Feeling lost and lonely (ex had an affair, left us)

[Dee34]

Hi All,

This is my first post on these boards, though I have posted my story elsewhere......I just cant seem to stop thinking and mulling over things and searching for answers :(

Bit of a long story, but to start from the beginning, on Tuesday 28th Dec my ex announced that he was not in love with me anymore (usual cliches about being best friends, love you but etc). This of course sent me into a tailspin as I had just endured an awful xmas at his parents in Scotland that he insisted we go to (dont get on with his folks as they have never helped us out with DS and ex always seemed to avoid confrontation and would never raise any issues directly with them which made for an increasingly tense atmosphere). For background, back in November when I knew I would not be able to hack another xmas there and so I suggested we stay here and have a little family xmas, he told me that I was playing with people emotions by changing my mind and that I could stay here at home if I wanted but he and DS (2.5 years old) were going to Scotland regardless!! I guess I should have sussed that something was a bit iffy but I just brushed it off at the time (by Nov, affair had been going on for a month and actually between Oct - start of affair - and the bombshell in Dec, there was a difference in ex's attitude which I only really pin-pointed in the last few weeks). Anyway, we had a terrible night on the 28th - lots of crying, very emotional etc. I asked him if he was seeing someone else and he said no. I asked him to swear on DS life (childish I know, but said this in the heat of the moment) to which he replied no, he won't swear on his life as he doesn't do that sort of stuff but he held his hands up and promised he was telling the truth. I of course believed him as for me this was all out of the blue..On the Weds, I was quite teary and by lunchtime ex was saying that he was confused, needed some space etc. I said how about he stay in a hotel nearby and come round every day to see DS, take him out etc. I even phoned up several hotels for him to check rates and availability! This was during DS nap and by the time I had gone upstairs to get him, ex had done a spreadsheet and had decided he wanted to go to San Francisco instead. Some fluff about always liking San Fran from work trips (he has been there several times in the past year for genuine work reasons). Again, naïve fool that I was I agreed to him going. We drew up a list of issues that we would both think and work through (usual - lack of sex, though we were trying for baby number 2, arguing, his parents etc) and agreed not to tell any friends or family about what was happening until we knew what was happening ourselves so no one could 'influence' us. So ex went to San Fran and DS and I stayed here (everyone assumed he was here with us during whole period). Anyway, as soon as he was in San Fran his tone and attititude completely changed and he became very distant (he was relaxing and not looking at the issues or given them any thought etc). I finally 'broke' on NYE and asked him what was going on etc and that's when he said he had met someone but that nothing had happened between them, which was actually a lie.

To cut a long story short, he came back on Weds 5th Jan, determined not to work things out. Over the weeks I have learnt that other woman lives and works in San Fran, they met on a work trip in mid Oct last year (in a bar - only kissed - met on the second to last day before he headed back to the UK), had DAILY contact from the time ex returned home, started sleeping together during his next work trip out there in early Dec (a 5 night work trip) and that he was with her all along when he abandoned us over NYE to go to San Fran - he was having a lovely holiday, planning his life with her, whilst I was here like a muppet, trying to get an appointment with a sex therapist (as I obviously had 'issues'!). She is 30 (7 years younger than us) and had moved to San Fran from Nashville in June last year, so seems to me like there were a couple of lonely fools that met over some cocktails? Ex keeps banging on about how she is leaving her life over there (not quite sure what she is giving up bar a job and accommodation compared to what he is gambling with) to be with him, how he loves her so much, never felt like this before about anyone including me - starting to make me a bit sick if I'm honest. If you added up all the days they had actually been together from mid Oct to just before that post xmas trip, it amounts to around 6-7 days actually physically together and they weren't even together 24/7 as he was actually working on these two work trips (have confirmed with a colleague). So it was just hooking up at night and having lots of fresh and exciting nookie? Rest has been built around a deep emotional attachement from their daily calls/text/emails/webcams etc (probaby worse than having random one night stands I think). I think that even now tally of days is around 16 or so when you add on the NYE trip. But that is enough for her to give up her life and job and move here to be with him and he reckons she will be here in 3 months time (until then they will be racking up airmiles). I just dont understand it at all......I guess they are soulmates or star-crossed lovers that were destined to meet?! Everyone keeps telling me that he will one day wake up and see what he has done or that they will break up as soon as she gets here, but the flipside is that they may be together for a long while and that is something that I am now trying to reconcile with - esp as she will effectively be playing stepmum to DS even though ex doesn't really know anything about her bar what she has told him and shown him during their limited time together (of course there is the very real possibility that he is even lying about dates and that this all started way before Oct. I don't know and to be honest, don't care now as all it would prove is that he is more selfish and a bigger cheat and liar than first thought)....

Throughout all of this, ex has been going on about he need to be happy and how he has acted out of self preservation. And he has variously been unhappy for the last few months, 6 months, 9 months, 15 months, 18 months depending on what mood you catch him in when you speak to him.....unhappy for so long that I didn't notice it and yet only gets the balls to leave once he meets someone else? I can accept that we didn't have a 100% perfect relationship, but we had been together for 11 years and of course share DS so am shocked and hurt that it ended in this way. For his part, ex varies between assuming no guilt and saying that the affair was symptomatic of our relationship to wanting to do 2010 over again and make different choices and regretting going to the US over NYE and for making us go to Scotland over Xmas (apparently, as I made the atmosphere so tense for everyone, this was the last push towards making him decide to leave us.....though he hasn't commented on how his dad did his usual show of drinking 2 bottles of wine on xmas eve and not bothering to get up until gone midday so we were all sat around waiting for him as usual...).

Anyway, since then things have lurched along. He has said some horrid things to me and treated me like a fool at the best of times. I think he is so deeply entrenched in his feelings for the other woman that he has forgotten I am DS mum (again, keep asking myself, how and why can he feel so deeply for someone he has spent barely any time with?). For me, the hardest part now is facing up to the reality that I will no longer see my son every day as we move towards shared access and custody. Also hard is the fact that this other woman will be interacting with DS as and when he is staying with them. I do secretly hope that they both go back to the US (surely to happen if and when they have kids and don't think she will wait around for long as she does seem besotted with ex for some bizzare reason - her FB profile is a pic of them in you guessed it an aiprort!...) and ex only comes back here on his tod to see DS for holidays (selfish I know, but I can indulge a fantasy I guess).

Is he deluded or am I???? He has been focused on work a lot and seems to have lost a lot of his friends and social life - which I had noticed and tried to encourage him to get back up again. I am just heartbroken that he could do this to us - esp the cold and calculating way he abandoned us to go to San Fran to be with her over NYE and the fact that in the last 7 weeks our house has now gone on the market (cant afford it myself) and I am now out looking for any old job to support myself (oh, forgot to say, that I had taken voluntary redundancy from a very well paid job last March with his encouragement! When I called him up on this he said, 'oh well, but you didn't like that job anyway!!!')......
I
Inbetween all the crying and anger, I do feel like I am going crazy........This is playing on my mind a lot now as he has just flown out today to go and see her in San Fran (6 night holiday, so will take their tally up to 21-22 days or so). It pains me that he will be taking her out for meals, whereas I had to practically nag him to death to book a babysitter for our anniversary in Dec ('nagged' him, as I usually arranged everything and was in need of some attention after his work trip - of course, I now know why he wasn't that bothered...). He will be having cosy conversations and intimate chats planning their future for when she moves here and talking about our son.

Does it get better? Does anyone have a crystal ball and can tell me they wont last....??!!

And how can I move on? I have tried the whole no contact thing - which worked for a while, but then I broke and sent him a long message about how he had ruined my life.... :( . I have read a ton of post affair books (including not just friends) but still struggle to make sense of it all some days. I know that he will definitely not come back as he has said this several times as he no longer loves me and the deep feelings he has for the OW. Trying to be positive but it is so, so hard some days........

Dee, this is just a quick message as Im at work - but I was reading your last few posts and wanted to comment - im so sorry you have been worked up by him and his thoughtless behaviour again - but I disagree with some of the advice you are getting here. You need to take a deep breath and look at how much you are allowing him to affect your every mood and feeling - he did leave you, it was painful and hurtful and you felt let down and humilated - but at some point you will need to begin to accept that it all happened and move forward. He will always be in your life and he will always be the person he is - you are not going to change him and now you dont need to, because he is not your problem anymore. This rage towards him isn't going to change him, it's just upsetting you - because you are still expecting him to accept your pain.

Being realistic - what could he do now to make you feel better? He is with her, that's the way it is - she is a cow for refusing to meet you in the first place, but honestly , it is better you meet - stop thinking about how he might 'use' that ie. will use it as evidence that you ahve all moved on and everything is fine.

YOu cannot live your life worrying about what he will do and what other people will think. Let them think what they like. Please do not say anything to her when you meet about your relationship with him - think very seriously about what you hope to gain from doing that. You will, I garuntee, walk away from a bitter and angry encounter feeling humiliated and angry - you will have allowed the anger to eat you up - and it will not go away by turning it on her.

For your own sake, if you meet her, take a good friend and be calm, calm, calm - hide your anger - this woman may be in your life for ever. For your sons sake, do not get into an argument about why your relationship broke up.

She knows he was with you - there is nothing you can say that she wont self justify, or he wont lie about. You cannot 'win' by pointing out how much you have hurt. You will walk away feeling better if you project a dignified front, and leave her thinking you dont give a shit about her and simply have your sons interests at heart.

you have moved on through detachment, now you are back in the middle of the worst pain, because you have allowed him to upset you again. Yes he wants overnights - dont waste your energy thinking about his poor communication - he isnt going to change. Your enegry is completely being sucked into him, her, the drama, your anger - you need that energy to move forward with your own life.

nothing you say to her about your hurt and pain will make you feel better - you want acknowledgement - but they will never give that to you. You will be better off making your own life happy and creating as much polite distance between you and them as possible. You need to move beyound the place where each text/ email upsets you. Do not give them further ammunition to criticise you or say you are crazy/ overly upset.

at what point do you think you can begin to accept that this is what he did, this is how he treated you, and this simply is the way things are? You cant undo it, you cant make him someone he isn't. I know its naff, but as the buddhists say - acceptance is the beginning of peace. Live your life and do not let them rock your emotional boat anymore.

With the post still coming to your house - I know you don't really want to have to deal with it at all but could you just cross out and put his new address / stick a label over the top and pop it back in the post? (My mum used to do this with my post when I was at uni).

That way it's out of your hands. He'll have to wait for his mail to go back through the post system, which might (??) make him do something about updating his details, but it also means you're 'passing it on' as soon as it reaches you..?

I know you don't want to have to do this at all, sorry if this is a stupid idea but just thought I'd mention it in case it helps x

I tend to agree with Waterrat. She?s right about the amount of power you are giving him by being caught up with his games. Spring?s advice still holds true? GET AWAY FROM HIM.

He?ll continue to do all sorts of crappy things to you and your DS but you have a choice about how much you let that get to you. And a choice about how much you create your own life away from him so that his schedule soon becomes a distant memory and all that concerns you is the drop off etc. Some others have said that his interest will dwindle in time, and I can see that happening. The OW won?t stay the doormat for ever. To be honest, he doesn?t really have a clue what she?s like. But he does know what you are like and can play you like a fiddle.

So put your yourself firmly in your fiddle case and let him play games with someone else?s emotions.

Waterrat has got it spot on about not having a go at the OW. It doesn?t matter what you say. They have their own reality and don?t really care how much they have hurt you. They may even get off on the whole idea, in some ways making their own passion --egotistical romp-? even more compelling. Please heed what has been written about exposing yourself to more hurt. Don?t confront this woman and don?t look for answers from him. He feels he's entitled and thats all that matters to him.

This is hard ball and you need to find yourself the biggest bat you can lay your hands on (metaphorically ) and start batting these hurts back to him. The best way to do that is to be smarter than him, even if it feels as though you are losing. Don?t sweat the small stuff and you will start to see small changes and get control of your life back again.

My point about saying what you like is... that you can say what you like. You can choose. YOu may choose to let them have it or to say nothing - but it will be your choice. My point is that you choose what you say and what you don't say, you don't have to have your choice dictated to you by the fuckhead and his sidekick.

i always think it's good to know you have a choice when you are feeling hemmed in, feeling frightened to move/speak/do. YOu can try out different approaches, see what fits (try them out in the mirror? on paper? even, in person?). The whole point of any of that is to feed you, not them. As long as it's all for you (and ds of course) and not a drop of it is for them, to assuage them in any way, then do exactly what you like.

love to all you lovely women, who didn't deserve this shit

Hi,

Another day and today today brings a photo taken at the weekend on the day ex had DS. No one else in the photo bar DS and the daughter of one of ex's friends......I have ignored and will not reply to him (as I have done the other photos since the beginning of July when I explicitly asked him to stop sending me pics). Thankfully no calls or texts today. It sometimes seems like what my Relate counsellor said - he is heaping his guilt on me (excessive contact demands, photos/emails/texts) and trying to validate his 'good dad' stance and it seems I am the only one who is was willing to listen to his nonsense. Today was also the day when DS first said her name - said her name, then mentioned 'Daddy's house' and then 'OW/NGF running'. Tried to change the subject, though did say to him 'OW/NGF doesn't live here' to which he seemed happy with. But a heart-curdling moment..... .

Yes - I do (of late) give his emails and texts too much weight and importance in my life at the minute. Honestly though - I just wish he didnt send them in the first place.

Waterrat/McNaughty/Springy - many thanks for the posts. I do get the point about not worrying about what he is up to or what other people think. I certainly wasnt like this before this happened (i think). But, ex has, for some weird reason, decided to make this drama very public and very dramatic. I had a RL friend tell me that she would never have told anyone that ex had left her for someone else - I had no choice. Over NYE, whilst I was sat here in a right muddle, ex and OW had declared themselves in a relationship with each other on FB - a FB page that I knew nothing about (muggins here at the time still thought he was in the US to clear his head and that there was no one else on the scene). Hence, mid Jan, I get people coming up to me in the supermarket expressing sympathy about what had happened over NYE (ditto when I started new job). I should ignore them, but ex's actions have given me a complex - a lot of people knew what he was up to before I did. He has no qualms about giving chapter and verse on our bad relationship and how happy he is now to anyone who asks and yet if I dare utter anything remotely hinting at the truth of how ex's new blissful life came to be, I get 'Dee34, why do you feel the need to tell everyone everything about us?'. I dont feel like I can win sometimes.....though, can see how re-gaining control and not letting him dictate or direct this drama anyone will go some way towards fully moving on and healing. So enough of the games now..and yes, he can go and fiddle with someone else.

Still undecided about ever meeting here - though think that at this moment in time, it is not a good idea (though who knows - could change my mind next week). But, yes, from the very beginning, it was always a case of bring a friend......

Well - I would send him a text to remind him, but am loathe to start/initiate any conversation with him unless essential. Much easier to copy the text/make a note of it and delete it. Good idea though - if I was dealing with a half decent person.....

Am off to think a bit more about this whole situation and see where I can regain control and move yet more steps away from him (most obvious one I guess is my initiating overnights, rather than sitting here cowed waitng for him to state his position etc).

Huge, huge thanks as always. This board makes me think so very much and for all the right reasons.

dx

i think the best way to regain control is just to focus on your son and inform him that he is only to contact you aout xyz, on xyz days unless in an emergency. you dont need these unwarranted emails etc, tell him to stop sending them once and for all otherwise you will instruct a solictor to enforce. now you have to start getting tough, youve put up with enough shit from this man. with regards to the OW dont initiate him staying over, let him get used to the OW a bit more first and besides let this be 'his' problem, dont make it yours. concentrate on your life with your ds, hes big enough to concentrate on his own issues. oh, and get him to change his postal address, that would infuriate me. cant remember if ive read this on this thread but WASH THAT MAN OUTTA YOUR HAIR!!

Hi Dee

So much good advice on here. So need to pay more attention. Why I'm surprised I don't know (definition of insanity expecting a different result I guess) but ex today contacted my solicitor to inform them he has made an application for divorce proceedings and would they accept service of papers. Angry (senseless I know) that a. he didn't have courtesy to email me directly and say he was serving b. he contacting my lawyers directly which has incurred costs for me when I can easily accept them directly (there is no way I can 'refuse' to be divorced within the legal system here having been separated for a year (initially I disagreed with ex's dates but then said who cares put whatever date you like down as the net result is the same). I have informed him I will accept them directly (to avoid more costs) but the lack of courtesy and respect still burns even though I am an idiot to expect consideration at this point. Oh and on a day when I sent him an email at 8am this morning (now its 5pm) informing him that son is still sick (he has been sick since Monday) and that I can't miss work tomorrow as have a wedding fair (irony - much?) and could he arrange to have DS if he is still sick. NO response to that (not even a no) but he has had time to file divorce, fax my lawyers and then respond to an email about it from me. Idiot. He is also refusing to pay for a return flight to Birmingham (nearest airport to my parents) only to London (3 hours drive) - que sera.....sorry for mini-rant but it is just desperately annoying and I need to distance distance distance.......

Sorry to hear he's being such a shit Dolly. really sorry about the divorce papers, ds, london/b'ham. Bless you babe. but you'll be in blighty soon - can you do a runner?

I wonder if he didn't tell you because he didn't want you to pre-empt him by filing for divorce in England where the system is more sympathetic to women dolly?

He's still a total arsewipe, obviously.

Hi - been away for a few days, mostly working on a few things (me!).

Am glad to say that NC is still on-going. Texting has trickled down to a drip (I just dont answer anymore - have even stopped gritting my teeth and turned off my 'but am I being rude/mean/not nice?' switch and just gone with it). He is still trying his luck - didn't bother phoning for DS yesterday when he was supposed to - as per reduced contact agreement - instead, a text 1.5 hours later asking how DS is? He was obviously out - as he confirmed this morning on pick-up when he lamented how he saw a ladybird when out last night and how he thought of DS at the time (DS is into ladybirds at the moment). Just ignored him and let him ramble on, so cant even remember what he fully said in the end, did not even bat an eyelid as honestly dont care anymore (amazingly, I was actually thinking about other stuff - was trying to work out whether to go to the dump or go to the gym first and then what room I would start gutting in terms of getting rid of crap.....did not think that day would come round as usually I have been prone to over-analysing his words and actions. Now, it just seems like 'cant-be-bothered-when-are-you-going?') . Ditto for when I was in supermarket the other day and I bumped into old colleague that we both know - cue lots of sympathy etc and he then mentioned that he (ex) was posting photos of them on FB and some proms thing they had been to at the RAH. I quickly changed the subject - did not want to know where he has been/what he is doing/what he is posting (though had a good old chuckle as ex was never into proms stuff before and would have willingly paid for me to take a friend than take him to that type of event). One good thing he did mention was that he had noticed how ex was now suddenly posting vast number of photos of DS on his FB page as if (in colleagues words - have not seen him in years and did not talk much about mechanics of the split as its a bit yawn now) 'he is trying to prove to the world what a great dad he is now'. Seems a few people have noticed this....ah, well.

So yes, lots more proper focus on me and DS.

Got an academic diary from cheap card shop so will start using that from tomorrow and tell ex he needs to fill it in when valid/with vital info.

mycherubs - yes, I think that although I probably thought I was doing detachment, I was probably paying too much heed and attention to ex and his wants/needs which he can easily manipulate as he tries to spin it as DS's wants and needs. But drawing strength day by day now. He really can get to f* if he starts with demands and belittling me. And I mean that as in a 'dont know, dont care' manner more than anything else. As for his post, would love to stick it where the sun doesnt shine (esp when he tells me off for not passing it on quickly enough!). I have long refused to sign for any mail for him, so guessing that stuff goes back. But, shows the arrogance - he is happy to have his mail sent here (his open AMEX bill last week and today his payslip turns up). He is just super, super lazy (and I was always the skivvy-drawers who did all that stuff when it came to moving house). Yep, will get my black marker out and start doing return to sender.

I can sniff a bit if freedom now......

Dolly - sorry to hear about the way the divorce application was dealt with by the ex. I would echo what has been said on here before - just keep this in mind when it comes to remembering what a tool he is. Also, hard as it is - dont over examine why he has done this. Its just the person he is now (i.e. he is not the person you knew before) and to try and make sense of it would drive you to madness quicker than him iyswim. Best bit of advice I have had on here and in RL is to expect NOTHING from my ex - no niceness, no being reasonable, no being civil, nothing. That way nothing can shock me (and send me reeling as I stand bewildered wondering how the ex I knew could have done this). It takes time and a different mind-set, one I am still grappling with now, but honestly, although it sounds extreme, I tend to think the worst of my ex and take it from there.....also makes you better equipped to deal with him (again, only in my experience).

can you not instruct him to get his address changed, seriously you cant eb reposting all his mail - its cumbersome and you got better things to do, it will grate after a while ... although i guess if you return to sender it may prompt the sender to investigate his address ... you definately got to get them to stop ... you just dont need the reminder of him ... and oh yes and believe me everyone and i say everyone will see him as a little shit, have no doubt, one does not leave their long term partner and very young child without having their character stripped!

have a lobely day with your ds and take care there

both you ladies (dolly too) are doing great, i just hope the pain heals quick x

Have tried that - several times, even used the 'how come you can trust your post including credit card statements, new credit cards/debit cards, payslips etc coming here and yet dole out petty nonsense that shows you have no respect for me' (ad-libbed of course). I cant even remember his last response, but general gist is that he didn't want to change his address as house he is in now was a temp move.....yep, and he is still there 7 months later and has no intention of moving anytime soon (got a very vague 'in the near future' last time I asked when he was moving as this was a stated priority for him once new gf arrived here......obv far too busy shopping in Tescos, going to last night of the proms and playing happy families with DS to focus on this ). I suspect it is a combination of laziness (may have mentioned this trait before) and control/asserting this as still his home - esp as I now do not allow him over the doorstep. Though this is the same person who, when I asked him to move his clothes from the wardrobe in my bedroom, said 'Dee34, I will not move them. Why should I? They are not harming you' (again, ad-libbed, but general gist - think I must have added the exact words in a post around the time). This was in March-April time I think, just before I stopped him coming round here in the evenings for DS' bath...

On the external perception thing.....I did struggle with this a few months ago. Ex was saying that he was getting support from people at work (how he looked happier, good that he had done what was right for him etc etc). I seriously started to question myself and my sanity - should I just put up, shut-up and get over this now type of navel-gazing. I was quickly re-assured that ex was talking nonsense (and also was conveniently leaving about the trawdy details of his hook-up with new gf). Having a work colleague - who I never see, had no idea he was connected to ex on FB etc, recognise some behaviours that are strange has been, well, good! Again, I just feel like he is selling his soul to the devil and doing things he would never have done in the past - then again, this could be the real him as he proclaims. Not sure I really care anymore - just keen to be out of the firing line once a little bit of shit hits the fan........

We had a lovely day - will have to come back and post more. Went to Sea Life centre (met friends in the am for indulgent motorway brekkie, then stroll on the pier, f+c lunch, ice cream (how many wipes did I use in the end?!), funfair rides including a giant inflatable slide - had to hold DS' hand to come down as was very high up (for me) and of course being 3, he has no fear.........great fun. And tomorrow may be a visit to local cinema....but need a film of around 60mins or so for DS and think Cars 2 is double that!

On another point, my sister in law convinced me to join Match.com.....not to find love of my life, but to get a bit of confidence - alas, not much talent in my area!

Hello Everyone

Well firstly, I thought I may give you all a bit of a laugh. Just had to shame ex into seeing DS this Sunday for Father's Day over here. Was temped to leave it to show him up and enjoy being parenting martyr but don't want DS to feel left out as all his friends having special days (in the agreement he is entitled to have him from 6pm night before to 6pm night of). Please see below text exchange of someone trying to wriggle out of it whilst thinking they are being clever enough to blame me at the same time:

Me - are you planning on having DS on Sunday
Him - I had him this past weekend
Me - Fathers Day
Him - I realised this today (untrue as he has a Fathers Day night at Kindy on Thursday which he is going to but what the hey)
Me - And?
Him - What does the agreement say? (btw he can quote his chapter and verse usually)
Me - ex, are you going to see him or not - no drama i'm just trying to plan weekend
SILENCE
Me - I'm guessing no from your first response - let me know as I am planning
Him - I don't have the agreement in front of me, I had him last weekend so I guess not
Me - ex, you are able to see him in agreement and in common sense - if you have plans I am happy to have him - please give me a direct answer
Him - I did not believe that I had him this weekend so had made plans which I can unmake
Me - Direct answer please
Him - I think i just did
Me - Is that a no you are not seeing him? As I said I am making plans
Him - Make your plans - I would hate to upset your apple cart even further
Me - ex you are being disengenous - the option is yours

anyway after a while he came back and said he would have him from midday for a few hours - I stupidly then engaged emotionally and said great you are prioritising girlfriend over him and he is now seeing him all day.

Anyway, thought you would all appreciate how he tried to make me the bad person in this whilst being flaky father - this sums up how he is now but I am no longer stupid enough to take it on board - Idiot. This has also happened over the divorce - papers he filed had clerical error in them (he had filled out wrong information in wrong boxes) - I asked him to redo and file again (on lawyer's advise as otherwise I have to fill in a response document and go to family court and pay and file it - this is usually used for when couple disagree on pertinent facts for diveroce - separation dates etc etc and not to amend someone's form filing mistakes although technically can be - don't feel like I have to go to time and expense and happy to sign correct documents and leave it at that - he also ticked the box that said I would be appearing at court when I have no need to as not contesting and am not required to). Anyway, as he obviously is annoyed he will have to do things properly and pay again this becomes me playing power games and being obstructive. Again not falling for that one and sticking to my guns. Am wising up - somewhat belatedly.

Sorry a bit detail but again good not to bore too many people in RL!

So Dee, I say go for it with dating - just tread carefully - my date on Saturday was fun but not my type - fun though and he was nice enough - just let him down gently via text actually. I have only had a few dates but my advice would be to not be scared of 'approaching' people you like the look of and also whilst it is good to exchange an email or two, don't have a 'virtual' chat for too long as people can often appear very different to how they write and as in real life you need to meet to see if the spark is there - also do coffee/early evening drinks so you are not stuck for the whole night....also dont' get too down if they don't go so well - I think people forget that in real life the first date happens as you have met someone, are attracted to them and established enough of spark to accept / ask for first date - first date internet dates are really pre-first dates if you see what I mean so likely high attrition rates!

Re your ex and other people - they are not stupid - I have been surprised and quite happy to recently learn that lots of people I assumed he was in contact with have taken a pretty dim view of his behaviour and he has lied (in detail lies - not just can't do that weekend but can't do that weekend as I am going here with this person and I did this type long detailed lie) to them all so much they are currently saying they are done with him - these are life long friends so doubt it but the truth does come out and people do reveal their true colours.

Lots of love and hope everyone is enjoying the bank holiday x

My ex is stark raving mad. Apparently, I have been letting friends and 3rd parties babysit DS whilst I am out painting the town red. Wouldn't mind if it was half true! I have not had a night out for yonks! Nights out were abandoned a couple of weeks ago as I came down with the lurgy and if I had made it out, it would have been my Mum babysitting! I have had friends offer to babysit since new gf arrived, but have not had the chance to take up any offers due to clashing dates and illness.....so I have no idea where he has got this idea from, but it is something that is very much lodged in his head and what is driving (it seems) his increased demand to have DS overnight as he should be left with ex not with other people.....

Gah - am going to broach the whole sleeping over thing with ex next week. Am sick to the back teeth of his nonsense now - though finding his ramblings more amusing now than upsetting. Apparently he and new gf have been 'in limbo these past 2 months' as DS has not been able to sleep over......talk about getting what you want....ex seems to forget that he has done what he has liked (bar sleeping over) with new gf in mind from the day she arrived here. Utterly bonkers that they are in limbo, when she has just arrived - of course my being in limbo re job, DS, house etc is of no big concern. He has also reiterated that everyone he has introduced new gf to has been 'extremely' nice to her and about her (not just nice). Obviously he really got lucky there. Honestly, not even worth spending the text/bandwidth allowance to reply back to him. I do wonder if all the folk he has introduced her to know the full background of their beginnings? Probably not, but am beyond caring (unless someone wants to rave about how good ex and new gf is to my face). My initial upset about DS going over has been battling for space with the good feeling of thinking that I dont ever have to be in a relationship with him ever again. Re overnights, I have this course to possibly go on the following week which would involve an overnight stay, so if I went, I would at least have a distraction and not have to be sat around the corner imagining what DS is up to. I am worried that DS will now be dragged to and from the train station so ex can pick her up (something hat will grate, but will have to grit my teeth I guess as we both agreed not to do this when together and ex or I would get a cab or wait for the bus or get a lift. I dont want to waste my breath asking him not to do this, just to have to hear that someone has spotted DS at the train station one evening)......I was planning on starting potty training soon, so hmmmm, yes, quite timley for ex to have to do his share here too (just hope he can remain bloody consistent!).

Dolly - sorry you are having to deal with this and esp over Fathers Day! Madness. How could he forget that?! I would just not even bother suggesting anything to him next time. Just make your plans and that's that. I can just imagine that he would have been going back to OW and deliberating this (didn't you say that she had a child as well? Was said child spending time with his/her Dad per-chance? Dont bother asking of course, but just that it could have been a bit convenient for him not to have DS that day). As was recently said on here - these folk just are not the same people we knew. This becomes more and more clearer to me each day.

Dating - hmmmm.......am not overly convinced I am ready! I get the fear whenever I log onto Match and see that someone has winked at me (I cant help feeling that they must be desperate/after anything with a pulse as I have not put a photo up - yet - and no sales blurb!). And in the main, they are not really my type. As for approaching RL folk - gosh, wish I had the confidence! I do spend a lot more time looking at nice blokes ring fingers first (and sighing/avertig my eyes when I see any band type rings). But they are few and far between in any case....so will be focusing on myself and DS more I think......and lots to work through there I think..

Proper post later as doing breakfast but just to clarify - I meant approach people on match.com not in real life (so you control the process) - I'm not ballsy enough in RL either!!!!

re the overnight stays that are keeping ex and OW 'in limbo' - when he gets what he wants with this one he'll get what he wants with something else. Then something else. Then - well, you get the gist. I don't think this is about ds - i don't honestly think he is interested in ds - i think it's about obliterating you from the picture - and I don't think he will give up on that one. Somebody will probably come along with the psychology of why he is behaving in this way but painting you as the scarlet woman is part of it. Truly, mad - as you say.

I do so wish you'd get out of there and hope the day you do is not too far off. xx

Hey Dee

You know what it doesn't matter if you go out and use a babysitter. It is actually none of his business.

I'd trust a wino on a park bench to put your son's emotional well being before this twat. Especially seeing how he can fuck off for extended working away trips to fit in OW and ignore seeing your son, fucking off to see his family with OW and going off on holidays and not making any arrangements for when he should have had you son. Who did he think was going to babysit for him any of these times?? Oh wait he didn't even consider his son did he! .

It is just so laughable though. Just think how pathetic this man is, how well shot you are and that she is now stuck with him.

Save the messages for any future 'evidence'. He clearly cannot give specific people, times or examples.

I really can't say it enough. What a twat. I hope you don't still have any doubts that you are well shot!

Hi - been a few days.....and I am back in the NC groove. Had to have a brief dialogue with ex about house today (see below!). Also had to ahem, educate him the parenting of little people..i.e. just because DS has been saying that he wants to see lions, it does not mean that he gets to go to the zoo in the pm, after he had a trip to a wildlife park (with lions!) 2 weekends ago today. I could have course have reminded him that DS was sat here looking lost and lonely and crying for Daddy over NYE, but ex decided to stay put and see out his holiday tryst, but cant be arsed!

Xales - yep, have kept the message. His evidence is based on people who he doesnt need to tell me about......Riiggghhhhtttttt. I just cant get that he thinks I would leave DS with any old person just to spite him in some way. Babysitter offers have come from several (in fact, all) good friends - and friends that ex is aware of. But I would only take a few up on this. And they would be the ones whom DS and I have had good/high levels of interaction with on a regular basis. Tbh, knew he would be like this, which is why I have not chomped off the arm of a (known) babysitter to come round. And, I would prefer for either parent to have DS on a night when the other could not nake it (though not been an option as yet)....Yes, am totally, totally happy that I am not with him anymore. He is just utterly pathetic - and yep, she will be stuck with him now. Yippee! Yes, he is most certainly her problem now....how she can sit there, feeling safe and secure in the knowledge that he would ditch his first born and so far, only child and partner of 11 years for someone who has not been here for 11 weeks yet, is just amazing. But, hey, their problem I guess.....
Oh and talking work trips/breaks muppet is now off for first two weeks in Oct (with the odd day or so back here) as he goes off on multiple conferences. Totally not interested in where he is going and what plane he is catching (details kindly sent to me in the email). Will of course make a note in my diary of dates. At least this time he did give me advance notice.

springy - you may well have a point. A bit deep, but I had suggested in an email that we would need to consider certain aspects of DS development in him sleeping over at ex's. Now, I was meaning that ex would need to pull up his socks and muck in, esp in say potty training. He read this as me saying that because DS has upcoming developmental trials to master, that this would prevent him sleeping over!!!
I think his interest in DS is there - but on a superficial level. Its all about play and having a good time. When DS intimates any of his feelings about current situation (e.g. saying 'mummy, daddy, ds' and pulling us all together into a hug), ex changes the subject to DS. There does not appear to be any acknowlegdement of what has happened............but, as counsellor said, I can only focus on my own interaction with DS.

Good news - can at last (after a fall through in early days) confirm that house has been sold! I have been so petrified that it would all fall through - leaving me in position where ex would be dictating the odds/buying me out. But it seems to be going through now....so race is on to find somewhere else to live. And of course that has implications as DS starts school next year, so need to think about that when looking for somewhere to rent. Ex is not moving anytime soon as he is struggling to find somewhere in his budget and that is child friendly (yeah, right....more like he quite likes where he is at the moment and new gf is still a newbie at this to accept that she will be the one who will have an extra long commute, though I think ex is still dropping her off at train station/picking her up, so he is giving up a bit as well). Anyway, after the whole Tescos' fiasco, dont believe a word he says and just going to go about my own way). I told him the house news today (I am dealing with it all) and wished him luck/happiness. He was 'not happy' about how this had all ended apparently...funny, he gives a very good impression of otherwise .

Have been surprisingly up-beat about the house news - been a long time coming I think as I have sat in anticipation of what would happen. I did think back to that day on Wednesday the 5th/6th Jan (or whenever it was - dont have a diary at the mo) when ex came back from his NYE trip, on such a high (of course, I did not know at the time that he was on a sex-fuelled high as was under the impression that the OW he admitted to on NYE itself was someone who lived here and had been here the whole time he was there - gosh, I was so clueless! Wish I had thought to post on MN back then) that he wanted to put the house on the market that very day. He was on such a high he went around the house that day whistling and singing to himself - very bad taste which I called him out on....but, am blabbering....yes, back to that day when I really was feeling lost and lonely. I feel so very, very different now. So, as always, a huge, huge thanks from me for the support and battle cries. Long road ahead still but cant believe I have made it this far.

Plus points about moving from this house:

• No longer have to battle with ex about whether he can/cant come in.
• Will be rid of some very bad memories (I will always have doubts about 'us' now as he put it in my head that he has regrets spanning the last 10 years!).....but best memory will be of having DS and bringing him back here, his first home.
• Have the freedom to move wherever I so please....! springy - I do hear you, honestly, I do
• Only tie to ex will be DS....
• Will no longer have to pick up and gather his post for him! Cheeky so and so has all sorts delivered here....
• Can decorate to my taste now...(start to invest in some funky pieces for the house without him moaning and groaning about things).
• Will be clearing out some shit and making way for next chapter in my life!

Dolly - how are things with you? Ah, I see re. dating! Again, am totally clueless (obviously). Not sure about Match.com......all the blokes on there (in my area anyway) look a bit pervy (sorry!). Thinking I would rather try something like mysinglefriend or Guardian Soulmates......though, totally not in any rush!

Sorry about the ultra long post!

tbh I'd be worried that wherever you moved he would buy something close. As you say, he's mad

btw I'm so sorry this has been such a nightmare Dee. It's been horrific (hug)

Woot!!!!! Huge congratulations on the house sale.

There are 16 weeks (roughly) until 2012. Then this shitty 2011 is over for you. You can leave all the vile shit that this man has put you through this year (and the last 6 months, year 10 years when he wasn't happy snorts) behind you. The only thing you will need to discuss with ex is your son. Nothing else will matter any more.

If there is any of his shit left tell him he has until X date to get it out or you will assume it is unwanted and it will go to the dump. Do this officially in writing. Don't trust him an inch of shifting a spare sock of his that is lurking somewhere!!!!!

Of course he is unhappy. You are moving on. Up until you move out he can keep that little germ of a thought that pathetic little Dee is sitting in your shared house ready and waiting for him to be 'sorry he made a mistake' and can come back to. This is part of the you off out painting the town red comments too. He is hoping you will argue back to show you still care. As you have done the best response is no response.

Now time to find a shiney house for you and DS which is all yours. That he has no key and no rights to. One you can decorate as and how you like. One that is your sanctuary to make lovely fresh new memories of yourself with DS. One that you can hopefully one day (when you are ready) some amazing, mind blowing sex with a few hot guys

Don't know where you are but if you are not too far from the Surrey/Berks/Hampshire border I am happy to come and help shift boxes. Especially crappy ones to the dump

ah yes, sorry for my miserable post

I am overjoyed that you have sold your house. hoo bloody rah rah rah, future beckons

What I menat about him buying somewhere close is that he hasn't bought yet. I'm wondering if you can hang around somehow (somehow??) to wait for him to buy so that you can hightail as far away as possible off somewhere. Maybe he's wiating for you to buy so that he can buy iyswim.

gorgeous day in these parts, hope it's good your way too

Thanks for the support - means a huge, huge amount to me. As I have waffled on before, I would never have thought I would have got to this place that I am in now when this all kicked off on the 28th December. Still a heck of a long way to go, but I am just so, so grateful that the house is going through, that I have a job (albeit full-time, meaning DS is in nursery full-time), and that I am finally starting to see ex for what he is now. The old 'partner' I knew is long gone, dead, and this is the person I will have to deal with forever more. Though I still have a whimsical side to me that hopes that as the honeymoon period ease for ex and new gf and they grind down into daily life, that he will start to become more reasonable and it will click that maybe he could just try treating me with some respect (this is just a fantasy right?!).....But wishful thinking and all that I guess.

springy - I will be renting for now - need to stay in the area for job and DS nursery. I was tempted to look for somewhere to buy when house first went on the market months ago (liked the idea of being settled somewhere etc). But have slowly gone off the idea as ex has remained lodged around the corner from us. So, plan for now is rent for say 6-8 months and see how the ex thing pans out (i.e. as mentioned above - will he start to 'settle' down a bit or will he (god forbid), up the ante and take things further) as well as work out what and where I want to be - this is the time to make any changes that need to be made, before DS starts school next year.....I try not to dwell too much on what he is doing, but with his recent news about how he cant find anywhere, I have a feeling he is focusing on wedding and then planning to buy a dream house. He could well be waiting to see what DS and I do/go (he has already asked a couple of times about where I am planning on moving to, even dropping a few areas into his email as places he assumes I am thinking about - red flag for me. Did not respond to his email) and then end up following us, but he does love this area so much, so if I move, it would be a wrench for him to follow (and by then, as someone pointed out, new gf could well have more of a say in the matter and might not want to be schlepping all around the UK following me and DS around).

xales - gosh, hadn't thought about it like that. I.e. 16 weeks and then into 2012! I think I was more thinking of the pending anniversaries as hurdles to jump through. yep, roll on 2012!! Hadn't thought about writing to ex to move his stuff. He has a heck of a lot of stuff here still (I cleared out 5 bin bags and one holdall of clothes from his wardrobe months ago). He had things in his bedside cabinet and he has not touched the garage in terms of taking his stuff (bar the friggin fridge freezer I paid for which is now in his house - irony is that fridge freezer here is now knackered! Arggghh! But he can keep it - will buy a new one, to my own taste when we move). And the muppet actually hired a removal firm to help him when he left in Jan - they spent most of the day sitting in the cab of their van as ex spent REMOVAL DAY sorting through and packing up his stuff - and that was obviously just visible stuff. And that would be because when we have moved house before, I have had to do all the packing myself - his stuff, my stuff, shared stuff. He only ever packed his personal papers and immediate wardrobe of stuff. I hope he is not thinking that my removal firm will drop his stuff at his house (esp as its just around the corner)....have started my packing already. Now on the scrounge from friends for boxes. Am looking forward to the big clearing out process.....I really, really want to embrace this as a new positive chapter for DS and I. I did have a fleeting 'oh, he really does not care that he has put us in this position' moment earlier today (triggered as with friends for lunch and they are a loved up couple etc), but, actually, this is the hand I/we have been dealt. No changing it now. And I agree, I think he has been playing this idea of sad old me, staying in and living in half his house and being a miserable cow who no one would ever want, so he could wander back in when he so wanted after I had learnt my lesson and he had come to his senses blah, blah (ohhh, just wondered if this is what is behind all the daft compliments of 'you look nice today dee34', 'thats a nice outfit - it suits you', 'I know that you are a very attractive woman and would expect you to have admirers'....I do not respond or acknowledge any of this mumbo-jumbo).

Oh - one hot fella would be most welcome (on nights DS is with ex of course!)!!!

And thanks for the offer to help - alas am in the south-east of the country....

You could pretend you have had an offer accepted locally to see what he does? Mind you, I think he may be watching this one like a hawk, just to make sure you're firmly lodged where he wants you.

Mrs Grim again - sorry

and oi Dolly, what you up to girl

hello ladies - firstly there will be odd key strokes and no puncutation as my laptop has been out of action as - i kid you not - a baby possum got trapped on my balcony and was terrified crying for its mum - i eventually reunited them via a firemans lift on a broom but it took an hour of marsupial stand-off and during that time he peed on my keyboard and shorted it...still a bit dodgy and the letter than comes after w is not working so no kisses for anyone today....you couldnt make it up could u - oh and apostrophe and other punctuation out of action.....

so dee dee - woop woop on the house sale - that is most ecellent - see not got all my letters - news indeed and will give you a new focus and project and will be a fresh start - v v pleased for you....sadly market shit here and still no offers - and currently my studio apartment is free for first time in ages is vacant so a bit financially pressed as that gave me about 150 quid a week cash which we pretty much lived on...hey ho...have three week booking in oct though so hoping to get something before then...house is a state though so half tempted to offer to backpacker - our village has a one because of the surf - for free in return for gardening etc - and a dishy latin american wouldn't hurt either would it ladies....

i also feel yr pain re babysitters - i have had same along the lines of the fact i never used them before - missing the irony that i didn't need them as had a husband when i went out with girlfriends....it is control and silly buggers and above all an eg of their self absorbtion...we dont have real lives do we so why would we ever go out.....ignore ignore ignore

dh cant write the letter that goes before this so will say cunty dh is being a cunt - hassling me to sign divorce documents for no reason as i will sign in time frame required but he used fathers day here to send me 3 phone messages and 2 emails harassing me to...he then had a go in front of ds when he dropped him off. i am furious at him as son is now 'daddy hates you mummy'...when i had spent week saying nice things about dh in relation to the special day he would have with him on fathers day....very over the top but i told him i would not hesitate to get the equiv of a restraining order if he pulled something like that in front of ds. i am over being pathetic. a humorous aside - he also turned up wearing shane warne's new wardrobe - definately more boyband than 44 yr old although sadly he could more of less pull it off - he used to be a model in his 20s - but still pretty lame....think drainpipes, low v neck sweater, aviator shades and product in hair...dick.

good news is that a very generous friend has lent me her holiday rental apartment in palm cove in tropical queensland for free for the week that my divorce comes through so will be sipping cocktails with ds and declining to attend court. dh was a dick about that too....lost out on cheap flights as he was 'why aren't you aligning it with our co-parenting plan and going over weekend i don't have him. - when i had said have him the weekend before we go....should have pointed out his three week holiday with mistress on a weeks notice didn't really align either nor has he used one day of his leave in the last year to spend with his son.....have also booked flights for uk - am doing three day stopover in hk on way back and have not told dh as i figure fuck him i don't have to attend every argument i am invited to and i can't be arsed to go through the pain....see...am much more fearless now....

dating wise - home and away person / comedian was a fun date but very keen and not my type so declined second date but was a really nice guy for someone - not me.....property developer is either good odd or bad odd...not sure...had one date and having a drink later on....quite brash american - randomly used to be ballet dancer for 15 years and now on brink of bankrupcy...not a dull moment...dont think there is any chemistry though and he is a bit short she says superficially.....but possibly fun for mini fling...am going to decide tonight....am not very anticpatory though so that prob tells you all you need to know....

anyway kisses all and i am serious about a thread meet up at christmas if anyone is keen......

dolly

Dolly - WRITE A BOOK !

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