Feeling lost and lonely (ex had an affair, left us)

[Dee34]

Hi All,

This is my first post on these boards, though I have posted my story elsewhere......I just cant seem to stop thinking and mulling over things and searching for answers :(

Bit of a long story, but to start from the beginning, on Tuesday 28th Dec my ex announced that he was not in love with me anymore (usual cliches about being best friends, love you but etc). This of course sent me into a tailspin as I had just endured an awful xmas at his parents in Scotland that he insisted we go to (dont get on with his folks as they have never helped us out with DS and ex always seemed to avoid confrontation and would never raise any issues directly with them which made for an increasingly tense atmosphere). For background, back in November when I knew I would not be able to hack another xmas there and so I suggested we stay here and have a little family xmas, he told me that I was playing with people emotions by changing my mind and that I could stay here at home if I wanted but he and DS (2.5 years old) were going to Scotland regardless!! I guess I should have sussed that something was a bit iffy but I just brushed it off at the time (by Nov, affair had been going on for a month and actually between Oct - start of affair - and the bombshell in Dec, there was a difference in ex's attitude which I only really pin-pointed in the last few weeks). Anyway, we had a terrible night on the 28th - lots of crying, very emotional etc. I asked him if he was seeing someone else and he said no. I asked him to swear on DS life (childish I know, but said this in the heat of the moment) to which he replied no, he won't swear on his life as he doesn't do that sort of stuff but he held his hands up and promised he was telling the truth. I of course believed him as for me this was all out of the blue..On the Weds, I was quite teary and by lunchtime ex was saying that he was confused, needed some space etc. I said how about he stay in a hotel nearby and come round every day to see DS, take him out etc. I even phoned up several hotels for him to check rates and availability! This was during DS nap and by the time I had gone upstairs to get him, ex had done a spreadsheet and had decided he wanted to go to San Francisco instead. Some fluff about always liking San Fran from work trips (he has been there several times in the past year for genuine work reasons). Again, naïve fool that I was I agreed to him going. We drew up a list of issues that we would both think and work through (usual - lack of sex, though we were trying for baby number 2, arguing, his parents etc) and agreed not to tell any friends or family about what was happening until we knew what was happening ourselves so no one could 'influence' us. So ex went to San Fran and DS and I stayed here (everyone assumed he was here with us during whole period). Anyway, as soon as he was in San Fran his tone and attititude completely changed and he became very distant (he was relaxing and not looking at the issues or given them any thought etc). I finally 'broke' on NYE and asked him what was going on etc and that's when he said he had met someone but that nothing had happened between them, which was actually a lie.

To cut a long story short, he came back on Weds 5th Jan, determined not to work things out. Over the weeks I have learnt that other woman lives and works in San Fran, they met on a work trip in mid Oct last year (in a bar - only kissed - met on the second to last day before he headed back to the UK), had DAILY contact from the time ex returned home, started sleeping together during his next work trip out there in early Dec (a 5 night work trip) and that he was with her all along when he abandoned us over NYE to go to San Fran - he was having a lovely holiday, planning his life with her, whilst I was here like a muppet, trying to get an appointment with a sex therapist (as I obviously had 'issues'!). She is 30 (7 years younger than us) and had moved to San Fran from Nashville in June last year, so seems to me like there were a couple of lonely fools that met over some cocktails? Ex keeps banging on about how she is leaving her life over there (not quite sure what she is giving up bar a job and accommodation compared to what he is gambling with) to be with him, how he loves her so much, never felt like this before about anyone including me - starting to make me a bit sick if I'm honest. If you added up all the days they had actually been together from mid Oct to just before that post xmas trip, it amounts to around 6-7 days actually physically together and they weren't even together 24/7 as he was actually working on these two work trips (have confirmed with a colleague). So it was just hooking up at night and having lots of fresh and exciting nookie? Rest has been built around a deep emotional attachement from their daily calls/text/emails/webcams etc (probaby worse than having random one night stands I think). I think that even now tally of days is around 16 or so when you add on the NYE trip. But that is enough for her to give up her life and job and move here to be with him and he reckons she will be here in 3 months time (until then they will be racking up airmiles). I just dont understand it at all......I guess they are soulmates or star-crossed lovers that were destined to meet?! Everyone keeps telling me that he will one day wake up and see what he has done or that they will break up as soon as she gets here, but the flipside is that they may be together for a long while and that is something that I am now trying to reconcile with - esp as she will effectively be playing stepmum to DS even though ex doesn't really know anything about her bar what she has told him and shown him during their limited time together (of course there is the very real possibility that he is even lying about dates and that this all started way before Oct. I don't know and to be honest, don't care now as all it would prove is that he is more selfish and a bigger cheat and liar than first thought)....

Throughout all of this, ex has been going on about he need to be happy and how he has acted out of self preservation. And he has variously been unhappy for the last few months, 6 months, 9 months, 15 months, 18 months depending on what mood you catch him in when you speak to him.....unhappy for so long that I didn't notice it and yet only gets the balls to leave once he meets someone else? I can accept that we didn't have a 100% perfect relationship, but we had been together for 11 years and of course share DS so am shocked and hurt that it ended in this way. For his part, ex varies between assuming no guilt and saying that the affair was symptomatic of our relationship to wanting to do 2010 over again and make different choices and regretting going to the US over NYE and for making us go to Scotland over Xmas (apparently, as I made the atmosphere so tense for everyone, this was the last push towards making him decide to leave us.....though he hasn't commented on how his dad did his usual show of drinking 2 bottles of wine on xmas eve and not bothering to get up until gone midday so we were all sat around waiting for him as usual...).

Anyway, since then things have lurched along. He has said some horrid things to me and treated me like a fool at the best of times. I think he is so deeply entrenched in his feelings for the other woman that he has forgotten I am DS mum (again, keep asking myself, how and why can he feel so deeply for someone he has spent barely any time with?). For me, the hardest part now is facing up to the reality that I will no longer see my son every day as we move towards shared access and custody. Also hard is the fact that this other woman will be interacting with DS as and when he is staying with them. I do secretly hope that they both go back to the US (surely to happen if and when they have kids and don't think she will wait around for long as she does seem besotted with ex for some bizzare reason - her FB profile is a pic of them in you guessed it an aiprort!...) and ex only comes back here on his tod to see DS for holidays (selfish I know, but I can indulge a fantasy I guess).

Is he deluded or am I???? He has been focused on work a lot and seems to have lost a lot of his friends and social life - which I had noticed and tried to encourage him to get back up again. I am just heartbroken that he could do this to us - esp the cold and calculating way he abandoned us to go to San Fran to be with her over NYE and the fact that in the last 7 weeks our house has now gone on the market (cant afford it myself) and I am now out looking for any old job to support myself (oh, forgot to say, that I had taken voluntary redundancy from a very well paid job last March with his encouragement! When I called him up on this he said, 'oh well, but you didn't like that job anyway!!!')......
I
Inbetween all the crying and anger, I do feel like I am going crazy........This is playing on my mind a lot now as he has just flown out today to go and see her in San Fran (6 night holiday, so will take their tally up to 21-22 days or so). It pains me that he will be taking her out for meals, whereas I had to practically nag him to death to book a babysitter for our anniversary in Dec ('nagged' him, as I usually arranged everything and was in need of some attention after his work trip - of course, I now know why he wasn't that bothered...). He will be having cosy conversations and intimate chats planning their future for when she moves here and talking about our son.

Does it get better? Does anyone have a crystal ball and can tell me they wont last....??!!

And how can I move on? I have tried the whole no contact thing - which worked for a while, but then I broke and sent him a long message about how he had ruined my life.... :( . I have read a ton of post affair books (including not just friends) but still struggle to make sense of it all some days. I know that he will definitely not come back as he has said this several times as he no longer loves me and the deep feelings he has for the OW. Trying to be positive but it is so, so hard some days........

would those 7 letters be 'evilcow'?

Mycherubs - I agree.....

Springy - the idiot still didn't have the decency to say 'sorry for sending you that text'. But, yep, know he is anything but decent....

So, a lot has happened in the last day or so. Yesterday, ex sent several texts ranging from usual 'how is DS' (as mentioned) to one about house stuff and how he had posted something through the door and another one I cant even remember what he wrote now.....anyway, as said, ignored them all. Came home and there is an envelope for me, from him. Its £100 of spa vouchers for a local hotel/spa. The card reads 'Dee34, happy belated mothers day. Hope you get sometime to yourself to enjoy these. All the best, Ex'. Very,very suspicious that he would send this now (think I mentioned that for Mothers day back in April, 'all' I got was a card at midday. No chocs, no flowers, nothing. At the time, new girlfriend was in the UK, she had arrived, IIRC, the day before, so he was obviously very distracted). Anyway, alarm bells start ringing, but cant figure out what this could be......

Fast forward to today - day of DS' birthday and his party in the morning. Ex sends several texts to say happy birthday to DS, ask when his party is, who's coming, what he's doing. I ignored these - mainly as I was, er, quite busy prepping for a party for 13 toddlers, 9 babies and 13 mums! Anyway, party goes great - though I have a stinking cold and sort of flaked out at 10am! DS had a great time seeing his friends....anyway, ex came round at 4pm to pick up DS for a couple of hours (I even postponed a playdate so they could spend longer together - one of DS buddies could only come for a play after nursery, but moved them to next week and suggested ex have DS until 7pm...all fine and dandy.

Ex rolls up at 7.15pm (he is incapable of arriving here on time) and as he hands DS over says, 'DS has been saying that he wants to stay at Daddy's. I think we need to talk about this'. WTF? On the day, almost to the hour, he comes out with this nonsense? Fair enough, I know it has to happen and I do need a break, but why does he have to broach this today or all days?! I tell him, he has pretty poor timing (god, it could have waited until Saturday even when he has DS) and I am worried about DS sleeping over under the same roof as someone I cant speak to, to which he replies, oh no, she now WANTS TO MEET ME! Apparently, she wants me to see that she is not a monster (I have never called her this) and that she is 'actually a really nice person' (his words). Well, sorry to say, lost it at that. On DS birthday, after a rocky 8 months, he is telling me that she is a really nice person? What the hell is he on? Told him that she was not a nice person as she very clearly knew he was in a relationship and did not step back. To which he had no reply......I then gave him his post (he still has his mail sent here) and he left. I (unfortunately and with huge regret) sent him a text saying that 'thanks, he had now ruined my xmas, new years, birthday, mothers day and now DS' birthday'. Shouldnt have sent it, I know, and now firmly back on NC. He sent one back saying 'he was not attacking me (?) or being antagonistic, he was just repeating what DS had said and that we need to start talking about this soon, though perhaps not today'!! Anyway, not replying......

Maybe DS did say what ex said he said - funnily he did not say it again on coming back here.......

And, of course, I now know what the voucher nonsense was about*

So, now need to steel myself for DS staying over there with her also there..... No idea what to do about the whole meeting her thing - again, very iffy that 7 or so week ago when she arrived here, I was accused of being 'weird' for wanting to meet her before/during her meeting DS (along with the dictum that if I so insisted on this, then couldn't look at her, speak to her etc...). I have a possible work-trip in mid-September (I have option to go/stay here) with an overnight stay so this could be as good a time as any I guess....

I may be making a mountain out of a molehill here, but was so angry and disheartened that he had the cheek to say that today or all days.

• Vouchers will be returned on Saturday. Forgot today with the whole staying over thing.

Dolly - good luck with the dates! May start to dip my toes into the old dating field. Hope you have lots of (well deserved) fun!

Good for sending the email. I do partly wish I had contacted this girl back in the early days. I dont think it would have stopped her/them for one moment, but, she would have certain seeds of doubt/understanding planted in her head.

Why he is so bothered about you selling the (your) house? Surely known of his business or is he keen for you to start living off equity so he can reduce his maintenance payments to you (or something else as cowardly).......

Hope you are doing okay.

A few other things that I forgot to mention:

• Yesterday, ex sent an email saying that he would be moving in the near future but that it would still be this certain part of town. He is struggling to find somewhere in this location for the right prices and does not want the expense of a temp move just to move again quickly. He also mentioned that he will be looking to buy sometime soon after moving as he does not want to waste money on rent (my interpretation of this is that he has no plans whatsoever to move, he/they are quite okay where they are and they are looking for the ideal home to buy. I was half tempted to reply and ask him why he thought I needed to know that he was going to buy somewhere, but instead, ignored, ignored, ignored). He then asked me if I was planning on staying in this area for the forseeable future and what areas I would be moving to (mentioning three specific areas).

• I had a friend over visiting from up north last night. She was on a business trip, so had a hire car. Ex knows her, but she is my friend, iyswim. Anyway, her car is in the driveway when ex comes to drop off DS. He then proceeds to ask me at least 3 times whose car that is. Not done in a jealous way - more of a questioning/thinking way. He has been interested to know (in the past) if I am seeing anyone, so as to give him leverage to having DS staying with him overnight (no concern that I could shacking up with an unsavoury character - just what that would then mean for him and what he can then get).

I am probably, certainly overthinking things here and can see that I am in danger of being reeled back into the drama of this...

Sorry - a few more things (would rather vent on here, get it off of my chest than walk around the office with a frown on my face....).

• Ex's parents did not come down for DS's birthday. Everyone in RL had sort of murmured that they didn't expect them to come based on their behaviour in the past, but I really did think that they would come down for his birthday. Of course, suits me in a way as didn't have ex going on about having DS every day to accommodate their trip, but still, feel gutted for DS. They have been down just once to see him since all this started (back in April) and they dont live a million miles away. Last time they saw him before April was over xmas in Dec. They see their other grandchildren every other day (the dad) and every day (the mum) as they live a couple of streets away.

• Got a final text from ex last night about his mail. Handed over some post when he did drop off - I only give him his post when he asks for it - I dont think it is my responsibility to remind him to collect his post - so, as he is lazy, forgetful, in a rush to get home/to the train station, mail usually builds up. Text yesterday read 'Dee34, you need to pass my mail to me more quickly. We have a debt collection letter here dated 12th August for unpaid electric bill. Lets discuss tomorrow.Ex'.....Know that texts/emails can be open to mis-interpretation, but again flabbergasted that he seemed to be admonishing me for failing to hand him his mail in a timely manner.....I have told him ages ago that he needs to get his mail re-directed to his new address, but no, he didn't want to because where he is now is just a temp address (he has now been there for 7 months and showing no signs of moving on). Sent him an email saying that he should change the acccount holder details so I can open such mail and in future he should not text me only email me. Sick of his lack of respect now.....

Again, sorry for dishing up chapter and verse on this - could feel myself starting to fume....

Send all his mail back - RTS, not known at this address. Send all of it back.

When you meet her, I hope you give her what for. I hope you tell her exactly what you think of what she has done. Don't scream (unless you want to and it makes you feel better), but say it clearly. eg 'what were you thinking when you stole my future husband' type of thing. 'when you found out, how come you kept going' etc (rhetorical - there is no acceptable answer to this so cut her off if she tries one). say what you want to in the way you want to, say it clearly - plan it: you can say and do what you like. If he makes disparaging comments ignore ignore ignore - don't rise to his bait. You're in charge here, not her or turdy him. This is your day in court girl, say your piece. If you feel you are losing control then get out there and then - just turn and walk away: you can always come back for a second shot at a later date if it suits you.

And he can fuck off with his detailed account of exactly what is going on in his sad little head/life. Like, not interested, buddy, in the minutiae of your deluded little saga.

Well postie has just been with Ex's latest AMEX bill. For some reason - and am not being sarky here, I did not prise it open or anything - the envelope is not moistened/sealed. Basically, all of the Royal Mail handlers who handled this envelope could have slipped the statement out, read it and slipped it back in....so, lets just say that it fell out of said un-sealed envelope. As I was putting it back noticed that he has been spending huge amounts on fancy London hotels and meals out here in our local town, ditto clothes shopping and, surprise, surprise, Tescos (i.e. not Sainsburys). I dont care how he spends his money or where (though am smarting from believing his lines about the supermarket - bill goes back to the second week of July, so she had been here a couple of weeks by then). I do care that he pleads poverty all the time, asks me to cut off sky multiroom (at a whopping £10 a month), says he cant afford to run two houses and was trying to diddle DS on future maintenance (coming in under what the CSA suggests, even though lawyer had suggested that someone in his position on his wages would be the type to offer more than CSA due to social standing etc. Crap). Without any doubt whatsoever, this man has no respect for me of any kind or at any level. I am back to feeling flummoxed that he can treat me in such disregard after 11 years and a child in preference of a relationship of 3-4 months physical standing now. I honest to god hate him at this point (just as I was getting to indifference stage).

Springy - am still in two minds about meeting her tbh. I am pretty pissed that it is now suddenly okay for us to meet as it now fits his agenda. Also, I suspect he will use any such meeting to say either - depending on how any such meeting went (1) look everyone, new girfriend is really nice, even Dee34 has met her and now DS is staying over again. Life is so bloody wonderful and we are all so, so happy or (2) look everyone, new girlfriend is really nice, she was prepared to go along and meet crazy ex Dee34 who got in her face and went over old ground and who is so angry and wont move on. And she did all of that for me and for DS. She is so perfect and life is so bloody wondefuland we are all so, so happy......ultimately, I am wary of doing anything that would seem to give licence to this soap opera they are living. So I dont want to be friends with him ('oh look, he cant be that bad, Dee34 is friends with him again'), dont want to do family things with him ('oh look, he cant be that bad, Dee34 is doing family things with him again') etc etc. Totally agree with the sentiments though if I should meet her. I would like to very calmly ask her a few choice questions. And perhaps throw in some nice titbits about how ex told me that he chose not to confess after they first hooked up as he thought I would never take him back even if he begged, how he wished he had never gone to the US, how he wished he could re-do all of last year, how he thought he was on a 'slow motion car crash', how in April after her visit he told me 'he questions his decision every day'....blah, blah, blah. The pair of them are as screwy as each other and are a perfect match.

Dee Darling

Probably not wildy constructive but I am so with on the finance front. It is so fucking infuriating that men with by most people's perspectives have a large disposable income that suddenly plead poverty as all of their money is tied up with holidays/restaurants/clothes/fun vs paying or even sharing for the basic living standard of their children. I am outraged for my son as I imagine you are. I am working (prob not as much as you) but also renting out part of house, using savings, so totally not 100% reliant on him - far bloody from it - but they remain blissfully bloody ignorant of what it actually costs and how they can just swan in and be Disney dads and leave us to do the hard yards in properly providing and juggling childcare and nurturing and guilt. It is gallling and very very hard not to rise to their frankly risable behaviour (on that front - keep the bloody spa voucher and give it to a family member/friend if it sticks in the gut too much to use it personally but frankly the least he can bloody do even if he meant it as a bribe - take it on face value as 100 quid you aren't getting in the proper fashion).

Have no idea re the meeting OW thing. At this point in time I don't want to meet my OW but then can't imagine my DS spending time with someone I don't know so will be following what you do as you usually are such inspiration darling.

On my front, sadly is my ex's business re house. Currently he has been paying 100% of mortgage but no child support/bills and from nxt month he pays 50% of mortgage and child support which nets out about the same. I get the equity as I put in 100% of the equity and he took assets from shares/tax returns from over here....we went on principle that we each took out the assets we put into marriage and split every thing else 50/50 but sadly the rest was technically 'mine' and as he went crazy lost his job, rented penthouse we have no saving left (pissed off much?)....its not in legal agreement how long he has to pay mortgage for so some time to buy but its an awful market over here so a bit anxious....fingers crossed a buyer will come along soon.

Not holding my breath about dates but figure its all practice and as I am a bit of a stranger in town trying to at least make friends..will let you know...probably hideous but all good war stories right? Off to bed now...am back in stage of waking for 2 hours each night rendered imobile by 'shock' of it all... annoyed its been a year and am still in that place but will all the new revelations guess its to be expected. Anyway, lovely, HUGE love, fuck the in-laws and be strong xxxx

Hi Dolly

Thanks - have calmed down a bit more now! Kept reminding myself how grateful I am to be away from this man now - just need to keep a constant check on my emotions in terms of dealing with him. And also putting things into perspective. For all his moaning about missing DS, he has not taken one day off to be with him (in fact, last time he took time off work to be with DS was back in December and even then of the two Christmas/NY holiday weeks, he only managed one as he obviously scarpered for the second week) - he could even have taken him out of nursery on Weds or today to have a special day with him, but no, too much effort I think. So, back on the detachment train (as it was such a good, lovely place before he kicked off with his stuff yesterday evening).

Re voucher - may give it to a friend. Dont think I could bear to use it myself esp as am pretty sure he will make sure that he has/will tell anyone that will listen of his very kind gesture.

Ah - see what you mean regarding the house (sorry, a bit dim of me, as completely forgot about the whole paying mortgage side of things....). Hope it all comes through in the end for you. Yes, lots of new revelations coming out now, so definately take your time to absorb and then deal with it all.

Date practice sounds like fun! Have had to abandon my night out tonight as have a rotten cough still from yesterday. Hopefully will be able to head out tomorrow.....instead, will spend the night scoffing pizza, drinking a glass or two of vino and watching trashy TV with mum, sis and her partner.

Dx

Hi Darling

Hope you are feeling better (although have to say pizza and trash TV sounds very appealing too!) - and glad you are feeling a little calmer about things. Here you on the holiday front - same here too - DS is most important thing in his life aside from - well himself it would appear.

I am annoyed with myself for being annoyed about this small thing - using here to vent as aware it sounds petty when said outloud and trying not to go on to RL friends too much - but actually quite upset about it. Essentially DS did this obstacle course thing at kindy which was sponsored per obstacle. There is a prize for the child that gets most $$ (money to be used for kindy equipment as a not for profit kindergarten) and so we have money from both grandparents and Aunts and myself and ex. Have been talking to DS about it and he is excited to be handing it in next week. Asked ex to put his $$ in DS's bag on Friday morning when he drops him off at Kindy so we can hand in next week - he emails back sure. Anyway, wasn't in his bag so asked him where it was and he said he handed it straight into the kindy instead. Now when I first asked him for sponsorship he offered $50 which I said great but if you have that kind of money couldn't you pay for some new shoes he needs - he said no and I left it as assumed he wanted to be Mr Generous. Anyway, have to assume that he somehow thought I would 'steal' the charity money so gave it to them rather than for me to hand in. In the whole of this he is the one that has been dishonest, taken passports, hidden money - I have played exactly by the book so both hugely offended that he would consider that I would steal fucking charity money for god's sake and also that he has denied DS the opportunity to hand in his money proudly all together like we have been talking about (to be fair DS won't know as he can't count it but honestly)...sorry if this sounds petty but on top of everything else that has happened in the last week or so it is just one more example of fuckwittery. Why I am surprised I don't know. Anyway, off my chest - sorry very boring and small point but hopefully will stop me boring anyone in RL with the story!!

Lots of love
Sue xx

ooh now you know I am a Suedolly!!

You are still expecting too much and for him to step up to your standards. Because you would walk over broken glass for your son and skip meals to ensure he is well fed you expect the same from your ex.

Never going to happen. In his little world he and his dick are more important than you or your child. He has happily proved that again and again already by swanning off when he feels like it and not putting the routine with your child first amongst other things!!!

Same with his parents. Where do you think he learned his entitled too behaviour from? You and by connection your DS are unimportant to them. The only time he will be important is when they want to show what amazing grand parents there are or to get one over on you somehow.

Expect nothing better from them. Plan for the nasty, manipulation and abuse from all these people and then, even though you may still be stunned that people can be such shits it will not be such a hurtful surprise.

What was your relationship like at the start? Was it all fancy gestures, the amazing love story, fated etc? Do you see a repeat pattern? Think about it. Think carefully where and when the changes in your relationship started. Him taking you for granted, expecting you to be willing to treat him as your god, then the domestic slavery and putting him and his career as number one and finally the it was crap for years, excuses, lies and cheating. Even though you are/should not be interested watch him do the same.

Unfortunately giving up her life and moving over here OW has to accept much more shit because it was fated, they couldn't help it, they were meant to be. She will have to stay put for a lot longer and accept more crap or be seen as a stupid cheating twat.

Stay strong with the ignoring of texts, you are doing really well. Ignore conversations about money or anything. A non committal 'I will think about it' and get off the phone/away from him.

/hugs

I don't think that's a small thing Dolly. It's not small at all. I also had similar things happening with ex. re he would never ever give me money but arranged a complicated procedure where, if I saw something in the shop that kids needed, I had to put it on hold so he could go in and pay for it at a later date (and as he lived in London it could be some time before he picked it up); or I had to get them to call him so he could pay over the phone. He asserted that it was because I was 'after all his money and couldn't be trusted with money' (that last one was pretty rich, coming from him!!!).

He also took dd's money that she had saved for her ski trip spending money - it took her 10 months to save it (paper rounds, sat job) and she was so headfucked when he took it she was literally wretching. He asked her where it was, to show it to him, and he just took it. The reason he took it is because I said I would match what she saved £ for £ and he didn't like me having any financial control, even as tiny as that.

It does your head in really. But please Dolly, don't think what he did is 'small' It's huge

Springdaffs that's appalling. What a cunt. Same to Dee and Dolly. Why do they have to do it, yes I know its about control but they want a new life and you all the play your part in their script

There's plenty more where that came from helen. But he's a dead cunt. Thank the Lord God in Heaven and all the heavenly angels

Here's what I dearly want for you girls (can i call you girls, Dee and Dolly et al? ok then, women) is for the spell to break, like a cold shower and you to wake up and realise HE IS A CUNT. He's giving you the run around, he's not human, he's dragging you left and right and, as with the above cunt, there will be plenty more where that came from: it will go on and on and on, never changing, each new incident shocking the pants of you, fucking your head up because you simply can.not. get your head around what they do, how far they push it. that it's bottomless and endless.

You know my mantra:

G.E.T. A.W.A.Y. F.R.O.M. H.I.M.

How do you get really get away when you have kids with them though springy? Or worse still, not let it affect the relationship you have with your kids? My stbxh has acted in ways I never would have expected from him. Truly, the egocentricity and inability to feel anything approaching empathy or shame or remorse borders on the psychopathic. My eldest ds looks so like him and I find myself thinking 'who ARE you?' because I clearly don't know his father at all.

I feel for you all, I really do. I know exactly where you are coming from. You've been dumped as Leading Lady but are expected nevertheless to carry on as a bit part player in the hareem with a smile on your face. It's insanity.

And also how did you kill him?!

We need a separate section on MSN where we can all arrange to bump off each others exs and to provide alibis.

MN not MSN lol

It's hard to get away from them when you have kids. HOwever, I would go so far as to say that if the kids are little, you don't promote contact and you gradually ease your way off the scene. Kids need a father like this like a hole in the head. They can make their own choice at 18 (when they are adult after a stable childhood, free of the endless bombs these fuckers set off, which are designed to cause maximum damage).

I was part of a thread on here where a woman's ex had done time for trying to kill her and she was trying to facilitate co-parenting (if you please) with him. To a one, posters strongly suggested she needed to get away from him. I would say the same about psychological/emotional/financial (aka psychopathic) abusers. Just because there are no bruises doesn't mean the damage isn't immense. re my daughter practically vomitting because of what he did to her. As I said, there were plenty more where that came from and I had my work cut out trying to deflect from my kids his worse excesses - couldn't save dd from that one in time . I paid her share but the whole thrust of it was gone, it couldn't replace all she had worked for and towards. Plus she had to get her head around what her dad had done to her to get at her mum... DON'T UNDERESTIMATE THE DAMAGE THIS CAUSES . YOur ex's will use your kids to hurt you - please get that!

Nah, I didn't kill him- apart from anything if I killed him I'd have to go to prison and where would my kids have been then? I'm not being as flippant as I appear, and I am being as serious as I appear. I certainly ran through every torture scenario in my head and wished he was dead a zillion times. Not to be actually dead, iyswim, but so that he would fucking well leave me/us alone.

btw Dee and Dolly et al - please don't think your ex isn't as bad as mine! Please! I just had his headfuck games for years and years (as you will if you don't get out of his orbit) and what I have to say is condensed info/advice.

copious posting again today

I am having the most awful trouble with my kids because I allowed them to stay in his orbit. My kids are grown, heads fucked right up because of what they saw/what we went through. I so wish I had my time again and I got them/us away from him and dealt with the fallout from them at the time, instead of now after years and years of his poison (which trails on even after his death - at least he's now no longer able to add to the pile). I wouldn't wish this on anybody . For the love of God, get your kids away from him.

ultra quick post - ex has bought DS back 30mins early. He sent a text 'DS now ready to be home with you....bringing him now'. I didn't get the message as phone upstairs charging. but, cheeky so and so - didn't even ask if I was okay for DS to come home early (as in, I may have been busy/had plans for that last 30mins) and this is the same person who was bringing up overnights 2 days ago...he was very very keen to shoot off and I was left with a very very subdued DS who did not want to say bye to daddy and practically elbowed him away as he tried to cuddle him goodbye (not been like that for ages and this morning on pick-up, DS practically ran to the door to give him a hug). Wont read too much into it, but am a bit peed off!

*sorry to post and run!

cheeky so and so? no, cunt, Dee. Get it into your head and stop being so nice. You may hate the word but I think you know what I mean. It is not passively bad behaviour, it is actively toxic behaviour.

Agree with Springy

Dee, I know it's been mentioned before, but could you change your mobile phone? Obviously don't tell your ex, and keep this one for when your DS is with him? Then you only have to turn it on when he has DS and you are free from the constant texting.

Also, with the post, maybe send an email saying: 'Any reasonable person who has truly moved on would have had his post re-directed by now, don't you think? I don't have the time to be still organising things like that for you. Really, you need to move on and let the people who write to you know that too.'

Probably a rubbish suggestion, so feel free to ignore.

Sending you hugs because you're doing so well.

X

Just wondering how everyones doing today. How's the NC going Dee? I'll have to scroll back to the post but cant remember what you agreed with the ex re texts etc. I'd be minded to send him a weekly reminder setting out the agreement again and how many texts etc he has nevertheless sent on each day.

Any repercussions from your email Dolly? I'm still composing mine in my head. One day I might get it down on paper.