeting bitch face, um, I mean ow for the first time. That bit is over now and you won't ever have to go through that initial shock again. Are there any divorce support networks in your area? I think your friend was harsh but unless you're going through the same thing you don't realise the extent of the pain and long it takes to recover from (and it's all down to individual differences and circumstances too). Its great to have those here whove been there and done and whilst they've come out the other side they know how it is when you're in the middle of it.

Hi - manic panic is setting in re. house move and packing! So much stuff to still go through....argggh! Ex's pile of crap is ever growing - I think I will have to give him a clue as to how much stuff he still has to come and get, if only so he is not dithering around on completion date trundling backwards and forwards in his car (not worried about him - just possibly irate buyers!). He already has a Luton van full of stuff (by my reckoning) to move and it just beggars belief that he actually hired in a removal firm back in Jan and all this stuff got left behind (and this is not including his big ticket items that he has claimed as his, so last bit of the 3 piece sofa, tumble dryer etc. This is stuff that has just been languishing in the garage all this time.....actually, yes, I do know why it got to this stage - because I have been the idiot who has done all our packing (and unpacking) be it house moves or holidays).

Thanks for all the positive advice re house things. I did speak to my solicitor about this and she said similar things re. division of shared assets, regardless of who paid for it. To be honest, I just cant be bothered to argue with him - just find it all so very, very draining. I just want him out of my life now and off needling his new girlfriend with his nonsense, arrogance and whines. I think I already said how, when he left the family home in late Jan, he took the armchair and 2 seater sofa, leaving me with the 3 seater sofa from the original 3 piece suite as he needed stuff for his new pad and as he had paid the original deposit (with subsequent payments from joint account) he was claiming them as his....? When I told him a few weeks ago about the acute embarrassment I experienced when friends came round and there was only this one sofa in a huge living room (only other items are the TV and a footstool), he told me that that was not his problem and that I should go out and do what other people do and buy new stuff....so, as said, just cannot be doing with him and his nonsense. I honestly cannot wait until (I have found out that he has been withdrawing huge amounts of his savings - which is his business, not mine (I am curious if it is for the wedding, but will keep my sticky beak out), but we can see each others savings as we have an offset mortgage thing. More worryingly, he has taken 'back' some of the money he paid into the joint household bills account last month, so am just hoping we exchange asap and I can put this whole period behind me. And in all honesty, he is the type who will remind me forever more how he generously 'let' me have x, y and z (he has given me, or rather DS, the TV as he knows it is knackered and has problems when you first turn it on.....I wish I had come on here back in Jan and stopped him from taking so much of the joint furniture in the first place - I think he played me for a right fool at the time. BUT, I will try and ensure that I think of DS' needs first and foremost whilst packing/moving out and thinking, does DS need this item more than ex etc. Thanks again for the pep talks!

Planet - he wont be tidying up after himself. No way - he didn't even do that here. Will tell him that we need to hire in a cleaner or something as I am not spending my weekend or taking a days A/L to clean a house I was effectively kicked out off (though feels like a huge, huge relief now).

Re. camping....well, after doorstep incident and request for poker set on Thursday night, I get an email on Friday afternoon that he forwarded on from weekend organiser, I think to prove to me that it was indeed a boys weekend - yawn. I was only bothered on Thursday as I dont see what I should be searching through the garage for bits and bobs the night before he left (esp as earlier in the week, he was bugging me for sleeping bags, mummy liners, flat sheets etc) whether its for him and ng or him and his mates........bit of a cheek!!

With him being away, I feel such a sense of peace.....it seems he has no reception in the back of beyond, though he managed to find a payphone tonight.....You know, not heard a word from him since that email on Friday afternoon and I honestly did not/do not care what he is up to. This is huge for me, as in the past, with ex's frequent travelling on business (at least, I think it was business) I was a bit paranoid about him letting me know he was okay/had arrived safely etc. I realised today that over the last few days, my main feeling has been relief that he has not been in contact - sheer and utter relief.

Dolly - so, so sorry to hear about the intro to the OW. As others have said, remember, you have only just had the existence of OW confirmed; that is a blow in itself. Ditto, huge hugs for having to deal with your DS' tales of his weekend with OW and her son. It is hard, but, as has been said a million times before (and a million and one times to an unblelieving me), it does get easier. My DS has only mentioned ng once (he is younger I think) and I cannot imagine going through the exchange mentioned above........Plus, remember, she (and your ex) are on their best behaviours and may be bending over backwards to impress your DS.....You will always be a fantastic and gorgeous mummy to your DS. Keep strong.

Hello gorgeous women who made me cry a bit yesterday in a good way - I think rightly or wrongly feeling validated in feeling how i/we feel is so important and very necessary to me at the moment so a huge thank you. I feel physically sick when I think of them all in bed together and also whilst I know the relationship with her son will likely be a positive for my son, knowing how much I wanted a second child and how close we came and the two babies we lost, it is also very difficult. It is also hard to think that ex is spending more time with her son than his own. Springy - your comment about the bacon sandwich got to me. I can totally totally relate. And its true that until you go through it you can't imagine it. My BF divorced about 7 years ago (no kids) and whilst I was absolutely there for her and had the same conversation a million times over I now know that I didn't truly get it. A horrid club that sadly will have more members.

So today, a bit weepy. Not helped by fact stupid fuckwit ex sent me text meant for OW (second time now) telling her that he was only 210k away and he would be there at x times with emoticons etc etc....of course I know they are in a relationship and this is the type of text you send but seeing it is another story. It also INFURIATES me that he is essentially living in a city 5 hours away but maintaining his address in Sydney whilst compelling me to not leave the Sydney metro area. I'm going to talk to my lawyer but as his job is based in Sydney (he works all over) and he does have address nxt to parents probably not much I can do about it. Can I take a moment to take off my big girl pants and stamp my foot and say ITS NOT FAIR.

oh and one last thing - last night DS was I want Daddy and as usual I was you will see Daddy on x day and he was no no mummy drive me there and if you give Daddy cuddles like OW does he will come home. Thank god I had no wine in the house yesterday or I would have had a hangover today (although had case delivered today so may be a different story tomorrow).

Oh and also counting - not sure I entirely blew my dignity but SO fucked off about mis text that I forwarded to OW (have her number from the farkin HOURS ex spent on phone with her during our marriage) saying 'perhaps you may ask DH not to mix up his mistress and soon to be ex wife as its getting wearing....' CHILDISH i know and plays into the my ex is a raving loony hand but frankly at this point I could give a shit what little miss adulteress thinks. I know now that people that fuck other people write their own scripts so would think this anyway. anyhow tis done now.

So Dee - it must be so hard juggling work and moving house - god knows how you are managing and I hope you are getting help from friends and family....it is lovely when you don't have to interact isn't it - I have had cause to spk to ex (or email rather) and it is just insiduous. Hopefully will calm down soon for you but with children there is always going to be that interaction isn't there.....Dee your ex does sound like a super deluded tight wad about your stuff. As you say you have taken the view that life is too short which definately has its merits and if it works for you that is the best way to go but please don't give him anything you don't want to (if you want to then that is the right thing for you). I feel like I am annoyingly belabouring the point but even cheap furniture is expensive IYSWIM and so if you can much better to use existing stuff till you can buy what you want rather than because you desperately need it. How odd as well that he forwarded you the email chain....it seems like he is keen to still be the 'good guy' and showing you that he is telling the truth...he does seem very conflicted in his new world to be honest and

Finally, I'm not a self-helpy type person (possibly should be) but I was browing the web and found this article quite helpful in terms of intellectualising how to be positive vs negative in terms of coming through things - more up my street than the touchy feely stuff so thought would share - www.divorcemag.com/c/s3/?health/winorlose It has given me some food for thought in terms of owning things a bit more and I think I will go back to it often over the next few months.

Finally finally, spoke to a couple of friends today and vaguely bought up the sorry I am being a bore, am I being a bore, and they were sweet and said we woudl be the same, we understand it is so hard etc so feel a bit better....I think the other girl has some other stuff going on which I need to be respectful of and like you say was honest. I need to be careful not to withdraw too much from her as I do admire her being upfront but the playground bit of me is a bit 'hmmm don't like to hear critisism' there is a line in the article re if you ask too much of friends they can withdraw altogether which I will be mindful of. Honestly though feel a bit stampy foot about it though but am aware am probably mis placing my anger as she really has been great, more than great really. God being wise and alone and super mom is fucking exhausting isn't it. No wonder housewives took valium in the 50's ; )

Lots of love and thanks again for your responses...I felt a little less alone last night for which I am honestly wholly grateful for. xxx

he "should go out and do what other people do and buy new stuff"

Bit worried to hear he's withdrawing from the joint account - when are you going to close that down, and can you get in first? withdraw what he took out before you do? [withdraw the money for a cleaner]. I'd get on with it if I were you. This is where the proverbial shit is going to hit the fan Dee, being as money is a bit of a stronghold with him - brace yourself.

So glad you've had a break from him. As you know, I think there should/could be something legal in place to STOP him constantly calling. The turd is crawling all over you, driving home his dominance.

All the best with the move - can you just bung his stuff from the house (leave the stuff in the garage) in one of the rooms for him to clear out and, if he doesn't, get a cleaner in at the end and instruct them to chuck anything that hasn't been collected. As I said on another thread, your appeals to him will only give him clues on how to get inside your head, turn the screws, in future. Sadly. so don't appeal to him - he is unreasonable; has proved that i think (understatement). Can you also not tell him your moving date? If he knows, my bet is he'll be along to watch like a hawk what you're taking. Can you get people with you on your moving date? If people are there he may not quite so easily be a public shit, being as he is so keen for everyone to know what a fabulous, reasonable guy he is .

You don't need to be embarrassed that people saw your sparse house - people aren't stupid and it was a blatant illustration of what a shit he is to have deserted you and wasted no time taking the spoils. People saw that Dee. Pillage is the word that comes to mind - or PLUNDER:
rob (a place or person) forcibly of goods; rob systematically; steal or embezzle (goods) - the violent or dishonest aquisition of property. plunderer: rob of household goods.

I'm angry, can you tell

Dee, can you plan your moving date for when he's away? Shame you didn't move while he was at his camping shit thing. Be vague about the moving date - suggest a time much later than you actually move?

Just going to have a mummy talk with you Dee: please, please don't be uber reasonable in an effort to appeal to his reasonableness. It isn't there - he will use your reasonableness, your fairness.

Dolly, Dolly, Dolly - HUGE WRAPAROUND HUG for you. In fact, group hug girls, come on

. full disclosure - I've had two glasses of Merlot and its only 7.30pm so ignore any further posts from down under tonight. In one week and one day I will be a divorced lady. I plan on my FB status as being 'Single as a dollar and I'm not looking for change' ; )

Dolly ? sorry, wanted to write much, much more yesterday but my sight was blurring in the end??..

On the friends front, I totally get how you are feeling and have been through the same mental thought process ? am I going on too much, who can I share latest idiotic behaviour with etc etc. I did how one ?run-in? with a friend a few moths ago who said out of the blue ?actually, she (OW/ng) may actually be a nice person?. I was flabbergasted at that and swiftly changed the subject, but her comment bugged me enough that when I got back to my desk (we had been having lunch) I sent her an email saying that I was upset that she had said that. She then replied that she was sorry and understood and next time we met up, we talked over it briefly. Thing is even if she (OW/ng) is a nice person*, it is not something that I need to be hearing right now (or then). So I would have been the exact same in terms of your response to your friend. And I agree, I don?t think anyone can get it until they have been down this path. It is one thing (not saying this lightly) to sleep with someone else, but to have any in-depth affair with someone else and then leave is just devastating. The trust you have in people is chipped away and you begin to doubt everything in the past and question the future. I have no clue if this ng is now privy to my most private things that have occurred in my life and will never know. I will never know what ex has really told his family, friends and her about me/us. This tortured me in the beginning, though becoming less of an issue (e.g. when he said he was going camping with his mates ? before he sent email confirmation ? I would have asked him not to talk about me/us whilst out there (he went with work mates, some of whom I know) and his response would have been either ?I don?t ever talk about us as it?s too upsetting? or ?don?t flatter yourself?, depending on what mood his is in). This time, I just didn?t bother as don?t care anymore?.). I also get the whole timeline thing, and again, as someone mentioned, it?s only been a few weeks since OW was revealed to you?..its not like you split a year ago from your ex on wonderful terms and all has been trundling along nicely??so most definitely, don?t force yourself to be over this by any specific date or bottle things up?.

I second Springy?s comments about the counseling (mine never said that ex was an idiot in as many words, but she did re-inforce to me that the relationship had flaws that I was revealing to her and that it was my ex?s choice not to communicate with me for x months or years and of course, there is MN to vent and shout galore.

Forgot to add, am fuming on your behalf that your ex allowed not only the meeting to happen, without telling you in advance as you had both AGREEED on, but also the whole getting into bed thing. I am most definitely of the take-things-slowly camp and cannot see what benefit it gave your DS. Maybe, as your ex has been going and seeing OW in her home state, her DS is used to popping into bed with them of a morning and as your DS had just had a sleepover, he was following suit? No excuse really, esp as this would have been the first time your DS was introduced to her. I would also be extremely angry if this was happening on their first meeting (and I think most other people would be too). As mentioned, how the hell would he feel if it was the other way around???!!

Yes - I do need to accept that emotions will be going through the mill as I cycle throught the ups and downs and that these are perfectly normal and valid. Timley reminder - thank you!

Xales/ Planet - ah, I will willingly bet a few quid and a round of cocktails (gone off the wine!) that he won?t be sniffing around anytime soon?..I think he is hell bent on following this path to its conclusion now. Whether it be a lifetime of genuine happiness (once he gets over his regrets and adapts to a life where we both only see DS part-time), a messy relationship or otherwise. I don?t think he would have the backbone to ever leave her given what he has sacrificed for her, so it will be down to her really (or that?s what I reckon). I would dearly like to be a fly on the wall when it gets to Xmas and ex, ng and his folks are all sitting around sighing how they are all missing DS (I don?t think the irony will even click, given that ex took ng up to meet his folks on the same weekend as his nephews 2nd birthday ? whilst DS stayed here with me, not that I would have been mad keen for them to have all gone up together playing happy families at that stage ? her second trip to the UK. Also, they didn?t make the trip down for DS? 3rd birthday for whatever reason ? didn?t ask, so don?t know. Though usually, they enjoy coming down for 10+ nights in the summer coinciding with DS? birthday in last couple of years ? that was when they had the luxury of our big old house with own en-suite at their disposal I guess). Also intrigued to see if ex will stay in this town or go home (i.e. his parents place) for Xmas. Before we had DS, ex spent every Xmas back home with his folks ? the only time we spent one together was the year we went to Oz and that was because we flew out to HK on Xmas Day as it was cheaper fares. Even Xmas 2007 when I had just found out I was preggers, he preferred to slope off to his parents home, where he was treated like a little prince, never lifting a finger and staying up to all hours drinking wine with his Dad. Honestly, the first time I was there for Xmas in Dec 2009, I thought that I was going to be getting in on a fun time with lots going on given ex?s determination to go there every year. Nope ? just sitting around their house with the odd visit to an aunt or uncle or them to us and trips to Tescos to stock up on grub and booze. No traditions (bar ex?s dad getting up at 1pm on Xmas Day), no family games?nothing. TV on all day in the background. So, at least I get to start from scratch this year with DS .

I forgot to say in my last post thanks for the lovely words (sorry, blame the brain closing down this time). Like Dolly and others, I would have been truly lost without the wonderful support on here.

Right, am knackered - and off to another cup of coffee!

*I am trying to be more indifferent to her now, I sort of have to convince myself that she is some romantic type who is pursuing her prince charming (and him her) as opposed to her being up to anything malicious (e.g. needs a visa, sees how much ex is earning, just after a short-term thing etc). If it was the latter, I would have serious concerns about DS being in the mix. I am trying to bear her existence in case this does become the long term thing that they are looking for?..And trust me, I am not naively living in a sugar coated world where no one ever has affairs and the OW is a vile monster. I have a couple of friends who have in fact been the OW (and in one case, one friend bitterly regrets her actions as she split from her MM after 2 years living together ? lots of reasons and she feels sadness at what she did and how her actions affected his wife and her husband. I think she can now see even more the acute pain it causes and she has been a real help and support).

Right - 2.5 glasses of Merlot in. Dee/Springy (and of course anyone else that wants to) shall we try and arrange a meet up in December??? I will primarily be at my parents in west midlands so can travel/overnight - Springy I think your kids are older so Dee if you would like let us know what w/end works with your schedule....don't want to force the issue - maybe we would sit around sipping our babychams and being awkward but somehow I think not.....anyway, let me know if you are intersted and we can take offline...totally get if you'd rather not though as forums are meant to be anonymous but I do feel VERY affectionate towards you both and of course all the other wonderful women on here ; )

PS. Dee Dee - I am sufficiently lubricated to say outright TAKE THE FUCKING FURNITURE, WHITE GOODS AND EVERYTHING YOU CAN YOU DESERVE IT.

PPS Feel your pain re your friend....my SIL said the night I found about OW that she 'sounds very intelligent and grounded' and I wanted to fucking punch her no matter whether or not it is true...like you say it is not what we want to hear right now if ever. I'm sufficiently mature to realise that just because you adulterer you are not necessarily the devil incarnate but they are also people with different moral compasses to you and I and I for one do not need to have their finer qualities pointed out to me....

what the fuck is wrong with people, saying things like 'she sounds very intelligent and grounded'. I just do not get people - how could anyone say something like this???