Is it possible to have affair but stay happily married/attached? Pls be honest.

[MabelMay]

Hello All

I really need your honesty and experiences/opinions.
Without going into too much detail as I do wish to remain as anonymous as possible obviously, I have recently found myself falling for someone other than my DP. We have had our problems in the past, DP and I, but we have two lovely little kids together and I've never really been distracted by another man since being with him (8 years). Until now. Recently, after some months of feeling unbelievably attracted to this person, I've found out he feels exactly the same. I feel like I'm on the precipice of something. I have such strong feelings for this guy and have not felt this happy in years. I really want it to happen and yet I know you'll all think me stupid/selfish/naive/etc. But please tell me: Have any of you ever managed to have a brief fling/affair without it destroying your other relationship? Or know of anyone who has? Is it crazy to even think this can happen? I say brief because he is leaving the country for good at the end of the year... am I mad?

In answer to the OP........NO.

WWIFN it is a myth, in your opinion.

I feel it's more dangerous to assume you are still happily married while having an affair. That helps to justify the deceipt, withdrawing from your spouse, focussing your attention on the other person instead of your spouse. How are those the actions of someone who is happy?

They may not be unhappy with their spouse, but something is wrong. Either they are selfish, or thinking and acting selfishly, or they are not as happy as they kid themselves to be.

TLD Of course something is wrong! But in the cases I've cited, that "something" is to do with the person having the affair, not their spouse or the marriage. You are quite right, it indicates extreme selfishness and in the process of recovery from this, the selfish party needs to do a lot of work on themselves.

In some cases, I think you're right and it takes an affair to bring home to someone that actually they weren't as happy as they thought they were - but so often, this is not the case at all. The problem was not unhappiness, but rather character flaws in the unfaithful partner and a feeling of entitlement to an adventure. In such cases, all the work on affair-proofing the future marriage and trying to make it invulnerable to affairs will come to nought, unless the unfaithful party does some very painful and necessary work on him/herself.

There have been some quite melodramatic responses on here which I think verge on hysteria. Whenever the subject of any kind of departure from a monogamous ideal comes up there is a hard core who come on all guns blazing. Fair enough, but there are always two sides to every story. I think some of the attitudes displayed here do verge towards a kind of mediaeval mentality which is completely at odds with what is actually happening in contemporary society.

I am not intellectualising - I am simply pointing out that it is not particularly helpful to adopt such an over-emotive response every time someone find themself in a marriage crisis of this nature.

These things happen. Get over it. The monogamy fundamentalists on here are not going to rewrite contemporary society how ever much they want to.

In other words, the judgemental responses to people who find themselves in these types of situation are just unrealistic and unhelpful.

And please - personal attack is such a crude blunt instrument. Why is it such a problem to some of you when someone challenges your rigid ways of thinking to the degree that the only way you can respond is by personal attack?

Open up your minds to a different possibility. People are unfaithful, or dream of being unfaithful, not because they are horrible, unkind people who want to inflict pain and suffering but because they are HUMAN. They are not spending every waking hour necessarily wanting to accomodate the needs of their partners and sometimes the current relationships are flawed and there needs to be a wakeup call. My partner is faitful to me ( I think!!) because he choses to be and because he wants to be. If he strayed I would assume that there was something wrong or missing in our relationship and I would want to address those problems and work something out.

Anyfucker - please I am sure you are an intelligent woman, reserve your personal insults for some other place.

I think calling Akhems' words "absurd" is pretty personal Fab, as is describing people with a different view to your own as "melodramatic, medieaval, monogamist fundamentalists".

And it's a common assumption that if your partner strays, there must have been something wrong in the relationship - what many of us are saying, including a brave woman who has been unfaithful - is that this isn't always the case. So if it happens to you - and telling people for whom it has, to "get over it" is pretty insensitive by the way - then you would be wise to consider other possibilities. That it wasn't your relationship that was lacking, but your partner.

I didn't attack you personally, FabAtForty

I drew attention to your post, that is not the same thing

I think your judgmental words are much more damning, actually and guilty of generalisation about "fundamentalists", is to me , personally, a rather offensive way to describe someone

as is "absurd", but I don't need to defend akhems as she has done that with dignity herself

goodness, Fab, you really need to look at whose posts could be described as "melodramatic"

FabatForty said:
"One of the reasons you have a big crush on someone else is probably because your partner is actually not making you feel that great."

I absolutely agree with this. I had counselling after my affair in an effort to 'sort myself out' and get to the bottom of why I cheated on DH, and a lot of issues about my lack of self-esteem came to the surface. In my case these issues were to do with things that happened way back, and nothing to do with my relationship with DH, but in your case I think DP telling you that you don't make him feel good every six months or so, is bound to be having an effect on your self-worth. (Personally I'd be inclined to tell him to fuck right off, but I know that sentiment is not helpful to you right now.)

FabatForty also said
"People have crushes all the time, it is entirely normal. Do not take to much notice of the melodramatic "you will ruin your whole life if you even think about another man" brigade who no doubt would like to see you in a ducking stool with a banner around your head stating "adulteress"."

Well my arse is placed firmly in the ducking stool and my response to this is yes, you have had posters who strongly believe in monogamous relationships and who therefore do think you will 'ruin your whole life...etc' But you have also had posts from OW like me who fucking KNOW that to have an affair whilst you are still in a relationship with DP will cause you untold pain and heartache. Particularly in the situation you are now in, with a DP who is chipping away at your self-esteen with HIS selfishness.

I'm not coming at this from a moral standpoint, but from wanting to save you from the hurt and misery that that 'bit of fun'has caused me and many other OW.

funnily enough, so am I, ILMT

I am worried that the discussion might be drifting away from the real issue which, for me, is that OPs DP (as described in her posts) is being a twat.

So as an OW what I probably want to say is:

Two twats don't make a Mr Right

To answer the question posed in the thread title, I suppose it depends entirely on what each spouse wants in a marriage- if what a woman is looking for is a good financial provider, a caring father and a good friend then I suppose a bit of infidelity on his part can be tolerated. So, yes, it IS possible to be happily married and NOT have sexual faithfulness.
To be honest, this idea of romantic love being all-consuming in a marriage is a newish thing.

BUT, let's face it, the OP is not the type of person who sees marriage as a kind of business deal- she, like most people these days, sees it as primarily as a love affair so to OP I say this: No, I don't think YOUR relationship will survive infidelity.

If you both agree it at the start then yes otherwise it causes havoc for most people

Watch Brief Encounter!

Seriously, it is possible to love two different people in completely different ways. It is only our monogamous cultural mores that condemn such relationships.

However, if this man is leaving the country soon would you want to go with him? Or is the fact that he is going to leave adding an extra dimension to your feelings? Namely, he's never coming back, it's now or never, unlikely anyone will ever find out, this could be your last chance, etc etc.

noddyholder I agree it causes havoc for most people and I think it will cause havoc for OP.

But there ARE people who don't mind infidelity as long as their other requirements are being met. Each to their own. It doesn't have to mean the ruination of a relationship.
But, I honestly think it would mean the ruination for the OP's relationship.
That's fair comment I think.

fruitloafrocks - thanks for sharing. that's given me food for thought.

ilovemyteddy - really do appreciate and believe that your posts are coming from a considerate, concerned place and so thank you. I've absolutely taken what you've said on board.

I also appreciate fabatforty's standpoint. And - before you say anything - this is absolutely NOT because it suits my current situation for me to share her views.
I've just come to see from friends' and other people's relationships, affairs, indiscretions, struggles etc. that the idea of a long-term relationship over decades where both partners stay happily faithful to each other is - well, it maybe suits a few. But for the majority of people it's almost impossible to sustain (over decades). Why is that? Because they are all bad, selfish or miserable? I don't think so.

I'm really rushing this post as I have to dash so I've probably not put this across very well. hope it reads ok. MM.

Gosh - when I started writing that there were about ten less posts on the the thread!

Breton you have quite possibly hit the nail on the head as regards the OM. It is partly because I know he is leaving for good at the end of the year that I feel like I could be missing the only chance i have to be with him, to see what it would be like... In a weird way, it feels safer - because I know it can't turn into anything long-term. Maybe that sounds painfully naive but that is definitely a part of what I'm feeling.

ilovemyteddy you're right - there are two issues here. To stray or not to stray. And how much of a problem is my relationship with my DP/my DP's behaviour towards me.

Wish I could stay and chat now but really HAVE to go.

noddyholder - when you say "if you both agree" do you mean, if me and OM both agree the terms of the affair? or if me and DP both agree i can go off and have one..???

Well, only noddyholder can answer your question, but I'm gonna be bold and guess that she means you and your DP agreeing.

OP, I honestly don't think that your OP will agree to it. I obviously don't know him, but I base this answer on what I know about people and I don't think the vast majority of men/women in this country are happy about extra-marital relationships.
It's just not something that fits well with the British mindset.
Yeah, there are a minority who don't mind, but what's the chances of you and your dp being in that minority?
Think to go ahead with this fling will spell bad news for you.

Look, I think that's what we're - or certainly I am - saying. Monogamy can be challenging in long relationships, it's perfectly normal to wonder "what if?". Unfaithful people are not inherently bad and affairs happen in good relationships. But affairs are selfish if someone else is being deceived in the process. And the person having the affair is being very selfish, because they are denying the faithful partner their choices and de facto, putting their own choice above another's right to make one.

So if you're someone who thinks it's pretty impossible to achieve monogamy in a long relationship, that's perfectly acceptable, as long as you tell your partner that's the deal.

For all we know, your DP might feel the same way as you, that long-term monogamy is unrealistic? But it's better that he knows you feel this way, because currently, his choices going forward might be framed around a belief that you feel differently.

Another way to look at this too, is that if your DP feels like you do, you could be turning down an opportunity with the OM that your DP wouldn't turn down, if the situation were reversed. Maybe you and your DP have run your course and you are both better suited to serial monogamy? Or an open relationship? This is all about being honest with eachother and ensuring your expectations are matched.

It all comes down to the same thing in the end. Wanting other relationships can be understandable for all sorts of reasons - but deceiving others can never be acceptable.

Mabel "Breton you have quite possibly hit the nail on the head as regards the OM. It is partly because I know he is leaving for good at the end of the year that I feel like I could be missing the only chance i have to be with him, to see what it would be like... In a weird way, it feels safer - because I know it can't turn into anything long-term. Maybe that sounds painfully naive but that is definitely a part of what I'm feeling."

I knew that my EMA was never going to turn into anything long-term as we were both married with DC, and we both said that we just wanted a 'fling'. And I identify with those feelings where you think that you could be missing out and you want to see what it's like. But are you sure that you are emotionally strong enough to wave him off into the sunset when you've had your fling and, assuming that you don't get caught, that you will be able to cope with the memories and the knowledge that you have betrayed DP and your DC for the rest of your life? I thought I was a very emotionally strong woman at the time. I was wrong.

I mean if you and your husband have agreed this is the sort of relationship you have meaning if either of you have desires to make connections which are sexual with others then it is ok.

I agree that if two people from the onset agree that neither is into sexual monogamy then this does work. Setting rules is important in a relationship, however if one person sets out to decieve and in essence break the rules then it leads to mistrust and breakdown.

A good question was asked of you. Would you be happy if your DP was thinking the same thing regarding an affair with another woman who's about to leave the country in 5 months? After all he'd be careful and secretive and you'd never know.

You have to be absolutely clear before you embark on the affair that having great sex with the added frisson of secrecy (star crossed lovers syndrome), wouldn't impact on your relationship. You have to be certain that this wouldn't make you feel unsettled as it's only going to last for 5 months before the chance of lust dying out. Are you sure you wouldn't continue with 'sex texting' for example?

What is it you will gain from having sex with this person who is going away? What is the likelihood of your dh permitting you this sexual freedom? And will you let him do similar if he feels the need?

Thank you those of you who've defended me.

I don't mind if my views are considered absurd or melodramatic.. 7 months ago I'd have thought the same if I'd read some of my posts from someone else, reading from my smug bubble of a happy relationship.

I'd give almost anything to be able to go back to that innocence.. and I hope those who've never experienced it never ever will.

think you may have outed yourself please delete xx

I'd also take issue with the majority view on here - from all sorts of people - being somehow "out of step" with contemporary society. Mumsnetters don't live in an alternative society and all sorts of people, with a range of life experiences behind them, are saying an affair would be a terrible idea.

Many people have been brave enough to say why they hold this view; what has shaped them. You say Fab that what preserves your own fidelity is your risk aversion, your dislike of drama and others getting embroiled in a personal crisis and because your own relationship is good enough. You presume your partner is faithful, but if he wasn't, you would also presume that your relationship was faulty.

I would imagine that far more than this - and your observations of people in RL - has shaped your views and the anger with which you express them. As ever, I wonder whether you are in fact arguing with yourself about this - and not us.