Archers thread #162: ‘This is like talking to Lassie’ – how right you are, Fallon! Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you think cowhide-covered walls are a great idea for a cafe with vegan and vegetarian customers, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Title comes from one of the better scripted conversations of recent weeks, when Fallon said ”Harrison, this is like talking to Lassie! Just TELL ME”. So true of so many conversations on TA where you just want to shake them and yell 'Just TELL US, and quickly, so you don't get interrupted before you can say the important bit', but of course they rarely do and days pass before the conversation resumes. @TheBell suggested putting it in the title, so thanks for that.

@OverArmour had a great if more obscure idea, paying tribute to a Peter Greenaway film: The Policeman, The Drunk, The Vet and his Lover. That will do very well as a starting point for the new thread. Will Alistair leave? Will Denise tell John she's leaving him? Will Paul learn to be less noisy? Do any of us care?

I do care a little about Harrison and Fallon. I want Harrison to get a grip and realise he needs a paying job more than the captaincy of the cricket team. I don't care at all about Harry but I think he's been brought in purely as a plot device so with any luck we can all forget about him very soon.

Over to you!

Yes I thought that @TheUsualChaos - he seemed super irritable which is not at all how Lyndy's Robert is - in my heart, in any event!

I hadn't even thought about the potential for a horrible tree surgery accident.

Whereas I have thought of little else

Why would anyone think Jennifer a wonderful mother, when they look at her children?
Because the bar in Ambridge is incredibly low?

I think it’s incredibly harsh on mothers for them to be continually responsible for their children’s behaviour as adults. Kids can have the most wonderful mother and still turn into a jerk!

From what I remember of Jennifer as a mother, she was fairly indulgent. I don't think we heard the children being remonstrated. Only Kate seemed to play up and I think she did get a bit of comparison with Debbie.

Kids can have the most wonderful mother and still turn into a jerk!

One of a brood, maybe, but all four? (Or five if you count the failed gigolo, though he’s probably the least obnoxious)

Tbf they’re soap children, they didn’t stand a chance!

I think Brian bears some of it too.

Christopher is OK: one plus to Susan and Neil, which they lose for Emma.

Um...

A wonderful mother would be one who either had wonderful children as a result of her parenting (I have known a few of those), or who made a spectacularly good job of looking after a child or chidren with specials needs, I feel. The word "wonderful" is a superlative, not just relating to so-so or good enough like the vast majority of us!

And yes, I do think that parents are at least to a degree responsible if their children grow up to be self-centred shits who have never been deprived of their least little whim by their indulgent parents. (Men with this problem turn up all the time in AIBU, and a usual opinion is "you don't just have a MiL problem, you have a DH problem".) Someone who doesn't know the meaning of "no" has little chance of not thinking they are entitled to have whatever they want and too bad if anyone else gets hurt in the process.

In Jennifer's case, she is the common factor in all five of the children she brought up; Brian has also been stupidly indulgent, but he didn't get to Adam and Debbie until they were in one case nine and in the other case six, when he proceeded to try to buy their affection. However, just because he got it wrong that doesn't mean that Jennifer didn't also get it wrong!

I don't find any of the Aldridge children obnoxious. Their behaviours maybe but not them.

I think Hannah and Chris will become an item, but will probably lead ro the Chrysalis getting back together. There is plenty of mileage to be had from token-Aldridge Chris and Archer-Aldridge Alice first. Wouldn't be surprised if Martha will get a little half-Burns half-sibling along the way,

There aren't that many mothers to compare:

Jill
Ruth
Pip
Elizabeth
Shula - both mother and child largely silent
Peggy
Lilian
Leonie - largely silent
Jennifer
Kate - when it suits her
Alice
Pat
Helen
Natasha - too early to tell other than the photo shoot
Clarrie
Susan
Emma
Tracey

I just fine there’s far too much judging of mothers in society.

It’s so easy when you can always blame the mother

@Bruisername , but historically mothers did most of the child-rearing. Nurture vs nature, 'monkey see, monkey do', fruit never falls far from the tree etc.

I don't find any of the Aldridge children obnoxious. Their behaviours maybe but not them.

That’s a distinction without a difference to my mind, and since these are fictional characters without feelings to be hurtI don’t see any point in or need to use the mealier-mouthed version. If it were a naughty child/a child doing naughty things, I suppose a case could be made for doing so. Maybe.

What like your father/step father having a love child and your mother raising him?

They have two parents, you know.

Miranda and Brian just don’t sound right together. Don’t know what it is but I can’t bear her voice either.

very bad form of Brian to gossip about Justin with her.

so Justin needed multiple bailings out - sorry but this is all sounding like even more bullshit.

i I wouldn’t have guessed it was Robert tbh. Character didn’t seem quite right. Also find it odd Lynda doesn’t seem to realise he’s not a fan of painting. They’ve known each other long enough.

the bartleby SL is going to be fun 🙄

Has Brian become a virgin?

I wouldn’t have guessed it was Robert tbh. Character didn’t seem quite right.

Agreed, @Bruisername. With his global anxiety he seems more like Jakob.

Bruisername
so Justin needed multiple bailings out - sorry but this is all sounding like even more bullshit

Not entirely; he did I think tell either Peggy or Lilian, quite early on in his relationship with Lilian, that he had been wiped out on Black Tuesday and had to start again from scratch. I think he might easily have lied about the means he used to get back on his feet: marrying money rather than canny dealings might explain why he always seems to be such a lousy businessman, so easily thwarted by (eg) Martyn Gibson, who was able unopposed to oust him from his position in charge of Berrow Farm. And why he is content to be a large frog in the very small pond that is Ambridge, rather than being out in the larger pond of London.

Was it Justin who approved so much of Ruairi's sugar-mummy get rich scheme, implying he'd done similar? Or is Ambridge awash with opportunistic impecunious shaggers?

The way they have drawn Justin over the years is so inconsistent though. And it feels like they are rewriting miranda

or perhaps they’re not and she’s just playing Brian

Yes, I think that was Justin, who came across them at breakfast in the hotel at some Do or other.

oooh, maybe Miranda and Justin are playing a VERY long game....

That would be most entertaining, though they'd have to get up very early in the morning to pull one over on Brian.
Now I think of it, Brian and Justin have been brought in on business advice SLs, maybe the SWs. are teeing us up for suchlike shenanigans, reminding us they're still in the game.