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Unathorised Absence

177 replies

MrsFruitcake · 01/05/2011 09:55

I know this is a thorny topic on MN and I'm liable to be flamed but I genuinely need some real advice.

I work frontline NHS and have had problems getting time off work during the school summer holidays this year. DH has his own business which isn't doing great and we managed to find a great deal on a holiday to France - basically, it's £600 less to go end of June than 1st week of school hols in July. We foolishly booked it, I filled in a form at DDs school asking permission to take her out for 5 days and thought no more of it.

On Thursday, a letter came home with her stating that as she's had 9 days leave in September 2010 (also for a family holiday), permission would not be granted.

Called travel company and they want £700 extra, which we don't have. We paid £400 for 9 days (4 of which are weekend days). School made no mention of SATs in the letter and attendance was the only thing they got pulled up on at their last 'Outstanding' ofsted report.

My question is - what will likely happen if we take her anyway - the letter makes it clear that this will be unauthorised absence and we could be liable to prosecution.

I think we'll probably have to cancel, and we'll lose the money paid.

Any advice? If you got this far, then thanks.

OP posts:
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SophieJo · 02/05/2011 15:17

AbigailS
Again great post.

StatelyPoshBeartrothal · 02/05/2011 15:27

teacherwith, you mean you show those DVDs to the children who have been off again? While sitting in the corner of the room painting your nails no doubt?
Wink

mrz · 02/05/2011 15:30

We had a similar situation AbigailS
Parent phoned in to say the children were ill. However the children in my class happily said they had gone to Disney Land Paris. A quick check of the phone call showed a French dialling code.

StatelyPoshBeartrothal · 02/05/2011 15:31

What did you do mrz?

mrz · 02/05/2011 15:37

The family were already subject to a penalty notice so they may be taken to court by the LEA.

AbigailS · 02/05/2011 16:17

What amazed me is that the whole family came back with suntans and thought no one would twig!
My school was pretty soft about persuing things like that and the head decided to take no action. But I was quite mean! When mum brought the child back to school I asked how Ibiza was! She went very red and fled! After school she approached me and muttered about the child being taken ill on holiday and that's why they didn't come to school. I smiled and nodded. If it had been a Monday that she first phoned in sick from her mobile I might have bought that they went away for the weekend, but couldn't fly back with an ill child (well maybe I'd have considered it). But she phoned in mid-week.

AbigailS · 02/05/2011 16:22

Oh also, OP, please don't approach the teacher to ask for the worksheets for the time your child will be away so you can do them on holiday.
a) We rarely use worksheets
b) if we do they are pretty useless without the teaching input before them
c) as I make them myself rather than use ones from a book they will be pretty meaningless because I don't give instructions and teaching on them, they are an integral part of the whole lesson.
d) if you are that worried about missingn learning don't go on holiday mid term time.

I agree with a previous poster that teachers bust a gut to help the child catch up, as it's not the child's fault the parents are being PITA. But it can really frustrate me that the parents don't see that they miss out and and that its their right to have me give up playtimes and lunchtimes to help their child catch up when the parents choose to break the rules.

mrz · 02/05/2011 16:29

My LEA pursues all attendance under 92% the school isn't involved

PassTheTwiglets · 02/05/2011 16:58

Teachers at our school never help a child to catch up when they've been away, for whatever reason. I wonder if this is the norm, or whether most teachers do help a child to catch up.

AbigailS · 02/05/2011 17:06

I don't make a big song and dance about it, so I'm sure lots of parents and children don't know I'm plugging holiday / illness absence gaps. Do you know for certain that your school doesn't make sure the child gets a bit of help. I don't do it the week they get back from their holiday - it's often the next time I get to that unit (e.g. money and calculating change, or using speech marks). Some topic areas are easier to catch up with than others. I don't catch up all the topic (e.g. a stand-alone couple of lessons on the story of Helen Keller), but everyone at my current and previous school does for literacy, numeracy and ICT and any topic work that leads into the next area to be taught.

mrz · 02/05/2011 17:09

I think most teachers will try to help children catch up but if the school follows the literacy and numeracy unit plans from the framework some areas are taught for one or two weeks and not revisited until the next school year. so if the child missed symmetry or nets in maths or non chronological reports in English they may not encounter it for a full year

JoanofArgos · 02/05/2011 17:10

Being asked for worksheets, I would imagine, is very annoying. Teaching in HE, little irritates me more than students not showing up and then emailing to say could I please tell them if they've missed anything important so they can do it in their own time. Well no - or rather yes, but it's a bit rude to assume that that's the end of your responsibilities - because the teaching happened in those hours you missed: and if you missed it, you missed it.

swanriver · 02/05/2011 17:33

MrsF, our school is constantly threatening, in the Newsletter, that people who take their children out of school for holidays will lose their place at school. However, I'm sure it is just a game of bluff, I've never know anyone to be removed from the roll. Attendance is game of numbers.

At the age of 7 I don't see what she can't learn when she returns. Perhaps keeping a holiday diary would be proof that you are committed to her education. I think what teachers hate is having to provide work for children who are off on holiday. It is five days. Five days. She isn't going to learn much in that time....but she will remember that holiday for a long timel, perhaps for ever.

All you need to remember is that your child could have been ill for that whole week. And no-one would have claimed she couldn't possibly catch up all she had missed.

I would just go on holiday as you planned, stop feeling guilty, promise never to do it again, and make an extra large contribution to school funds (anonymously) with some of money you saved. And enjoy holiday.

School bureaucracy demands that they make a fuss, don't take it personally.

mrz · 02/05/2011 18:06

swanriver since teachers don't have to provide work for children who are off on holiday that certainly isn't an issue.

PassTheTwiglets · 02/05/2011 18:25

Yes, I do know for certain, AbigailS. I know people who work there and I volunteer in several classes myself.

StatelyPoshBeartrothal · 02/05/2011 20:49

swanriver, why do you think she's not going to learn much in 5 days?
And given she is likely to be sick as much as she would ahve been if she hadn't been away, the OP is still increasing her absence by 5 days overall.

clam · 03/05/2011 10:11

LOL at some parents claiming children will learn more on holiday than in school. The number of times I've had kids tell me they've been away - on holiday/to granny's/whatever and, when I've asked where granny lives, I've been met with blank stare and shrug. "Dunno." Near/far/seaside/countryside? "Dunno."

juuule · 03/05/2011 10:29

clam just because they can't answer your quiz doesn't mean they've not learned anything. Perhaps you just asked the wrong questions.

vintageteacups · 03/05/2011 10:36

Hmm - I ask DS what he's done at school every day and he usually says "urmm - nothing much".

juuule · 03/05/2011 10:38

We've had that one, too. Vintageteacups :o

Sportsmum · 03/05/2011 10:46

What's a holiday?

clam · 03/05/2011 12:17

juule It's not a quiz, it's called taking an interest and having a chat.

thebeansmum · 03/05/2011 13:16

WHY THE HELL should teachers waste valuable time setting out lesson plans in readable form for a kid who's parents think holidays in term time are more important!!! OMG I'm so mad about this!! You make it sound so simple! The time teachers spend planning and delivering lessons are for the good of my DC and the other 28-odd kids who's parents TOW THE LINE with attendance stipulations. I would dearly love to take a couple of weeks off half price and piss off to somewhere cheap and quiet - not gonna happen. It's disrespectful and thoughtless, in most cases.

juuule · 03/05/2011 14:23

clam I know - sorry. I think I was just irritated after Abigails comment "But I was quite mean! When mum brought the child back to school I asked how Ibiza was!" which I felt implied some cat and mouse game of catching people out.

clam · 03/05/2011 15:58

Oh, OK. I was talking about after say, the Easter holidays just now, when we were sharing news about what we'd all been up to.
In Abigail'S situation, if I felt there'd been a bit of 'subterfuge,' I think I'd avoid the subject.