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Was the House Doctor right all along?

170 replies

Kirstiesshirtdress · 29/09/2021 21:21

Name changed for this.

I’m selling a house that has been rented to tenants for ten years.

It’s a fixer upper. The estate agent has been told to market it as a fixer upper, to people who want a project. The EA put it on for an unrealistic price this summer, claiming that there was “plenty of interest at that price”. It’s a 3 bed Victorian terrace in a nice village in West Yorkshire. I made him drop the price a couple of weeks ago, by £30k, despite his protests that he was “confident of selling the house this year”. The low number of viewings, and the feedback, suggested otherwise. It’s still not shifting, even at the lower price.

It’s not a wreck, but it’s tired. Of course it is: it’s been tenanted for ten years, that’s why we’re selling it as a fixer upper. It’s on for £45k less than the top price that houses on the same terrace have sold for this year. It’s on at offers over £220k. Done up identical houses on the same terrace have sold for £265k.

My question is this: do buyers really want a true fixer upper, or do they expect to buy a house described as a fixer upper and only have to spend £500 on it to make it perfect?

Our experience suggests the latter, and that the House Doctor (Anne Maurice…yes, I am old enough to remember her) was right all along. In other words, forget showing a house that needs a bit of work, because buyers can’t be arsed and you’re going to have to do it yourself so that buyers can “imagine themselves in the house” blah blah.

That’s an outcome I was kind of dreading because I’ve got no time for supervising effing house renovations. I don’t need to sell, just can’t be bothered with being a landlord any more. I’m flexible on price, hence the £30k reduction, but I don’t want to sell for a derisory amount, less than what I paid for it in 2006.

The feedback since the price drop is that, despite more viewers and the house being explicitly described on Rightmove as ‘in need of modernisation’, the viewers are all carping about “having to do too much work”, and that they wouldn’t make an offer at all, even below the reduced asking price!

The house has a damp cellar, like all of the houses on the same terrace. It needs redecorating and recarpeting. The kitchen is original (as in Victorian cupboards, not avant garde). The bathroom is early nineties, and is quite tired. I can’t see the value in redoing a kitchen and bathroom just to sell the house, because surely buyers would want to fit their own, to their own taste?

What do you think? Is it worth doing up a fixer upper yourself to shift the bloody thing, or persevering in the hope that a buyer comes along who understands what the phrase ‘fixer upper’ means, and is prepared to do the work in exchange for a good price?

OP posts:
cittigirl · 30/09/2021 09:51

@BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand

I'd paint the coloured walls in a pale neutral, put some furniture and flowers in to stage it, do new photos and leave it at that. It's a decent house, in a decent area. Yes, the bathroom needs doing, but it's not a wreck.

New photos of the garden would also help, as well as staging the interior.

This
WorriedWishingWell · 30/09/2021 10:03

@Kirstiesshirtdress

Thanks.

Photo 13 is the dedicated parking space off the private road at the front. It’s in front of the gate leading to the garden, and there is also on-street parking on the private road (view from photo 12).

I thought it was funny that the EA details made no mention of it. Or the woodburner.

The washing machine usually lives in the cellar, in the curtained off bit under the boiler.

Photos 14 and 15 are the back of the house, which is on the non-private road.

Your house looks much nicer than I was expecting from your description, and definitely liveable in while work is done to it. The only thing that might give me a negative feeling if I was viewing it would be the loo in the cellar. It would conjure up images of people being trapped down there, not a good vibe Grin
Rainbowshit · 30/09/2021 10:26

Oh I love all the original features!

Honestly I think you are doing it down by selling as a doer upper. I'd redecorate and stage for sale. I wouldn't be going as far as new bathroom and kitchen. The bathroom is fine and the kitchen has some lovely original features.

SciFiScream · 30/09/2021 10:32

Crikey! To me that looks in move in condition. You could live there quite easily as is.

Clean it. Clean it within an inch if it's life. Put it on at a fixed price (do you do that in England?)

Stage it and sell.

Honestly I think it just needs a bloody good clean and staging.

Kirstiesshirtdress · 30/09/2021 10:32

The only thing that might give me a negative feeling if I was viewing it would be the loo in the cellar. It would conjure up images of people being trapped down there, not a good vibe

A bit Josef Fritzl, eh?

OP posts:
Kirstiesshirtdress · 30/09/2021 10:34

Joking aside, thanks so much to everyone who has contributed, for all the good advice.

OP posts:
Gastonia · 30/09/2021 10:43

Clean it. Clean it within an inch if it's life.
This is so true. Years ago, DH rented out his house while he lived abroad. When he came to sell it, everyone who viewed it said it was really dated. It also had a hideous and grubby artex wall. We went back, and spent a day cleaning, including washing the feature wall. Cleaning it just totally changed the ambience. It seemed cared for again, and it sold immediately.

Agree with all the other comments too.

crossstitchingnana · 30/09/2021 10:44

I have bought a property that was quickly spruced up by the vendor. Been here over ten years now and it's apparent that it was all done on the cheap.

Whatamesssss · 30/09/2021 10:50

Tart up the cellar, style it as a utility/toilet. I like the original tile. Just clean it and get a photo of the toilet down there. I thought it only had 1 toilet at the top of the house.

Looks like a lovely house, just needs a little tlc and I think you could sell it for your original price or maybe a little less.

aLittleL1fe · 30/09/2021 10:56

I would expect a fixer-upper of this size in this area to be between 140 and 190K. Definitely, definitely under 200K.

This is not really a fixer upper though. You need to make everything look tidy and cosy and expect viewers to come to a conclusion that they need to replace the bathroom which is ok/clean/functional but dated, and that nothing else needs doing.

Alternatively, if you stick to the fixer upper idea, then you can do nothing but you need to drop the price.

monotonousmum · 30/09/2021 10:58

We've bought a fixer upper (structurally sound but needs new windows/doors/bathroom/kitchen/rewire/decoration etc). Also needs a lot of work in the garden.
It's not unrealistic that people want to buy a property like this, but they want it for cheaper. £45k is not really enough to do all of these things, plus the hassle of doing it yourself.
Add up how much it would cost to make it look like the most expensive house on the street (of the same size) and put the price somewhere around that mark.
Judging my other prices around here (hard to tell as the houses are all different) I think we can add £100k to ours once finished, but it's going to take us £70k and a fair few years to get there.

AGreenerShadeofKale · 30/09/2021 11:01

Going back to the House Doctor, her message was to allow the viewer to imagine themselves living in the house. Because most of us can't see beyond superficialities. On those terms it doesn't have to be perfect (and I hate to see a swanky new bathroom or kitchen that I didn't get to choose!) but it should feel "liveable".

monotonousmum · 30/09/2021 11:05

Also, you may be right with it being an estate agent issue. To sell our flat we went with a lovely local agent, middle value (compared to the other agents) but they were totally shocking. She was unresponsive, the ad was rubbish, ended up taking £25k under asking price.
Should have just gone with Foxtons. I didn't like them but sometimes they're what you need.

Melroses · 30/09/2021 11:19

Paint out the bright colours and the panelling and wardrobes with warm neutrals, new carpets, hedge trimmer, new agent with new photos (not of the wash basin Hmm ).

It will then be comfortable to move straight in and do up in your own time.

Love it 💗

knittingaddict · 30/09/2021 11:29

All of our houses have been ones that needed considerable work. They were habitable, but had kitchens and bathrooms that were at least 20 to 30 years old. They all had bad and scruffy decor, the original windows and ancient worn carpets. All took thousands rather than hundreds of £ to sort out. I don't think we are that unusual in wanting a house in a reasonable area and having to buy a less than perfect home. You just need to price it to reflect the work needed. Many people don't.

ohfook · 30/09/2021 11:31

For me I didn't mind buying a house that needed maybe new carpets and a bit of painting.

I wouldn't buy a house that needed a new kitchen or bathroom or anything else major because I wouldn't be able to afford it. I think years ago there was a smaller house price to income ratio and it was sensible but now the only people I see buy genuine fixer uppers are those that have plenty of spare money. It's not really an option for someone on an average income to get on the property ladder anymore.

knittingaddict · 30/09/2021 11:37

I've just seen the link to your house op. I like it and wouldn't hesitate to buy it, although don't know if that's a fair price or not for the area. I can imagine how a house might look once I've finished with it and many don't seem to be able to do that. I think it needs a paint job in some of the rooms to make it more attractive in the photos, but I wouldn't do any more than that.

longtompot · 30/09/2021 12:03

This one sold last July for the price you are asking for yours now. It's in a bit more of a move in condition.

www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/detailMatching.html?prop=85961369&sale=91340991&country=england

I love your house, wouldn't work for me sadly as I have two dds with mobility issues, but I love the character.
I don't feel the estate agents photos are doing the place justice.

Maybe replacing the carpet in photo 6 and 9, and doing something with the doors as it makes the rooms look dull with the red wall and the wallpaper.

Is there mould in the shower seals? I can't tell from the pictures but it looks as if there is so maybe a deep clean of the bathroom.

Have the photos redone, especially of the kitchen with the cupboard doors shut.

The garden does look very narrow. It doesn't look as if there would be space to walk past the two seater seat if it was put across. I have the hedge trimmed back quite hard. Should be safe to do now with nesting season over.

I do think some people find it hard to see how furniture fits into a place when it's unfurnished which might not be helping.

Kirstiesshirtdress · 30/09/2021 12:42

Somebody upthread linked to the same sold house on the same terrace. They sold their ‘big’ (as in, long and thin) garden on the other side of the private road to a neighbour, which devalued the house, plus prices have risen since summer 2020. So if they had sold a year later, it would have gone for more.

OP posts:
JellyfishandShells · 30/09/2021 13:40

You’ve explained in the thread about which external photos are on the private vs non- private road. The photos themselves aren’t good and, as it is a non standard ie not obvious arrangement of garden and parking it would be helpful if the ( new!) estate agent included a diagram or better description of the arrangement. Those very local would be familiar with it but it cuts down a wider appeal.

aLittleL1fe · 30/09/2021 13:54

The difficulty of selling fixer upper is that the pool of interested buyers is quite limited. You either drop the price to a point where a developer could turn a profit after doing it up, or if the price isn't low enough for that, then there aren't many people with loads of spare cash and time to be wanting a project - particularly in today's uncertain conditions with regards to tradesmen and materials. It will absolutely appeal to some people, just not many. So given that your house isn't a genuine fixer upper I wonder if that's a good marketing strategy - probably not.

PointyMcguire · 30/09/2021 14:00

I haven’t RTFT so apologies if I’m repeating others but I wonder if it’s less about people not understanding what a fixer upper is and more that those that do (unless they have the wherewithal to fix it up themselves) are less inclined to buy right now due to the lengthy delays of tradesmen and rocketing costs of supplies.

We moved into our dream home at the end of last year and have a sizeable chunk in savings for renovations, but we’ve simply not been able to find anyone to take on the job as they’re all booked up almost a year in advance right now. Fortunately all the changes we wanted to make were “nice to haves” rather than anything essential so we’re happy to sit it out until things are calmer, but I wouldn’t be quite so relaxed to wait for essential stuff to be done.

sasparilla1 · 30/09/2021 14:19

That's a really lovely house!

I do think people are being more cautious at the moment, we're house hunting and I know that we are. But you would have your hand bitten off down here in Hampshire! I couldn't even get a viewing on a real doer upper recently - the agent had booked 27 and they weren't taking any more.

As PointyMcguire says, there are real issues with getting tradesmen in. My dh is a roofer and son is a plasterer - they're both booked up for months, and I'd be very suspicious of anyone who isn't at the moment. There also the issue with not only the increased cost of materials but also the availability.

Maybe you need to clean and paint white to show that it's liveable in, and that everything wouldn't need doing immediately.

justasking111 · 30/09/2021 15:44

Honestly your house is not a doer upper, this was though. www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/detailMatching.html?prop=48932591&sale=52501965&country=england

wiltonism · 30/09/2021 15:51

The photographs are appalling. This makes a huge difference. My vote is very much for paint it and get a new estate agent.

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