Can't bear this anymore, is termination at 15 16 weeks just going to make it all worse?

[Sleeplessinnorthlondon]

I'm going to delete my profile soon as so ashamed of all of what's happened but desperate for any advice anyone can offer. In summary, conceived when thought couldn't, just about to start ivf, and didn't know. Had two different due dates from different scans but looks like could have drunk heavily 16, 17 and 18 dpo. Stopped as soon as found out but can't shake the guilt despite doctors all telling me it would probably be fine. Would never have terminated for downs or any condition the child was going to have anyway, but cannot bear idea of having spoilt life chances of child that would have been healthy through stupidity. Tried counselling, midwife, friends, all been so kind but can't shake terror and guilt and suspect will never shift and will be terrible mother when born as so anxious and guilty. Just can't bear any of this any more, none of the help I've tried to access is working and Marie stopes have said they can organise an abortion this week. Will mean hurting friends, family and above all darling darling husband but he has said will support me if it's the only way forward. So so desolate and terrified, everyone around me saying this is mental health issue not physical and probably right but in no state to bring child into the world like this anyway. Has anyone been in the same boat? Did the termination help or make it worse? Please help me.

Oops I missed where you are going to mh midwife, misread how many pages on thread. So thankful for that. You will get over this, I promise. I have three kids now, all well and healthy xx

What Duplodon said

I have had OCD events whilst being particularly stressed out (not pregnant) and I look back now and think 'What on earth was my mind doing'

It's actually quite scary. Get help right now.

This was very helpful to me:
holisticonline.com/Remedies/Anxiety/anx_panic-contextual-therapy.htm

Theory A: OCD type thinking tells you the problem is you had some drink in early pregnancy which has harmed your baby irreversibly and you are responsible for harming your baby, meaning you are a bad person who doesn't deserve a happy outcome to this pregnancy.

Your mind then tells you that you need an abortion to escape the pain of this thought about yourself and your baby. You are in agony.

Theory B: your wise mind which is drowned out by the OCD thoughts knows that really the problem is one of worry. You are worried that you have harmed your baby irreversibly and that you can't have a happy outcome. You're so scared of a bad outcome after all this waiting for a baby because you are a loving person who wants to have a happy future with a longed for child, but you are terrified it might not happen - so terrified you fear you can't bear the pain and just want to end it now.

You crave certainty because this matters so much. Ending it would bring certainty of a bad outcome but the uncertainty hurts so badly your mind wants it all just to stop. That is so understandable. Your mind has you fighting the wrong battle. You need comfort and love and compassion for your fear, not to take action through abortion.

My heart is with you. You will come through this. Pregnancy is terrifying. You have strength to take the challenge but you need urgent support.

Dear all, got referral for psychiatrist who I've rung and left voicemail for then also waiting on midwife mental health team to call me back still. Made appt with a different recommended private psychotherapist for earliest slot they had which was Friday and then also with fetal medicine centre tomorrow who did earlier scans and have consultants I am hoping can either further reassure me or at least / better still refer to mental health service they know of I can see quickly as the midwife service could take some time. I've told a few friends now what's going on in part to make it harder to have termination as they would know and all think it's mad and try to stop me etc. sleeping loads but so tired and just want to feel calm again. Agree on OCD points, this termination no doubt would not be end to my problems so much a start of different set but then would have time to at least work through all my fears and get them properly managed before inflicting self on a child.

Inflicting self on a child?

You are the child's mother! You are the best person made to look after that baby, do not ever doubt yourself!

You will be fine OP, all positive steps so far, you will I PROMISE look back on this and see it for what it is, an irrational phase that can be worked through.

That's your OCD mind telling you that you need to be perfect/fixed to be worthy of a perfect baby and a happy outcome. It's telling you if you will only have an abortion the fear and discomfort will go away. It's lying.

You would feel worse and have to face all this again and the fear would transfer to a new thing. Also, having the abortion would feed the OCD mind and strengthen it, making you believe what it told you was true and necessary for a happy pregnancy and future... So would increase the likelihood you would seek an abortion for a healthy pregnancy in future.

OCD is like a devil on your shoulder. It takes the things that matter the most and perverts them and tells you that you can never have them, torturing you into actions that seem to make it calm down but actually move you away from what matters to you.

The most important thing is to fight it. Your thoughts are not you. You don't have to listen to them. Just hang on in there and make no drastic choices until you have adequate support and time to know its you calling the shots, not OCD or whatever your demon's name may end up being.

Well done for all of your actions so far, it all sounds really positive and can't have been easy. And you would not be inflicting yourself on your child, he/she will be proud to have such a brave mother who went through so much to bring them into the world.

sleepless you won't be 'inflicting self on a child'... Your child will love you and you will love your child - no parent is perfect - we all have to muddle through the best we can. When you have had some treatment you will see this for yourself and this will become clearer and simpler.

When I was really poorly with my OCD at 8 weeks pg I felt awful for both my DH and my unborn child for being stuck with such a second rate wife and mother as myself... Now I've had some treatment - which I completely threw myself into 100% although it was tough at times - and I'm feeling completely different. I don't think I'll be winning mother of the year any time soon but I love my baby to bits and can't wait to meet him. Things can and will change quickly... Have hope that things will be OK. X

You've made some great steps. The thing is all of pregnancy and parenthood is full of these worries and it is important to keep them in perspective.

I didn't know I had conceived DS, I didnt find out till I was 6 weeks. Weeks 4 and 5 were heavy drinking weeks, one girls 3 day holiday probably consumed 6+ bottles of wine, 2 weddings a bottle a wedding easy.

DS is perfect, I had the same concerns as you spoke to midwife she said "it will be fine, honest, as there's no crossover really."

DS is ahead of milestones and thriving. Please don't worry

Sleepless you've taken some really important and brave steps already. Take a moment to feel good about having done that. You're taking back control of your life and you're taking steps towards better mental health and emotional strength - these are achievable for you. From everything you've said I think there is real hope for you to have a happy and grounded future. You deserve happiness. If you have your baby (and I can't help hoping you will) they will be proud to have you as their mum. You haven't denied your problems - you are brave enough to face them. I wish you strength. Come back and tell us how everything goes with the appointments etc.

Well done sleepless, you are so brave to make these steps. I promise it will get better and you will feel yourself again. I had pnd at the start of the year with awful all consuming anxiety about everything. It was exhausting, isolating and scary. I have had counselling, lots of support from family and health visitor and eventually medication (which I put off for far too long). I now feel like my old self but better and I am loving every minute of being with my babies. I look back at that scary time of not being well and can't believe how I have come on. This will happen to you too and life will be good again. You have made the most difficult step of seeking out help and hopefully things will improve from now on.
Take care of yourself

Ps I had times when I was mentally ill with pnd where I was convinced that we should put ds up for adoption as I just couldn't cope and didn't think I was cut out for being a mother second time round. Thank goodness I had the support and a great Dh as I would be distraught now to not have my 2 precious little ones.

Sleepless I know this sounds ridiculous seeing as I don't know you, but I'm really proud of you. Look at you, you're already acting like a wonderful mother. You're putting the welfare of your baby ahead of your own fears. You've taken the really tough step of seeking help and that is no mean feat in itself. You've told your friends so a termination would be harder. I can see from your posts that you want this baby and you are already doing so much to protect it. Dealing with mental health problems, whether depression, anxiety or so many other things, is so so hard and you've already taken a massive step.

Sleepless. I really admire you for getting some help.

Different kind of story here: I did not drink and did everything 'right' during pregnancy. My gorgeous DD has a brain disorder which developed in utero and fairly profound SNs.

I won't pretend I didn't rack my brain for what I did 'wrong' when I was pregnant, because I did.

But despite something coming to pass that I would never have chosen, she is my daughter and I love her every bit as much as my other child. I loved her from birth and the love never went away when the difficulties came to light. She is my child, with all the love and connection that conveys.

From what you have written, you have had great longing for a child and great difficulty having one? I think you need to consider that there may not be other chances for you to have a child (if I have understood correctly).

And I just want you to know that if you continue with the pregnancy you will have a child who will enrich you life so much it's not possible to describe. The issue of them having/ not having difficulties is secondary to the joy you have in having your child in the world with you, being with you and being their mother.

Very best of luck to you whatever you decide.

And to KittyAndTeal.

Another here who is so glad you've told people in rl and thst you can get the support you need.

sleepless well done on seeking help. I've had mental health problems in the past, and pregnancy hormones have made them re-occur, and your anxiety just sounds so very familiar to me. You aren't alone, and pregnancy affects a lot of women this way. I can't tell you how to cope, because that's different for every woman, but there is loads of support out there to help you find a way to overcome and survive these feelings, and it genuinely will help you.

Sleepless I truly hope you find peace with your situation. It really isn't about having a few nights of drinking - the number of people on this thread who did the same (and worse) and have healthy children are evidence of this.

You clearly have underlying issues and do need support and I very much hope you get all the help you need. You wanted this baby and you are obviously someone who cares deeply - you have shown this by already putting concerns about your unborn baby ahead of your desire to be a mother, and for that alone, you deserve to be a mother just as much as anyone else. You deserve to be a mother to this baby and this baby would be so very lucky to have you.

FWIW, I too got absolutely hammered (and worse) whilst pregnant with DC2 in the first 5 weeks before I knew. Think of the most decadent weekend (Festival) followed by a big birthday and then your best friend's big birthday.... that was my early pregnancy. Of course I stopped drinking the minute I knew I was pregnant but I was worried and he turned out just fine.

Good luck with everything.

Sleepless, that paper about alcohol induced defects says:
In the first two weeks following fertilization, excessive alcohol consumption does not generally have a negative effect on the zygote

Your 17d post-ovulation binge was only 3days post fertilisation - too early to be likely to affect your pregnancy, as PPs have said.

And, in any case, what you drank wasn't all THAT much! (for a one-off.) I did the same thing/ similar quantities when I (didn't know I was) pregnant (and I smoked a couple of joints too). I felt guilty afterward but I realised it must happen all the time!

Plus, that's been so for centuries. Remember that alcohol is old, but pregnancy tests are new - it is a very recent thing for women to know they're pregnant at 17dpo and to behave differently as a result.

Oh I'm sorry, thread has moved on...Yes OP, the alcohol was totally a red herring and I'm sorry if it was unhelpful to give it any real consideration.

You're all so so so kind. Therapist sounds really firm and intelligent which is good, will messag after first session. Spending day doing revision classes tomorrow in school which sounds crackers but will enjoy and take mind off all this, then therapist, then fmc. Dh coming to both appts at least to start with to make sure give proper history as tend to be vague on details when face to face not deliberately just as become so anxious and vague. Will message update in the evening, thank you all so so much, you are the best women out there in the world xxxx

Sounds like a really good plan. Good luck with it all tomorrow. You can do this. X

Good for you! You've taken a big step getting help. Don't minimise your symptoms when you're in there tomorrow. I do this and I didn't even realise until the first time I went to the hospital with my Dh. I was all "well, I have a bit of this and that but I can manage" and Dh was all " my god no, women! You have this and this and it's terrible!"

For years I've wondered why doctors have sent me out the door with two aspirin and a lie down. :)

You will get through this. Keep busy and stay strong.

Good luck. It helped me to write down things ahead of these big sessions.

Remember that it is perfectly understandable to have extreme stress when in the queue for IVF and everything that brought you there, and then to find yourself pregnant anyway can be weirdly shocking. IVF and infertility are known risk factors for this. Your mind is probably so used to having trouble with this whole conception malarkey and trying to shield you from painful emotions associated with that, that it's just flipped into hyperdrive in a way that's unhelpful. It just needs some soothing and you will look back and be amazed you ever thought this way.

In fact, you should print off the thread and bring it your session, and then keep it for a few months time. I have an email I sent to a consultant when I was 20+ weeks pregnant or so, describing myself as being weak, selfish and disgusting for not being able to decide on the "perfect" way to birth and how I was looking at pictures of babies who had died to prepare myself for the inevitable, and every time I felt happiness, I would automatically flip it to "but the baby is going to die and your life will be over". I go into great detail in this email about how this is all true and it's clear I really really believe that my baby is seriously damaged, I am a massive potential source of harm and we are both going to die. At this stage, three years later, I have a healthy three year old and a healthy one year old and it just seems like a different reality. I had a lot of very good treatment on the NHS through psychological therapies though I had to wait until after birth for that, I had some private sessions in pregnancy too.

You will be happy and calm and be able to soothe yourself in time. You will. Good luck xx

Sleepless You are doing so well... Maybe print off your OP and take it with you to the doctor etc if that will help you? You are less likely to miss something out then, can't minimise the way you were feeling when you wrote that (and any other related posts you have written) and it will help the doctor to understand your symptoms.

Good luck with everything.