December 2008 - Its not wind they are smiling.

[JamInMyWellies]

Here we go ladies Rosmerta suggestion.

wg - i don't mean any offence by saying 'monkey' - hope you didn't mind

When DH's milk float jokes were wearing thin the other day I made the mistake of telling him about "looks like its time for another trip to the breastaurant". DH loved it and has been busy making his own modifications "is DS tucking in or is he still waiting to be seated?" and "looks like DS is trying to catch the maitre dit's eye". Good job I love him.

It is best not to express for as least the first 6 weeks as far a how to express I'll have a look in the book bestfeeding when I can find it it's around here somewhere but failing that will ask my supervisor for my bfn helpers course it starts back for the new term tomorrow which I am quite looking forward to. I didnt get much experience of expressing as like Arti, my ds didnt like anything but his mook mook direct from the boobie, he ended up skipping bottles and straight to beakers

Also managed to pass my latest exam for the open university course. I think it helps if I actually read the text properly this time.

LadyT and Arti your coded conversation is quite entertaining.

Trace I had a colleague once who told myself and other nurses off because we were referring to our LCs as cheeky monkeys as he felt this was derogeratory to our children...he was a bit weird, I think he's a priest now, not that priests are weird. Sorry to any Catholics.

The book I have called best feeding doesn't say much about when to express just to do it before a feed. I have heard that it is good to express off one breast while feeding off the other though I imagine that would be a bit of a juggle.

I'm really interested in expressing info too. I need to start soon as I'm back to work at the end of the month (chutney - I'm going into a production of the opera The Magic Flute, singing Queen of the Night).

I've been told it's a good idea to express at the end of a feed, as then the bub has had what it needs first, and you can then express any remaining milk you have. Supposedly you don't get much at first but then your supply will adjust accordingly and gradually increase. I've also read that your breasts actually fill better/faster when they're properly empty too (I think I got that info off the kellymom website, I'll have to find the link). The midwife that visited recently also said that women usually have more breast milk in the morning, however I don't know how true that is. I still think it depends on when your bub feeds most, as not all babies are in a sleep-most-in-the-night routine!

I know it's not ideal to be expressing before 6 weeks, but unfortunately I just don't have that much time before I have to go back to work. But I really want DS to still have breastmilk if possible. We bought a fangly double Medela expressing pump too, so we need to make good use of it as it cost an arm & a leg!

Anyway any tips from those who are already expressing, or have expressed before (or Veggie the BF guru) are much appreciated!

Hope lots of babies are sleeping well over there in the UK at the moment...

Ah - here is that kellymom info on how milk production works...

Sorry, that should have been Maitre d'. I'm an idiot.

Bisou - Queen of the Night, wow.

Morning all, couldn't get on much yesterday, spent the day cleaning up ds1's vomit!

kmp so sorry to hear about your dh's granddad

cat glad you've had some help, you sound a lot better for it. And yes, 24hrs for bottles of formula in the fridge.

verso yay on the good night, hope it continues

arti glad you enjoyed your pub lunch. Am also at you & LadyT's glamourous life!

hi daisy nice to see you back!

veggie sounds like you had a lovely afternoon! Must admit, I enjoyed getting back to my course as well. Congratulations on the exam pass!

trace I remember starting dance at your dd1's age! I bet she looks so cute! Glad dd2 had a good day as well

I'm hoping not to have any more vomit to clean up today. I also really need to start getting ds2 into set nap times during the day. He tends to fall asleep at 5pm atm, wakes up at 6pm & doesn't go off to sleep for ages after that. I did have a look at the GF timings & remembered why I didn't do it first time around!

wg hope dd settled down in the end.

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Bisou once you are actually back at work you can express there (during rehearsals) at around the times your baby would feed, they just need to provide you with a private space and a fridge. Also with expressed milk when you are going to give it to your baby don't shake the bottle as that will break the bonds of the fats and ruin them instead just kind of swill the milk around a bit in the bottle to mix it up.

hello all

well, dd kicked off spectacularly early eve and wouldn't settle until dh brought her up at 1.30 (he also looks at MN and is finding the breastaurant v v v funny - i tend to talk about "Casa Mama being open for business"). he is an angel and basically looked after her all that time, apart from the nanoseconds when we thought she was asleep in her moses basket (actually lulling us into a false sense of security, gathering energy to kick off again), and when i am feeding. she vommed quite a bit up after a frantic feeding session - can i ask advice? if dd voms lots and lots up after a feed, should i feed again to replenish her tummy (but that seems daft), or wait a bit and try again? the night before last i restricted a feed to 7 mins, in order to get something in her, but not too much to induce more vomming. ideas?

it seems it has been 2 days in a row that she has kicked off early evening to 1 or 2am. oh, hell... colic????

once she settles, she goes 3-4 hours before waking hungry, and settles like an angel (touch wood). you see, she can do it, but just not early eve and before 1/2am.

arti - i know the anglesea arms well - was born and brought up in west london, and while not exactly there, it was on my cycle route to school. yum. actually went there with my dad the weekend after my mum died, so about 7 years ago this weekend...

trace - absolutely no worries about calling her monkey - we call her that, too, and far far worse (social services here i come).

bless my dh - he is such a star - currently lying on the sofa (came down with her at 7am and has fallen asleep on the sofa in front of the cricket - hallelujah for sky sports).

lots of love to you all this grey and dismal morning.

wow that's really interesting veggie. I knew it separated but not that you should't shake it. Another gem of advice. And thanks for your advice too Cat as I would have been surprised if I'd gotten nothing at first try, so that's good to know that it might take a few attempts.

Also found the jackpot for expressing info on the kellymom website. So will be reading up there now...

Morning all! I think after yesterday's rantathon she must have listened as she's just been put in her pushchair! This is some kind of miracle. Still fed to sleep, but at least I can hopefully have a shower without her yelling Maybe it's the big change everyone says to expect at 6 weeks? Oh and had her 6 week check-up, is now 9lb 6oz (up from 7 3) and can I say I have renewed respect for all of you who managed to have babies that were this big in the first place!

Bisou - Queen of the night! yowza. I've tried in singing lessons but sound a bit Florence Forster-Jenkins Go you did you find any changes in your voice while pg? I know one lady who turned permanently into an alto I found on the whole that breathing was fine as if anything the bump gave me some extra heft in the diaphragm.

WG re sleeping, maybe I've misunderstood here but are you waiting a good 20 mins or so before putting dd down? They need to shift into the deep sleep phase as otherwise they're really easily disturbed. Sorry if this is what you're doing anyway.

Kayz and trace and lal - hope you have a lovely meetup!

those with coldy nippers, karvol was the stuff my mum used on us, the smell takes me right back to being about 4

cat I'm afraid I've been leaving her to cry if eg I'm halfway through putting on my trousers or something like that - they don't suffer too much from crying for a minute or two, it's the massive hour long cry-it-out sessons that upset them. I've been told this by a very attachment-parenting friend and if she says it's ok to leave them for a minute or two, I believe her! As long as you're going to her in a reasonable time, it's fine.

and to kick me in the bum for my pride earlier she's now woken up - catch up with everyone else later!

WG sounds like colic to me I'M AFRAID,AND EXACLTY THE ROUTINE WE GO THROUGH WITH dd EVERYNIGHT, EVEN DOWN TO THE TIMINGS.
Oops, sorry for the caps, typing one handed and can't be arsed to retype.

In a baby brain moment I just went into the ante natal threads ? and there?s a due Sept 09 one now! Those babies will have been conceived after some of ours were born ? I can?t believe how much time is flying

Veggie very well done on the exam, I think you should have some special recognition for studying whilst pregnant/a new mum ? I know my brain would fail at the writing my name on the exam paper! Thanks for looking up the info on expressing too, and interesting about the swilling/shaking thing ? I wouldn?t have thought of that.

Bisou I?ll ask lots of expressing questions this afternoon and feed back what I find out. Thanks for the kellymom links, I?ll have a read of those. Are you going back to work full time this month, or easing yourself into it? I?m still easing myself into getting dressed every day!

And talking of getting dressed, I really must make an effort ?

Morning all,

DS was a dream last night. had a feed at 7.30 and that was him till 2am. That is a record so far...hope this means the cluster feeding in an evening is coming to an end!

I too have tried expressing after I have fed DS, or if he goes longer between feeds and my boobs go like balloons! But is so hard with DD as well I never seem to find the time plus she wants 'to help'. But when DD was a baby I had a freezer full of EBM!!

WG, FWIW my DD used to throw up loads after her feeds but it was like water. It was almost like she's had the milk seperated the fatty stuff and got rid of the water she didn't want I used to try and feed again thinking she was hungry but wasn't sure she actually was.

zj wait til there's a Dec 09 thread!

Well last night a bit better - decided it was time to go back in the cot - all tucked in and then vomit everywhere so cleaned up and then fed again but much smaller amount! WG Apparently if they are getting at least 5ml's an hour on average they won't dehydrate. I'm just trying to do smaller feeds more often while he's got this cold as he coughs and it all comes up then he's starving again
Nolda pmsl at your dh!!
Bisou I had a problem at 2 weeks with a stressful incident that happened while the family was over my let down or milks release or something stopped. Only fix was to express it to get flow again. Anyway, he had been not gaining enough weight so when the flow started again, the BF specialist had me expressing from one side to empty in between feeding from the other the swapping sides for the next express and then topping him up after feeding for a week. he took to the bottle fine, and he was only about 2 weeks old at that point.
I think it depends on the baby, but you can get away with it if he is ok doing both.
JJ thanks for the 20 min tip on settling - I didn't know that - but it's usually taken that long before he's settled so I will wait 20 mins on first attempt next time!

Please excuse any typing errors, I have DD on my shoulder and a cat on my knee. Anyone else got cats that are feeling rather left out?

ladyT Thanks for the reassurances on the maternity clothes. You and Arti are soooo glam! How funny you know all the same people

cat Re preventing wind. We use Dr Browns bottles which are meant to be anti-colic. We started using them as the nurse at the hospital when we were referred because of DD's weight loss recommended them. DD gets a bit of wind but presumably it would be much worse without these bottles!

Oh and I find it is easier to get DD's body straight for winding if I hold her firmly against my body. Intead of just holding her up on my knee. I hope that description makes sense. I'm not sure if that is obvious and you are all aleady doing that!

Nolda LOL at the Breastaurant!

Well done on passing your exam veggie

WG It sounds like colic to me but I'm no expert. Sorry to hear the anniversary of your mum's death is coming up. It must be really hard

Last night was fine in the end. DD woke three times but settled after each feed so it wasn't too bad without DH. I don't know how people cope on their own though. My Dad died a few months before I was born and it must have been so difficult for my mum with me and my 18 month old brother to look after.

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Hello everyone

I feel fantastic as I had a lunch with my friend. How wonderful it is to have visitors. DD had a cuddle with him, her godfather-to-be, then slept nicely through our lunch out so was the perfect baby but as you all know, babies operate on a simple payback basis so there are bound to be horrors to come later Her cold is better I think.

Katie - hooray for the weight gain!

Nolda - breastaurant - boys just like crap jokes, esp. if repeated over and over. Sorry to be sexist but it is absolutely true in 9 out of 10 cases...DP certainly fits into that category.

Bisou - The Magic Flute - how lovely. I swear I will come and see you perform one day. Good luck to all you expressers. Making your own food is nearly as amazing as making a baby.

Oh, and Trace, Veggie etc - I call my DD a monkey all the time. Or a monkington. Oh, and well done about the exam, Veggie! I congratulate myself if I get through a DVD

Anyway, must be off now as I am having a weekend in London, just me. DP is going up to visit his Mum and I have got special dispensation to have some time on my own - was going to take DD with me but he wants to take her with him, so...Have lovely weekends, all of you. I will be lurking but not posting until Monday xxx

ladyt glad you had a nice time, its always good when they behave in front of others!

I caught ds1 calling ds2 a 'cheeky monkey' today , wonder if we use that a bit too much in our house?!

cat Dr Browns is a brand of bottle with a valve type thing inside that is meant to prevent wind. The valve is a bit faffy to clean - you get a tiny bottle brush to clean it with that looks like a mascara wand. We were reccomended them by a nurse whose baby had colic. DD wasn't eating enough at the time and as wind can make tem feel full, the nurse advised we give them a go. They don't stop wind entirely but they might be worth a try if wind is a big problem for your LO.

Hope everyone has a restful weekend.

Hi all, went to my class today and they were all very excited to meet Jordan finally. One of the girls remarked on how slim I looked then realised that was because the last time she saw me I had a large bump. I stayed back after the class to get some advice on how to get him to open his mouth wider to latch better. My supervisor was great she watched how I got him to latched then tweeked things and gave me some pointers on what I wasdoing wrong and how to correct them and we managed to be him to open his mouth nice and wide. Hopefully I can continue that success. I completely forgot to ask about expressing sorry but will do next week. We watched a brilliant DVD about a study that was done about newborns crawling up the mums abdomen finding a boob and laching on it was really interesting.