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Original poster

Having a girl will divide us

476 replies

CrunchyCrump · 15/01/2022 06:52

I realise this is going to polarise a lot of people and I’m not sure what I’m looking for by posting, everything feels pretty dark at the moment so reaching out perhaps.

I’m expecting a DD in Spring after a DS. Because of my husbands religion, which I don’t share, she isn’t going to have the same freedoms in her choices that I’ve had. Having to marry into the religion for instance or conforming to religious dress.

Yes this was a discussion before we even married, but I’m now struggling with the lived version of an abstract thought. There’s no wiggle room either, if she doesn’t follow her father beliefs he will be punished for it.

I’ve spoken to DH, he does understand to an extent but when I ask for compromise he can’t meet me halfway on this because it’s so clear in his religion.

I’m so sad, it feels like this baby will cause us to separate and I don’t want that but at the same time I don’t know how I can accept a future where she doesn’t have a choice.

It’s my fault completely I accept that, I feel like I’ve screwed all of our lives up but I just can’t see a way forward.

OP posts:
Outlyingtrout · 15/01/2022 07:27

This is a no brainer, surely. Remain married to misogynistic male who prioritises his place in his society above his child's wellbeing or leave and allow your daughter to live a life free from oppression.
You're basically now in a situation where you need to balance the convenience and comfort of yourself and your husband against the lifelong impact on your daughter of this "religion" that will affect every facet of her life.

NewYearNewMinty · 15/01/2022 07:28

So whilst it is a choice she’ll likely experience pressure to conform.

And if she reaches 16 and doesn't?

Quite apart from not wanting your DD to live with that pressure, you also may well lose her once she reaches an age where she can make her own choices.

As awful as this must be for you, it seems fairly clear cut...you have to choose now between your DH and your daughter.

girlmom21 · 15/01/2022 07:28

Do you want your child to be deeply ingrained in the religion so early in her life?

If you're not religious yourself, will you be excluded?

LoudSnoringDog · 15/01/2022 07:28

A religion where men can do what they want and women are oppressed and have to conform...... Hmm

Depressing that this shit is going on. It's like the Dark fucking Ages

iwantsummertomorrow · 15/01/2022 07:30

I'm guessing the religion is Islam, which states women must marry Muslims whereas men can marry Jews or Christians. The logic is that children follow the religion of the father, and men marrying Jews and christians is permissible as all three religions believe in the same God.

OP, you're bringing this child into the world, so you have a duty to put her before anyone, including your husband imo.

853ax · 15/01/2022 07:33

Do you think that when your husband meets his daughter, sees her grow ect will realise better for her to reach all potential and not be limited by religious ideas?

Asi1 · 15/01/2022 07:35

[quote CrunchyCrump]@girlmom21 all children are taught the religion from around 3-5 so she’ll know about the expectations. Once any child hits 16 they’ll be accountable for their own actions as it were but yes parents are effectively punished (doesn’t get into heaven) for actions their child takes up until they’re married.

Part if me is thinking I’m blowing this up for something that’s not going to impact them for 14+ years. I’ll be ensuring they both get my views as well as they are taught to respect all other beliefs/faiths. It could be a non-issue, or at least kept kicking along into future IFYKWIM.[/quote]
It is not 16 it is when they hit puberty.

You are clearly demonstrating your posts that you don't fully understand the religion and its freedoms or boundaries yourself. Please post plainly what the religion so people can help you. Being vague isn't helpful to anyone is it?

CaveMum · 15/01/2022 07:36

It might be an idea to ask @MNHQ to move this thread to Relationships as it’s more likely to be seen by others who have been through similar there.

FWIW, my own opinion is that you need to sit down with your husband (if you think he is a reasonable man) and tell him you are not prepared to raise your children in his religion. If you think he will not listen or will become abusive then you say nothing and start making plans to leave now, before the birth as you will be much more vulnerable afterwards.

Asi1 · 15/01/2022 07:37

*

I really feel for children from multi faith families, they must feel very confused as to which way to turn. Maybe that is something you and your husband should discuss and try to support your daughter with as she gets older.

Original poster
CrunchyCrump · 15/01/2022 07:37

@JosephineDeBeauharnais as I said in the initial post I do not share his religion.
I also want to avoid conjecture as I’ve realised how ill informed we are in the UK about religion in general. It’s so ingrained in us from media.

No I’m not in the UK at the moment and no we’re not in danger. If parents divorce children stay with the mother on the whole

OP posts:
HardbackWriter · 15/01/2022 07:37

@CrunchyCrump

It is a mainstream religion, I’d like to point out that the expectations are not cultural and are explicitly stated in their relevant holy text. So men are allowed to marry outside the religion women can’t for instance.

The key thing here is it would be her choice to follow the expectations of the religion. The problem would be the expectation on her to follow it if that makes sense. So whilst it is a choice she’ll likely experience pressure to conform.

If it's a mainstream religion then there is a liberal tradition in it, and there are thinkers who have considered how to reconcile its precepts with equality. If he cares about you and her he needs to find and engage with them.
Samiamnot · 15/01/2022 07:39

I'm curious what tje religion OP? It's more likely to be cultural rules than religious.

Also, I'd leave. No way I'd accept raising my DDs to be oppressed. You've got to advocate for your daughter. Don't beat yourself up for decisions you made before you were married, it's done and can't be undone but you do need to make better choices now that DD is coming.

flashbac · 15/01/2022 07:40

[quote CrunchyCrump]@girlmom21 all children are taught the religion from around 3-5 so she’ll know about the expectations. Once any child hits 16 they’ll be accountable for their own actions as it were but yes parents are effectively punished (doesn’t get into heaven) for actions their child takes up until they’re married.

Part if me is thinking I’m blowing this up for something that’s not going to impact them for 14+ years. I’ll be ensuring they both get my views as well as they are taught to respect all other beliefs/faiths. It could be a non-issue, or at least kept kicking along into future IFYKWIM.[/quote]
If the religion is Islam you are talking out of your arse. Maybe get some proper information instead of relying on your husband.

WakeUpLockie · 15/01/2022 07:42

He doesn’t get to dictate to her though does he? Why would he if he doesn’t to you, and the country doesn’t… you’re an equal (or main?) parent in a free country.

Original poster
CrunchyCrump · 15/01/2022 07:42

@Asi1 I am deeply aware of exactly that within a multi faith family. We have always said our children would be fully aware of both of views whilst following my husbands religion. Yes I would agree I don’t fully understand all aspects and I’m still learning, they are considered independent in terms of their religious choice at 16. Puberty is something else in terms of clothing etc.

OP posts:
De88 · 15/01/2022 07:42

@CrunchyCrump

I realise this is going to polarise a lot of people and I’m not sure what I’m looking for by posting, everything feels pretty dark at the moment so reaching out perhaps.

I’m expecting a DD in Spring after a DS. Because of my husbands religion, which I don’t share, she isn’t going to have the same freedoms in her choices that I’ve had. Having to marry into the religion for instance or conforming to religious dress.

Yes this was a discussion before we even married, but I’m now struggling with the lived version of an abstract thought. There’s no wiggle room either, if she doesn’t follow her father beliefs he will be punished for it.

I’ve spoken to DH, he does understand to an extent but when I ask for compromise he can’t meet me halfway on this because it’s so clear in his religion.

I’m so sad, it feels like this baby will cause us to separate and I don’t want that but at the same time I don’t know how I can accept a future where she doesn’t have a choice.

It’s my fault completely I accept that, I feel like I’ve screwed all of our lives up but I just can’t see a way forward.

Personally- I could never choose any man over my child's freedom and happiness and I would never understand anyone else doing the same.
Original poster
CrunchyCrump · 15/01/2022 07:43

@HardbackWriter thank you I’ve been searching for a while but will keep going

OP posts:
BurntToastAgain · 15/01/2022 07:43

This draconian interpretation of Islam IS cultural @CrunchyCrump.

There is not only one way to be a Muslim and your husband is wrong that things like how women are treated are simply ‘facts’ or ‘immoveable’ objects. There are lots of ways to be a Muslim. Just as there are different interpretations of Judaism or Catholicism or any religion.

The problem here is that he’s using this to control everything not the religion itself. And presumably his family are too. They use the ‘it is written in the texts’ (which are all riddled with inconsistencies- all religious texts are) to distract from the fact that the oppressive and unfair things they are insisting on are just their cultural preference.

Mellowyellow222 · 15/01/2022 07:43

I would not stay and subject my children to such a limited life.

She has so much potential - all limited and contained because of one parent belief that she is less deserving of freedom because of her gender.

To be frank I know I could you do never love a man who believes this and who would force his child to live this way just to secure himself a place in heaven (in his mind).

But then I believe most religions were designed by men to make themselves feel better and punish women.

Original poster
CrunchyCrump · 15/01/2022 07:45

@BurntToastAgain it’s not cultural when it’s explicitly stated in their text that women should cover their hair. Not sure how that can be misinterpreted?

OP posts:
always2tired · 15/01/2022 07:47

I have also married into another culture that sounds exactly the same as your husband's beliefs involving daughters and he said everything that your husband has said when I was pregnant with my daughters (I have two) but ever since they have been born he has had a change of heart especially as they have gotten older and now only wishes for them to be happy. I also have 3 sons and they always side with their sisters and fight their corner when it comes to his extended family that don't always approve of their freedom and choices. Xx

Asi1 · 15/01/2022 07:48

[quote CrunchyCrump]@Asi1 I am deeply aware of exactly that within a multi faith family. We have always said our children would be fully aware of both of views whilst following my husbands religion. Yes I would agree I don’t fully understand all aspects and I’m still learning, they are considered independent in terms of their religious choice at 16. Puberty is something else in terms of clothing etc.[/quote]
You said that their parents would be punished for their choices. When a child reaches puberty then they are held responsible for their own actions.

Do you have a source for where it mentions about religious reedom at 16. I've never heard that before.

CookieDoughKid · 15/01/2022 07:48

Op what it is you want us to tell you? That this is ok? You know it isn't. That's why you're posting. Either you continue down this path or you walk away. If it is a orthodox as you say it is, the choices are going to be extreme. Stay or go.

Simonjt · 15/01/2022 07:50

[quote CrunchyCrump]@BurntToastAgain it’s not cultural when it’s explicitly stated in their text that women should cover their hair. Not sure how that can be misinterpreted?[/quote]
Ah, so must be catholic/jewish as the Qur’an asks for the chest to be covered. But then judaism is ‘inherited’ through the mother, so leaves catholic.

clpsmum · 15/01/2022 07:50

Put your daughter first and leave. Your DH does have a choice abs he has chosen religion of his child