December 2008 - Its not wind they are smiling.

[JamInMyWellies]

Here we go ladies Rosmerta suggestion.

Poor you , Katie, write offs take bloody ages - just been through it with our old Volvo. Thank goodness everyone's Ok though.

I had forgotten such tiny babies could produce so much snot - and get so totally blocked up. Saline drops do help but mine both scream blue murder when I put them in - any other suggestions?

Just had them weighed (one advantage of twins is that HV takes pity on us and comes round to weigh them to save me suffering for two hours at baby clinic), and they're 11.5 and 10lbs - so pleased, it makes all the feeding efforts worthwhile. Still no sign of anything longer than 3.5 hours between feeds at night - even though Vic had 180mls of formula and one breast in half an hour last night .

Do we have to book separate appointments for our own and our babies' 6-week check-ups? I had forgotten/not realised so now have to go back with the babies. I can't remember what they do at that check-up? (i.e. whether it's worth bothering)

Finsbury Park is great for me if I could please join a N London meet up?

Effie, know what you mean about listening out for your DS1 'helping' - DD1 picked up Hope the other day and Steve found her standing with her held by one arm and one leg at the top of the stairs saying 'she's crying'. I thought it would be OK not to have to watch DD1 like a hawk as she's now 4, but I think we've got through to her now.

V weird day here today. DD2 v unsettled overnight and now having an off day - not really settling properly for naps and generally not being herself (though v smiley earlier when saying "ooh" and "ah" to me very slowly, distinctly and carefully. Bless. She has got herself into a beautiful routine in the past couple of weeks so today has really floored me! I'm not obsessive about the routine, but have found it much easier to handle than the chaos/anarchy that was looking after DD1! It's nice to usually predict with some reasonable certainty the shape of the day... so today is most odd.

Find being stuck in the house really irritating and depressing, but given your experience Katie I am glad in a way that I haven't ventured out. I hope the insurance gets sorted out asap and and very glad to hear no one was injured.

DH has gone back to work today and DD1 is at nursery so I feel very alone! Hope this snow/ice clears so I can have a 'normal' week next week... sybil I will email you!

oh my god, I am a terrible mother DD has done a big poo down her leg and soaked her babygrow, but has also gone to sleep for the first time since 4am, so I have wrapped her leg in a muslin to try and keep her blanket clean and left her to sleep as I think she needs that more than she needs to be clean . The poor baby girl, what future does she have with a mother like me?

Now I've confessed I will catch up on the thread, feel like I should scrub the toilet with my fingernails or something to make up for this!

Would love to join a Finsbury Park meetup!! Is it the pizza place on Blackstock Rd Effie? Let's set a date!

WG glad things seem better today. You know what, I have seen you with R and would describe you in every way as motherly and very instinctual, as I would Cat, Jump and everyone I have met on from this thread. And you have the motherly trait of giving yourself one hell of a hard time when you are only 6 weeks into the biggest change of your life! Please be kind to yourself. As others have said, your Dad's friend can be detatched and yes, does have experience of handling large no.s of newborns. I can't soothe DD2 when she is anywhere near feeding time (even if the problem isn't hunger) because as Veggie says I smell like a meal which just drives her nuts!!

Jump I wasn't meaning to be facetious in suggesting time out. I am feeding every 3 hours too during the day so know there is no wandering off into the sunset for a p*ss-up at the pub. Was more thinking getting DH to have her for an hour while you go get your hair done, go for a massage. Something quick. (Must take own advice and do something). Hope you are

Is anyone else finding their whole body aches with the feeding? I thought I was sitting properly etc but have such sore shoulders etc etc. REALLY need a full body massage. Chance would be a fine thing, but might try,

Yes, am aching here too, turnip. I probably should sit in a proper chair to do night feeds but it's so much easier to just sit up in bed. I also have aching everything else as well though - not just shoulders. Body massage sounds lovely... I wish!

Bugger, I have lost my new iphone in the cinema! Am so pissed off. Have to ring them later to see if it turns up.
jj did you make it to the cinema? I was going to text you to see if you were going but was in a hurry (another massive poo that took ages to clear up this morning - he has a good sense of timing but at least he hasn't done when I'm out yet) I was goingn to look for you afterwards but I was so pissed off about my phone I went home!
WG glad you are feeling a bit better!!
Oh a question, last night DH was meant to be feeding DS, he has tried ebm before and he took it fine, last night he didn't like it AT ALL. But I had already expressed some fresh milk by the time he found this out, so he tried my fresh milk and he took that fine. Do you think the other milk was off (it was 3 days old so on the limit) or could it be the temperature? Or had I somehow contaminated it?

Oh if north London meetup is week after next I will come we are staying near kings cross so not far for us, will have Ds1 in toe.

Not sure about the EBM maybe just prefers it fresh?

katie yikes, glad you're ok!

ZJ that sounds like by far the best way to deal with the situation, sleep is such a precious thing and you can always clean up your dd later...

turnip sorry, did't mean to jump down your throat, just having a rough morning Will try and get dh to take her for an afternoon and get shorn, last haircut I had was done by me the morning she was born - stood in front of the bathroom mirror going "must cut hair hnnnnnngggggghhhhhh looking really bouffanty hnnnnngggghhhhhhh must look good in photos nnnnnnnnnnnnhhhhhhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrggggggggg" Home haircuts, save a fortune but dammit am probably allowed a proper one by now

SL I made it to the cinema but only at 11.25 (bloody buses not turming up for ages...) and they didn't let us in - 2 other mums arrived aat the same time but apparently you have to be there by 15 minutes after the film starts. bearing in mind this is a film especially for ladies with babies, seems a bit strict but there you go... have bought ticket for next week's movie to encourage getting up of arse and leaving the house on time! Hope your phone reappears [eek]

re ebm, maybe it was just a bit cold, they're used to it being the perfect temp which must be very hard to achieve out of the fridge.

went into town with dd instead and gave her a feed in a church - they're great when caught short, usually pretty quiet so private and nobody can object as you just refer them to In the bleak midwinter Only marginally horrified when dd tested the acoustic with some truly exceptional trumps

took her to the baby clinic, she's up to 10lb13 (from 7lb3 at birth) so very nearly the elusive 11lb when they're meant to be capable of sleeping through... we'll see eh!

Well you learn something new everyday ? thanks Cat, now I will try to use the word ellipsis in conversation to show how clever I am

WG I?m glad you?re feeling better today and I hope you?ve had a good day? Do take care of yourself as well as your LO. Your Dad?s partner sounds lovely, and I?m sure she?d be happy if you call if you need her whilst she?s away, just as we are all happy to hear from you on MN. Someone joked to my DH this week that he needs an ?L? plate on the pram, but to be honest I think an ?L? plate on my back is more appropriate . But regardless of that, DD thinks I?m an expert as I?m all she knows and has nothing to compare me with, fortunately for her (see earlier post about poo on babygrow)

Daisy I love your DD!

Katie what a relief that no one was hurt, but a scary experience for you. I hope you had a big mug of tea once you?d made your phone calls.

Turnip/verso another acher over here! But mine is from carrying DD around when she?s upset, sitting down cuddles just don?t work, she demands to be walked around (I am scared about this when she?s bigger, she?s heavy enough at just 9lb3)

DD woke up just 5 minutes after I left her covered in poo, her priority is obviously not sleep. So I plopped her in the bath, which cheered her up and then we went for a walk round the village and she slept for the duration of the walk, but is now wide awake again ? how can a little one so adamantly not sleep?

JJ I hope the 11lb is true for you. It isn't for us. But between 11 and 7 he will normally wake up once which is quite nice. Last night he went to sleep at 11, woke at half 1 as some idiot set of some fireworks and then he slept until half 6.

Aargh should be downstairs helping DH with DCs but trying to catch up instead. Katie am sorry about your crash - how frightening. Hope it all gets sorted quickly.

And JJ/WG am now feeling bad that I even said I made a cake. Sometimes I think having children just makes you feel perpetually guilty - or maybe it's just me - whatever you do part of you thinks you should be doing something different (working/not working/picking them up/leaving them to cry/breast feeding/bottle feeding). So perhaps am neglecting DD in that I do seem to have so much more time to do other stuff than I did when DS was a baby. I think it's like arti says - DD is an easier baby and a bored toddler is a fearsome thing. So poor DD doesn't get much of an option other than to sit in the corner while we do other stuff. I had 2 minutes with her after lunch today just cuddling her and looking at her and she was beaming away and I felt bad for never really having the time to do just that.

So you can't freaking win. I also have perfectionist tendencies and had to accept that it's impossible to get it right - there is no such thing - no one is going to give you full marks or abstract proof that you've done a good job. You just hope that you're little ones grows up knowing they are loved and are kind and helpful people. I'm too tired to put this in the right way - all I mean to say is that you can spend so long thinking you're doing it wrong when as Sybil says just by being you - your baby's mother - you get it more right than anyone else. Or alternatively you feel bad becuase you've not been making cakes (or whatever), I feel bad becuase I have, we are both idiots and should instead be congratulating ourselves on having delivered lovely babies. And not giving a toss about anything else.

Also 11lbs not magic number for us I'm afraid. DS is 2 and a half stone and is only just regularly sleeping through.

More than that though - if you want cheering up look at the baby cakes on this. I woke DD up last night I was laughing so much.

Back later. Melt down all round....

Hello lovely ladies,

We're running out of room on this thread! Any ideas for a new title?

katie Sorry to hear about your crash. It must have been really scary.

Notquitesobig Nice to hear from you! Your twins are great weights!

DD only woke up once last night after previously only going for a maximum of 3 hours(usually 2) without a meal. I'm sure it is a one off but a bit of extra sleep has made me feel so much better. She was awake all the early evening and then watched a Sky +ed episode of Midsomer Murders. Perhaps the gentle 'Sunday night' type drama lulled her off to sleep

Right now she is determined not to sleep even though she is obviously tired.

JJ I've never heard the 11lb theory before. If that's the case, my two should have been sleeping through since birth, but unfortunately they didn't!

ZJ You're not a terrible mother at all. If your LO was in the slightest bit bothered by the poo then she wouldn't have gone to sleep.

NotQuiteSoBig Don't tell me that! The car is being picked up tomorrow but won't be assessed for at least a week, and I don'tget a courtesy car until they deem it repairable, and I won't get a courtesy car at all if it is a write-off, that means that I am stuck in the sticks with no means of transport at all for at least a week .

Katie don't listen to me, I'm sure it depends on the insurance company and their policies - hopefully yours is better than ours. [fingers crossed emoticon]

SL/JJ have you been going to the Rio?

NQSBB no the picturehouse in Cambridge.

No phone. I have had to claim on my insurance (I got special insurance on it as I know what I am like). Boo hoo, and I feel like such a wally.
Still at least it was only my phone I lost, not DS . (My friends used to make jokes years ago, that if I ever had kids, I would forget them and leave them on the bus, as I lost things so often). I haven't lost things for ages now, but I am finding it hard to not leave things places with all the stuff you have to carry associated with babies!

I have heard the 11lb theory too, well a friend said to me that they are meant to get "easier" when they get to 11lbs.

katie so sorry about your car. Don't accept your insurance co's first cash offer though, Battle with them to get as much as you can. My Dad had a real row with his and ended up wih much more than their initial offer.

Jump oh now I think I managed to not convey tone (the dangers of writing, not speaking) - didn't think you had jumped down my throat. Was just worried you thought I was being daft (you know like the people who say, don't let yourself go, let your life be ruled by your baby etc etc when OF COURSE it will be...at this point anyway...). You sound much cheerier, which is super.

Hmmmm the 11lb theory. Interesting. We have a pound and a bit to go here before that is possible. I live in hope!

ZJ I didn't know what ellipsis was either.... (ha ha....). I have a friend who writes really long text messages and does ellipses (is that the plural?) between every sentence. She seems singularly incapable of using a full stop. Cat might have to arrest her

How did ladyT and arti and ...mind gone blank...get on at Westfield?? Did they manage to get past the champagne bar without being lured in (envisages Child Catcher style person calling "Bollinger, Veuve Cliquot, Cristal....all freeeeeeee today" and them innocently traipsing into said Bar). I would have gone except I had 3 boring appointments here today (inc Henry the Mattress Doctor! he sucks all the dust mites out of the beds .... it is soooo gross to see what comes out).

We seem to be having a growth spurt here (either that or my supply has gone for a burton). Would it be possible to have one at 5 days plus 1? Does the fact that L was 6 days overdue make any difference (that makes it 6 weeks exactly). I have a vague memory of DS having his growth spurts early....hmmmm. Hope so. But she is sucking and sucking and there is nothing there.

Summer hope you find your phone! How annoying. Is it insured? What did you see, there is SOOO much I want to see in the pre-oscar season.

Verso - yes, in the Commune we will of course have hunky big masseurs to look after us! And occupational therapists to ensure we are sitting properly!!

Daisy that really really made me laugh.

lal I totally concur with what you are saying about motherhood. you can't do right no matter what you do! Now can't open cakes link...will try again. Think my puter is playing up.

DS is 13lb 9oz at 10 weeks and nowhere near sleeping through! How would he ever full his big tummy??

katie sorry about your accident but glad that everyone is okay which is the main thing

turnip I was the other possible champagne bar attendee! Sorry LadyT didn't get around to calling to make it over - it was all I could do to get out to the post office to send off passport. DS slept midnight until 0620! But woke with a dry nappy and I had a bit of a panic - fed and slept further2 and a half hours and still nothing!! Fed again and then he just destroyed his nappy twice!
GP have cocked up his 8 week appointment so will have it on Monday now after I told them how crap they were at not contacting me and taking the wrong paperwork when I registered.
Anyway Katie glad no-one got hurt - I wrote off my car in the US and got more for it than I paid for it! Hope it's not too long...
JJ Lovely photos - I think I'm going to get some done on canvas.
WG Stop giving yourself a hard time - it's not all smooth sailing for most of us by any stretch - you are doing great. For me - I just make it up as I go, and most of the time I question everything. Try not to worry about things (easier said than done I know) as I def believe the baby picks up on it if you are tense and it makes the problems escalate which I've learnt first hand. Veggie lovely - I watched that youtube of the breast crawl! he hasn't been as fussy today but it's not over yet...

Lal that cake wreck thing is hilarious, not good to look at whilst rocking a baby to sleep.

Kmp it's cool isn't it, we watch the video of the original research on it in my BfN helpers class and afterwards we we're all going aaashhhh how cute are those little people crawling up their mummies. Aparently if left they will get to the boob and attach in about 90 minutes, the doctor who did the research believes all mothers should be allowed 90 mins of skin to skin contact after birth if possible before the health professionals start poking and
proding. But they always seem hell bent on weighing.

I am sending ds2 british passport app off tomorrow KMP so we can see how long they take. Have you got the Aussie citizenship by decent yet?

Well no scones here but we did make scones, ds1 made them at nursery last week and has been obsessing about making them ever since so we did today and after having a nice healthy salad for lunch I managed to go and ruin it by polishing off 5 scones with jam, however I did refrain from butter or cream (the later because we didn't have any in the house). Ds2 is a bit better he slept well during the day and was perkier by the afternoon. Ds1 and had a picnic in the loungeroom with the scones and watched V+ music on demand for much of the afternoon. Somehow that doesn't feel as bad as just watching TV. We had a little cuddle moment because I put on the Sugarbabes- follow me home. I'm not a sugarbabes fan but that song came out when ds1 was a baby and one of the band members wrote it about the birth of her son, so I used to sing it to ds and we would slow dance around our livingroom in London to it. I heard it at a mother & baby yoga retreat I went to when he was 5 months old and it was lovely. I think I need to go to one with Jordy, just have to hit dh up for some cash to go on it as it's a but pricey.

We have made coffee cakes and iced them with sprinkles. We have also painted, coloured and stuck, so I feel like uber mummy. It won't last, we 'll be back in front of the TV again tomorrow after our crafty day.

JB, that cake thing is one of the funniest things I have seen in ages. Brilliant.

KAtie, very sorry about your crash, hope it all gets sorted soon and glad all OK.

WG, so glad you are feeling better. I often think with guests holding babies that the guests know that they can hand the baby back after a few minutes / hours and so it relaxes them enormously. We don't have that luxury and sometimes the utter relentlessness of being a mother gets one down. You are doing a grand job - you have kept DD safe, alive and most importantly happy for all her little life. That is not to be underestimated.

Arti and Lady T may still be MIA - hope the champers was good.

Turnip, I think it could be a growth spurt. I doubt your supply has diminished so I suspect L is just trying to enlarge the wine glass as it were.

KMP, hope the passport comes quickly. Is the trip home in a couple of weeks time now definitely off? If so, have you and DH thought about what you might do with his leave?

SL, bugger about the Iphone, hope it turns up.

Veggie, hello my lovely, how are you doing? I have seen the breastcrawl thing before and it's wonderful isn't it? I didn't have skin to skin with any of mine until I was out of theatre as I reacted badly to the anaesthesia and shook violently. However, I had hours with both DD2 and DS, just lying and feeding,k smelling their wonderful heads and feeling so glad that they were here safely. Those hours will live with me forever as some of the best I have ever felt. I am feeling rather emotional now so will have to go and snuggle my boy as I have barely seen him all day (we feed but don't have time for much else with the girls around Lal - hard, isn't it?)

Hello to anyone I've missed and love to everyone.

quick quick we need a new thread...no idea how to do it so somebody come along quickly...

maybe we should have a positive, affirming thread title, like "December 08 supermums - we're doing just fine and our LOs love us!" - just so that we get a reminder every time we log on!

Or maybe Lady T can come up with something amusing...

I can do it but I have no ideas at all.

am weeping with laughter over those cakes, esp the naked-fascist-mohawked-angels-on-carrots one

Sybs, I agree on the not seeing your baby thing, DS2 gets fed then plonked down most of the time. Another reason to like playgroups, I get to cuddle him while DS1 charges about.

Lovely to hear from NSBB - wow those babies are growing! I haven;t had DS2 weighed since being discharged from the HV (bad mummy), may wait till his 6 weeks check. He is getting bigger I reckon

Turnip: I was thinking of Il Pappagone on Blackstock Rd, next to La Porchetta (also good but gone a little downhill of late, also v v loud). Any ideas on dates?

Finally got round to getting a bouncy chair thingy for DS2 noe he is awake for more than 5 mins at a time, he sits there looking remarkably like a pissed-off Bond villain. Good job he doesn't have access to a piranha tank or we'd all be for it. DS1 amuses him on occasion and may be spared.

Here I have done it. I went with Trace's idea.

I am crap at this type of thing but what about:

December 2008 - the babes have bobbing heads, the mums are longing for their beds.

December 2008 - we all have our babies, now what do we do with them?