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Original poster

Having a girl will divide us

476 replies

CrunchyCrump · 15/01/2022 06:52

I realise this is going to polarise a lot of people and I’m not sure what I’m looking for by posting, everything feels pretty dark at the moment so reaching out perhaps.

I’m expecting a DD in Spring after a DS. Because of my husbands religion, which I don’t share, she isn’t going to have the same freedoms in her choices that I’ve had. Having to marry into the religion for instance or conforming to religious dress.

Yes this was a discussion before we even married, but I’m now struggling with the lived version of an abstract thought. There’s no wiggle room either, if she doesn’t follow her father beliefs he will be punished for it.

I’ve spoken to DH, he does understand to an extent but when I ask for compromise he can’t meet me halfway on this because it’s so clear in his religion.

I’m so sad, it feels like this baby will cause us to separate and I don’t want that but at the same time I don’t know how I can accept a future where she doesn’t have a choice.

It’s my fault completely I accept that, I feel like I’ve screwed all of our lives up but I just can’t see a way forward.

OP posts:
Asi1 · 15/01/2022 08:24

@CrunchyCrump

Yes it is Islam and yes I’m fully aware there is a multitude of ways to follow. However there is still the paragraph saying hair should be covered, this is an honest question if anyone does have any examples where this is translated/interpreted differently it would really help me out
Yes hair needs to be covered as does the chest.

Do you cover your hair?

LittleBearPad · 15/01/2022 08:24

@nwLondonDad

Just go with it, as he's living in modern times and obviously open minded enough to marry outside his faith, over time he will probably be liberal and not object to daughter living as you see fit. If he's a hands off dad, and you do the heavy lifting, he's going to find it hard to make demands. The divorce comments seem extreme, a happy family is more valuable than having to wear a head scarf or go to a girls school. 0-16 what could the restrictions be that are so bad? Once they start maturing they will start challenging any oppressive behaviours they have adopted, and with a liberal mother on their team they will begin to isolate their dads closed thinking. And if he is a true family man, he will just adapt and take pride in having a happy daughter. Life often throws in challenges and restrictions, but I think having a happy and loving home will help get over these hurdles.
FFS.

A man has spoken! Don’t worry about the fact your daughter will be a second class citizen.

Tilltheend99 · 15/01/2022 08:25

You say it’s not cultural but in the U.K. girls generally don’t start covering their hair until secondary age.

pjparty · 15/01/2022 08:25

Quick google search and found this OP www.abdullahyahya.com/2019/09/proof-muslim-women-dont-have-to-cover-their-hair/
As a prior poster said it is just chest. That rule is odd enough.

I have many Muslim friends and only one of the chooses to cover her hair (her sister does not so in no was is it parental influence). Definitely do your own research and don't rely on your husband for information which will influence your daughters life to such an extent.

Maireas · 15/01/2022 08:25

@FFSFFSFFS

Calling it a religion doesn’t some make it justified abs acceptable. It’s just a system that men have set up so they can get women to do whatever they want.

I find it incomprehensible that you would contemplate subjecting your daughter to this sort of shit.

Exactly this.
Gardeningcreature · 15/01/2022 08:26

Oh dear op did you not think before you married him?
Seriously I don’t have sympathy for you.
You married a man who told you he follows a religion whereby females are scum, second class citizens and not of equal value to males.
He has told you that. Then you go on to have children with him.
All mainstream religions class women as second class, every single one of them.
Hello it’s 2022. Personally I hope the county I live in takes the lead from France and bans all this drivel.
Religion is no different to the views of other dictators.
It doesn’t matter that there are ‘get out clauses’ children get their values and belief systems from their parents and it sounds like in your case other family members. Thus will shape your son and daughter and who they become. Yes they might rebel against what they have been taught and shown their entire lives; in the same way a racist may shed their shackles after a lifetime of being taught that racism is correct. But seriously?
Children believe what their parents tell them to believe.

Wife2b · 15/01/2022 08:27

Please leave OP. Your daughter deserves so much better and it’s clear your pathetic excuse of a husband is never going to prioritise her needs and quality of life over his own selfish beliefs.

piney07 · 15/01/2022 08:27

There seems to be a lot of Islamophobia on this thread…. there are modern ways to interpret all religions.

Wife2b · 15/01/2022 08:27

@EishetChayil

Clearly you have to leave him.

To be a good mother to your daughter, you cannot stay with a man like this.

This.
LittleBearPad · 15/01/2022 08:29

@piney07

There seems to be a lot of Islamophobia on this thread…. there are modern ways to interpret all religions.
Rubbish. There’s a lot of anger about cultural norms that make women lesser to men. That isn’t required by Islam. It’s required by men who make rules that suit them and then pretend it’s required by religion
Frostine · 15/01/2022 08:30

Hopefully your not also talking of fgm ?

MonJardin · 15/01/2022 08:30

@CrunchyCrump

For everyone saying the paragraph can be interpreted different ways, I’d really appreciate it if you could send anything my way. I’ve looked at many different translations/interpretations etc and can’t find one where it says you don’t need to cover your hair, modest dress fine it’s the hair covering part.
So covering the hair is the oppressive part? FYI this is a thing in Judaism and Christianity as well. My advice for you and your husband is to please go educate yourself about Islam and the true meaning of this beautiful religion. The amount of ignorance and islamophobia on the thread is flabbergasting.
GrumpyPanda · 15/01/2022 08:30

@CrunchyCrump

Yes it is Islam and yes I’m fully aware there is a multitude of ways to follow. However there is still the paragraph saying hair should be covered, this is an honest question if anyone does have any examples where this is translated/interpreted differently it would really help me out
Hoping somebody will be along with some very concrete sources for you soon - some of the comments on here are less than helpful.

In the meantime, you don't mention in which country you are currently living. That said, it may be helpful to also reflect that for all Western countries I've ever seen the statistics for, the numbers are incredibly consistent in that the vast majority of muslimas don't wear hijab (think 70 percent or so).

TatianaBis · 15/01/2022 08:30

OP’s naivety is disturbing.

Fundamentalist, literal readings of ancient texts that she’s not sophisticated enough to question.

I have Muslim friends, none of them fall for this nonsense.

I just hope her daughter forgives her, because she might not.

Asi1 · 15/01/2022 08:30

@Gardeningcreature

Oh dear op did you not think before you married him? Seriously I don’t have sympathy for you. You married a man who told you he follows a religion whereby females are scum, second class citizens and not of equal value to males. He has told you that. Then you go on to have children with him. All mainstream religions class women as second class, every single one of them. Hello it’s 2022. Personally I hope the county I live in takes the lead from France and bans all this drivel. Religion is no different to the views of other dictators. It doesn’t matter that there are ‘get out clauses’ children get their values and belief systems from their parents and it sounds like in your case other family members. Thus will shape your son and daughter and who they become. Yes they might rebel against what they have been taught and shown their entire lives; in the same way a racist may shed their shackles after a lifetime of being taught that racism is correct. But seriously? Children believe what their parents tell them to believe.
Looks like your the one spouting drivel, GET EDUCATED!!

Women are not treated as second class, stop believing what the Daily Mail tells you.

girlmom21 · 15/01/2022 08:31

@piney07

There seems to be a lot of Islamophobia on this thread…. there are modern ways to interpret all religions.
There's not Islamophobia. Her husband is resisting the modernisation of interpretation and she's not arguing for the sake of her daughter.

People aren't hating Islam - they're arguing against oppression, whilst mostly actually defending the religion.

MonJardin · 15/01/2022 08:31

*yourselves

WaterBottle123 · 15/01/2022 08:31

But isn't it just as upsetting for you that a son would have to raised as a misogynistic bigot? So you'd perpetuate the cycle?

MoonWise · 15/01/2022 08:32

@CrunchyCrump

For everyone saying the paragraph can be interpreted different ways, I’d really appreciate it if you could send anything my way. I’ve looked at many different translations/interpretations etc and can’t find one where it says you don’t need to cover your hair, modest dress fine it’s the hair covering part.
Does it matter OP? millions of Muslim women don’t cover their hair regardless of what the text says. There is always a choice. Presumably their fathers are fine and unpunished, or standing up for their daughter’s choices.
CatsOperatingInGangs · 15/01/2022 08:32

@piney07

There seems to be a lot of Islamophobia on this thread…. there are modern ways to interpret all religions.
Oh give over! That’s just a way of getting people to shut up. The oppression of women in certain religions is well known and obvious to those who know people from those religions.
Maireas · 15/01/2022 08:32

@piney07

There seems to be a lot of Islamophobia on this thread…. there are modern ways to interpret all religions.
If you see an Islamophobic post on here, please report it. That should not be tolerated. However, people on here are discussing a significant gender issue which will impact this family.
KaptainKaveman · 15/01/2022 08:32

@CrunchyCrump

It is a mainstream religion, I’d like to point out that the expectations are not cultural and are explicitly stated in their relevant holy text. So men are allowed to marry outside the religion women can’t for instance.

The key thing here is it would be her choice to follow the expectations of the religion. The problem would be the expectation on her to follow it if that makes sense. So whilst it is a choice she’ll likely experience pressure to conform.

How can you accept this life for your daughter? I would leave. You and your dh are condemning her to a life of sexism. bullying, oppression and misogyny.
Thatsplentyjack · 15/01/2022 08:33

What do you mean he will be punished? So he would rather his daughter was punished her whole life?

Gardeningcreature · 15/01/2022 08:33

Stop throwing the Islamaphobia card.
People have brains now.
ALL mainstream religion treats females as second class.
You cannot justify telling one person that they must do X but person B doesn’t have to do it merely because they have a penis. Do you think it’s fine to segregate according to race?
No difference.
There is no place for this crap in 2022. No place.

TonTonMacoute · 15/01/2022 08:33

@piney07

There seems to be a lot of Islamophobia on this thread…. there are modern ways to interpret all religions.
Yes, but OP's DH does not seem able to do this! She states it quite clearly that he chooses to interpret religious strictures rigidly.

I’ve spoken to DH, he does understand to an extent but when I ask for compromise he can’t meet me halfway on this because it’s so clear in his religion.