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Primary education

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Original poster

'we said thanks to God today mummy!' Really??

332 replies

unexpectediteminbaggingarea · 22/10/2012 17:55

Apparently a 'special lady' came and told my son and his class that God gave them a special gift so they should all say thank you to him. And they did.

Does this kind of shit go on everywhere? It's not a church school. I am an athiest. My son, aged 4, is now apparently not. He says that, thinking about it, he now thinks God is real and the reason you can't see him is because he 'lives in a different country, maybe London'.

I'm actually quite pissed off about it (not the London bit, that was funny), but if it's what happens everywhere or is some kind of statutory thing I suppose I'll have to suck it up. If it's not I may write to the head.

Although I do think more time on geography and less time on God might be better for DS Grin .

OP posts:
ArthurShappey · 22/10/2012 22:26

LaBelle your point 1 is what I am against...

Worship should be removed from school. Not that my DS should be removed because I don't want him to be encouraged to worship. Why should my son be penalised. School is for education and I have no problem with him learning about religions and cultures, school is not for worship and it's time it was stopped.

exoticfruits · 22/10/2012 22:27

but it's perfectly all right for the children of Christian parents not to be exposed to atheism!

I don't understand why they would be bothered-especially since they are exposed all the time-unless they HE is a bubble. There seems to be a huge fear-exposed them to all different views. The one thing for sure is that they will make up their own mind. I have never come across an adult who said 'I think.........because my mother did'!
I can never understand the idea that your DCs have to follow you. In RL DCs of Christians become atheists and DCs of atheists become Christians-why does it matter? I took my DCs to church-they don't believe in God and they don't go-it is their decision-why is this a big deal? Why should it change our relationship? I gave birth-I don't expect, and never did expect, to control what they think. They are free agents.

Himalaya · 22/10/2012 22:29

LBDSM

  1. " they have no choice. " .....And yet all maintained schools don't do collective worship in the same way. Some do it in a traditional way, others focus more on common-values that are "broadly Christian". Most secondary schools ignore it altogether. Clearly there is some choice. School are not like McDonalds Franchises

  2. The OP didn't call the beliefs of others 'shit', she called foisting participation in religious worship on children as a condition of state education shit (yes its the law, but it is a shit law).

Your post was packed with "shut-up" words - if it bothers someone that their child is expected to take part in religious rituals at school this is "censorship", trying to control everything your child learns, being a complainer, getting heated about nothing etc.... It's not. It's just shock at the absolute inappropriateness of it. People should no more have to pray in order to access state education than you should have to in order to get medical treatment or welfare.

exoticfruits · 22/10/2012 22:30

Sorry-written in haste and doesn't make a lot of sense. I was trying to say, why is there a terrific fear? What is wrong in exposing DCs to all views. Why think them so stupid it has to be censored. They will make up their own mind- just make sure they think for themselves-and question everyone, starting with mother.

dikkertjedap · 22/10/2012 22:32

Yes, this is widespread.

Usually in assemblies, could be several times a week plus in many schools they have to pray before lunch unless their parents have notified the school that they don't want that (then they are set apart in all likelihood).

Several lessons may also have references to the Bible especially in relation to Christian Holidays. I have come across many teachers who refer to the Bible as a true book, i.e. not a book with stories but a non-fiction book.

ArthurShappey · 22/10/2012 22:32

Yes Himalaya exactly! Well said!

exoticfruits · 22/10/2012 22:34

Some of you make religion sound very exciting! As a child I would certainly find it far more interesting and something to explore if it upset my parents so much!

SuffolkNWhat · 22/10/2012 22:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

GrimmaTheNome · 22/10/2012 22:36

I was trying to say, why is there a terrific fear? What is wrong in exposing DCs to all views.
Nothing. That's what RE is (or at least should be) for. It still tends to miss out non-religious worldviews but its better than kids just learning one thing at home.

But that's very different from the situation whera one view is presented by a person in authority - a teacher or a 'special lady' as fact.

ArthurShappey · 22/10/2012 22:37

I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. I
I have no fear, I am not afraid a teacher is going to turn my son into a Christian fundamentalist. I am not saying my son should not be taught about religion. I am saying for one last and final time, he should not be coerced into worshipping at school. A teacher place is to teach, not to preach.

Catmint · 22/10/2012 22:38

We have a mtg with HT on Wednesday about this.

We value RE, but need better information about how it is taught. From what DD tells us, it is subjective, like your situation sounds, OP.

Last week's nugget was, ' how can we look after the world so we don't make God cross?'

Our situ is a nightmare because the HT has refused to disclose the scheme of work.

Good luck, OP!!!

DillyTante · 22/10/2012 22:38

Yep, same at DD's school. Was told I could remove her but why should I have to. Why aren't they being told about other religions. Why as part of their school day are they going to a Harvest Festival Service and my DD reading out a prayer?

My child can choose to have faith when she is old enough to make an informed choice. She just accepts what the school says as 'gospel truth'. Jesus and God are best pals apparently.

Quite pissed of by it really.

DillyTante · 22/10/2012 22:41

And don't get me started on Operation Christmas child...

exoticfruits · 22/10/2012 22:41

He isn't coerced into worshipping. Generally it is presented as 'Christians believe' and 'if you want to make this a prayer say amen' at the end. You can't force another person to worship-but they do have to respect those who are.
I would agree that collective worship no longer has a place in schools, but it needs an Act of Parliament to change it and generally people do no more than moan on MN. They could actively campaign-join the Secular society for a start.

Catmint · 22/10/2012 22:41

Aw Suffolk, you were so fab! many many Thanks

I got the syllabus from the LEA.

Seeing HT this week.

I had an off the record discussion with a governor - she was horrified & promises to support us if we have to go that far.

We have decided we will go down the FOI route if we have to.

Fed up with it.....:(

exoticfruits · 22/10/2012 22:43

Why aren't they being told about other religions

They are. Look up the RE syllabus on line or pop into school and ask about it. They will learn about them in faith schools too.

wannabedomesticgoddess · 22/10/2012 22:43

There is too much respect of those "who are" and not enough of those "who arent."

Why dont all the christians who actually attend church actively, go to a seperate room to worship?

Why are atheists comtinually patronised and told they are wrong?

Catmint · 22/10/2012 22:44

Nothing is wrong with exposing them to all views. That is not the fear. The fear is of exposing them to one dogma view, in preference to any other.

exoticfruits · 22/10/2012 22:44

You will find that most teachers are not Christians so they are not going to be coercing-they will be following the law.

ArthurShappey · 22/10/2012 22:45

How is 'right children, let's all take moment to give thanks to god' not coercion to worship?!

exoticfruits · 22/10/2012 22:45

Why dont all the christians who actually attend church actively, go to a seperate room to worship?

Because of the Education Acts! You have to get a change in the law first.

exoticfruits · 22/10/2012 22:47

How is 'right children, let's all take moment to give thanks to god' not coercion to worship?!

In all the many schools I have been in and attended assemblies you never get that-except a church school possibly.

wannabedomesticgoddess · 22/10/2012 22:49

They wont get changed though.

Unless another religious group kicks up.

The atheists dont stand a chance.

Woozley · 22/10/2012 22:49

In all the many schools I have been in and attended assemblies you never get that-except a church school possibly

Well, we just had those words said at a Harvest Festival. Which was in the local church. In a non-church school...

Even in the nursery they say a prayer at the end of the day.

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