am pregant again after a termination for downs

[busierbee]

I traumatically and sadly had a pregnancy with a downs baby last year. I am 42. I am pregnant again - ten weeks - and consumed with fear and anxiety. Although there is no genetic basis for downs, the risk of having another downs pregnancy is higher than for a woman who has not. Am having a cvs in two weeks. Has anyone been or is anyone in this situation? need a friend

Ilovemydog - you have not been unsupportive at all at all. The opposite. Think posts being crossed here. Sydneysuze - your story so tragic and i so very much hope this baby all well and strong. Am sure will be. It is rare for these things to happen twice.
Dearest Lins -we will get through and the sun will shine - I do keep thinking of your daffs. simple image.

Who is in with you tonight BusierBee? How is the family?

At this point, think most people are above the debate stage.

It's a support thread, as Treedelivery suggests, and not a place for discussing options...

Hope you get the answers you want when you see the consultant...

Thank you ilovemydog - am glad you shared your experience. You know it hard hard and that must have been so painful for you. I hope this thread is supportive for more than just me - i guess if for some it is not, then they would not read it. Do not wish to offend anyone at all - I hope that feels true.Tree- my boys are in bed. I am so worn out with it all, DP on the sofa, me compulsively checking here to make sure all is well and to feel the love where it shines.
BBx

Also - can not remember who asked- but have not told the children. After last time - my daughter found it so troubling - of course. Did not want to unsettle her anymore - she is sixteen and has exams and needs me to be strong - or as strong as can be. Suspect she knows things not perfect. Have told her that have baby issues- that DP and i are having genetic counselling and that is tough. So close to truth but not too harsh. Feels right. Am worn out so not very articulate I feel.

Oh Busierbee I'm so sorry if in leaping to your defense I made everything worse. Not my intention at all, I just got so angry on your behalf. Tree is right that this is your thread and all of us must take our lead from you and keep it how you need it day by day or night by night.

Hope you and your DH can find some restful sleep tonight. Please keep posting how you are doing, sending you huge (((((((hugs))))))

How old are the boys Busier - I think you said you had a teenager? Your poor dp. Men seem to react differently to us, possibly as they do not carry the baby. I've often seen men only truly grasp it when the baby is born. You may have found this with your previous loss.

How are you feeling about your meeting. Do you know the consultant.
So many questions - do feel free to ignore! I'm genuinely interested and also want to give you oppurtunities to talk. But do ignore, it's the beauty of mumsne - it's on your terms. x

Syd - you did not make it worse - it is an honest reaction and feel that i am not permitted to show anger at this kind of thing - and so you released a bit of what every mother who has let a baby go may feel. And am so pleased that you are having another baby - please let me know after your tests. Other people's stories of joy and hope make life seem less dreadful. DP sleeping fine - mostly I have taken comfort in the oblivion of sleep then woken in sobs. But last night was fretting all night- knowing that this week so hard.

Tree -the boys are 11 and 8 - delightful, exhausting and delightfully exhausting. My daughter is 16 - a teenager in all her glory. Re tomorrow - I do not know him - he is the lead consultant at FMU at UCH - performed the CVS - gave terrible news after nuchal. He will not have answers but may be able to offer some kind of idea about my atypical results - blood way too high, nuchal normal etc. Also the way forward. Upsettingly they do not do terminations at UCH- I have had an non blaming rant at midwife today - no continuity of care, responsibility on the couple, all too overwhelming. She agrees and is of course kind. DP very very sad indeed as only chance of baby really - but being strong and broad shouldered for me. Which I love and admire in him. Love him so much at the mo. Have spoken (outloud) to no one. No one but him. We in small bubble of agony.
You must be a super friend to your people who are trying for a baby

You are being a mother -- protecting/shielding others that you love.

Vent here.

Iloveyourname- that is a very touching message. That word mother - it is what we all do. Smiley face to you too. I must give into the waves of exhaustion. Been a tough day.

Sleep well Busierbee - be thinking of you and your DP tomorrow. Hoping the consultant has some answers.

ilove and tree - have just read your profiles - am so touched as you both have young young children. You must be tired all the time -so your support even more appreciated. I am worrying about nanbred so do get in touch my dear. You have all managed to bring me back to mumsnet life when i was ready to run. Thank you so.

On the friend front - not really! More friend of a friend, who at 41 have reached the end of all that can be done. So it's egg donation or adoption. I seem to have very enthusiastic eggs [albeit them very very very very redheaded] so it just seems the obvious thing to do.

That is absolute crap that UCH wont give you the service you need. Will you be about 11 or 12 weeks I guess?

I think most people do not share this with others, for many reasons. The bubble is usually very small. You know you can come here and rant and rave and shout if you want. Thats important.

If you want to talk about the options you have, just to talk about them not as in getting advice [I'm not experienced enough] then I can hear what you want to say.
I mean about how you will...[what do I say]...do what you have decided to do. Perhaps the consultant will talk you through your management choices, because I think you will have a choice of medical or surgical management. I only say this so you know there is somewhere you can talk about these hard hard things- if you think it would help you. Are you able to look to the future and the way forward yet? If so then I admire you, I would struggle to even go to the hospital I feel, let alone enter into any meaningful conversation. You are very brave.

Again, just ignore things that you are not comfortable with.

Well - since we have been here before - I know how it goes and it almost makes it worse. 13 weeks. We will go back to same consultant we had last time. I trust him. On the way to the hospital for all of these tests and procedures - I am silent, withdrawn and I just do each minute, each minute. And I remember my children and focus on tiny things, like middle child's hockey match on Sunday or snuggling on the sofa. Brave? I am the most fearful person I know. Today has been one long panic attack in fact. But bravery means just carrying on. I also know I am lucky to have my children, that they are safe. I have two friends who have lost children. Had them ripped from them and somehow they have carried on. Gives perspective.
BB xxxxxxxx

I know when I have been directly involved with people coming to delivery suite in these situations, I have gone to meet them in the car park. I imagine those journeys in to be like going up everest. And to think of having to get in lifts and follow signs and manage. Too much. Bless you.

It's true you have your children and they are a blessing - but it's ok to feel robbed and insulted and angry at what has befallen you. We all try to count our blessings but there will be moments where we haven't the energy required to control our emotions to that extent.

Will you sleep tonight?

And once you get through tomorrow with the questions questions questions, where can you go if you need further advice?

Is there a consultant/midwife hotline?

If you are anything like me, I forget everything, therefore have a notebook where I have a virtual stream of consciousness thread going and can refer to it as necessary.

Is there an overall leading consultant as far as continuity of care? How can this person be contacted?

If there are any problems, who should you contact?

What is the care plan?

Sorry if I'm stating the obvious, but was recently at Children's Hospital with DS where he was admitted, and it's a similar pattern....

A poem someone sent me. For all of us who have little ones who aren't with us.

Touched by Angels

We are touched by angels
And walk where angels tread.
They will guide us, walk beside us
Through the days ahead.
In the hours of darkness,
When our dreams have flown,
They bring hope and gentle healing,
We are not alone.
In our times of doubting,
Still they understand,
And forever touched by angels,
We walk hand in hand.

Babyblue, keep us posted as to how your morning went.
I have got through my sobbing and am now about to watch Neighbours and eat some soup! xxx

Am Busier Bee! - not babyblue - although like many of us here am baby blue.Dreadful day - man shouted at me on tube - I ran off the train and to Moorgate where i stood sobbing. DP followed me up thank god - as had no idea what to do.
Consultant was tremendous - what a job -and very very supportively bent the rules and can have termination tomo at same hosp. In pieces as was not prepared for tomo. Also he thinks almost impossible to be genetic given the type of downs it is. In his long experience of over 1000 families with downs pregnancies only knows 5 who have had two. Is encouraging us to try again. God. Could I survive a third? Feel better now am cared for by them - feel cared for. Took bloods from us both so can have genetic counselling anyway. My poor poor baby Lins. I know you know. But keep thinking of the scan. Well done for watching Neighbours - need some normal in your life. Up and down. The poem so touching. Have joined arc -will write there soon I think to see if people in similar - of course there will be. Sad sad day. One of many. Big hug to you and yours.
BB xxxxxx

Hello Busierbee

I've been following your story and have been really moved by your tremendous dignity in the face of the worst of experiences.

I've also been following it because we are another 'lightening strikes twice' family, so I am genuinely there with you on how it feels to have a second termination for downs.

Your consultant sounds a star. So important to have understanding people in your corner. I could talk about this at length but sadly, experience makes me feel uneasy doing so. Such a shame, because at times like these, I really think it's the talking that gets us through.

I'll be thinking of you and your DP tomorrow.

Oh Shangrila - how I would love to talk to you. I can understand your hesitation totally - it can open wounds for people on the thread and sometimes things are written that upset the applecart. Have so many questions - am so hurting and tired. Thank you for your honesty and generosity in sharing what must have been too much awfulness. Does the sun shine again?
BBx

Busier (sorry I called you babyblue, she'd just written on my thread!!)
What a day for you. I just don't know what to say. I feel like you are a really good friend, even though we have only posted to each other. And I wish I could phone you up to say in person that I will truly be thinking of you tomorrow. I will be wishing for you that it all goes smoothly medically, and that you are treated as gently and kindly as I was when I had Daisy.
I think that it is very encouraging news that there probably isn't a genetic problem, although it can make it harder to bear as there is nothing to blame it on. I found I kept looking for reasons, and answers, and there just weren't any. You will have to wait a little and see if the maternal urge is just so great that you are willing to try again despite feeling so terrified. The voice of reason tells me 'it can't possibly happen THREE times!' but if/when I get pregnant again, I will not relax until I hold a healthy happy baby wriggling in my arms.
ARC is a great comfort and support to me, and everyone there so totally understands the pain and the grief of all this.
A good friend recommended to me when I was still pregnant with Daisy that I have a nice warm bath (and a glass of wine/chocolate) and have a 'chat' with her to say goodbye. I shirked doing this for some days, but when I did it was a special time...heartbreaking as it was.
Sending you BIG hugs, and write more tonight if you need to. I am here. (with my daffodils, and the sun will shine for you. )
Love Lins

Dearest Lins
I so wish I had this kind of support with my first baby with DP but on reflection think maybe could not reach out in this way - I do remember looking on mumsnet in my panic and darkest moments but found nothing that seemed to mirror the pain. This time the loving words and kindnesses and connections have made such a difference. Feel so less isolated and scared. Feel more heartbroken but less alone. So yes it is all to be felt. The consultant was very understanding and gave lots of time and do feel calmer. Your suggestion of saying goodbye privately brought tears to my eyes - yes hard but sounds like an intimate motherly way to say goodbye. God. Is so cruel. Re the future - I do not know. As we have both said Hope is critical but also have to weigh up my age, advanced, and my ability to cope with pregnancy, anxiety and bringing up my other three and working too. Golly. Yet I remember also before the notion that there may be a wee healthy baby somewhere in the future for us and how tragic to not be brave enough to reach out to it. NO need to decide now - more important and scary things to deal with.
Am calmer today - less fraught. Quiet. Sad. One question - can not bring myself to speak out loud to any of my friends and family - just can not talk. DP has only tonight told my parents - they did not even know was pregnant. Is this bit odd do you think? Normally can not shut me up. Can text and email but that is all. Just can not face conversation, pity and tears.
Well done for getting through your wave of sadness and, as my dear friend says, getting back on the surfboard. xxx
Big hugs to you my virtual friend