Dec 08 Mums - Happy New Thread, You Beauties!

[beans37]

Come join me....

That was meant to be a sad face, not all those.

And he went to flipping Ibiza.

Hey Rubes did you end up getting a car?

?You've lost me vag

rubes No, he never has the kids on his own! 2 years ago I went on a hen do (Sat & Sun). He went to my mums for the day, where she fed them, bathed them, he then put them in the car took them home and put them in bed. I am away for one night in April...he'll do the same again. Why? Because its bloody hard work!

And yes he went to Ibiza, I thought he deserved a break after all the work he had been doing.

You know what I'm going to run up a quick spreadsheet (I like Excel!), childcare costs, what I'm earning, what I'd need to earn for it to make the slightest bit of difference at this point in time!

Thats the thing I want to work more! But once DS is settled in school!

Wow. Unbelievable Deids. He needs to do it himSELF! That's out of order saying all that then having his mother take over when you (rarely) are away.
Dh has the kids on the odd day (Sunday then they're in nursery / Pre school Monday) but he does the lot, then after getting them to bed will sit up and work until midnight. (he prefers his mother not to come! But she sometimes insists) he also has to drop off and pick up tomorrow then kiddy handover at the airport the following day!

Ah Vag do you mean when the other car went kaput back in Oct? Yes we did get the car the following month - had planned to wait until this Summer but couldn't get to all the kids stuff (that you all know us mums do) etc without it as dh works too far and can't cycle at moment.

Dieds I have only one thing to say. KNOBJOCKEY!

Jam. thanks for gym info. Mine is offering 18.75 / month anytime all clubs except central London. Good deal then!

Dieds, he is a fucking prick. Vag has pretty much cover everything. I'd go away with your Mum for a week and make him do everything.

Yeah that car. We are really lucky with the cycle culture here otherwise we would definitely need a car to get the kids to all their after school stuff. That gym deal is really good. I was paying ?40 a month here for off peak only and had to pay a set up fee of ?80.

Will await your excel spreadsheet with interest. A little while back I had the opportunity to go for a job which would have had me on 44, 000. But as DS2 was only 2 & would need full-time nursery (which is super expensive here) & Ds1 would have needed wrap around care the amount that we would actually take home from that (I know it would come out of DHs pay too but for the purposes of looking at the monetary advantages over the non monetary loses I will look at it this way) was not worth the losses of time the boys would have at home & the fact that they would not he able to do any of the after school activities that they love.

Does that make sense.

Vag You are so right!!

Have just cobbled together a few figures and I need to earn about £400 a month more just to break even due to the increase in childcare (assuming I miraculously managed to find a position over the 3 days I work now). Work more days, more childcare, then factor in the difficulty in covering school holidays, not to mention uprooting DS from his pre school which given his temper would not be a good thing for him.

The knobjockey has just phoned...he said 'are you still not speaking to me?' I said nothing and hung up! God I am such a child.

Ok I have cooled down a little.

So his attitude must be coming form somewhere? It sort of sounds like it may have always been simmering under the surface in that he does little for the children himself and that sort of thing but still, I wonder what is making him feel that way? What about his colleagues? Do they have children? Is he perhaps a bit surrounded at work by people with more money, bigger houses, better holidays? Either because they had children but both had established careers and high incomes which they kept after children or because they just don't have children or only have one? It can be hard not to get the green eyed monster at times.

But he needs to recognise that if he wants the career, payrises and promotions then he can only do so if someone is facilitating his working and that either means paying someone to do it if you are working full time or it means having you do it.

It isn't just childcare either. With you working part time it means you can do the bulk of the housework. It means his clothes get cleaned and dried, it means his dinner is ready when he gets home late. If you went back to work full time would you also be paying a cleaner on top of a childminder or nanny? Similarly if you went back to work full time there would have to be an equal household chore split.

I'd get on with a spreadsheet but include all those other costs. Look at shopping, menu plans, slow cooker purchase if you don't have one to be able to have dinner ready when you get home. What length days would you be doing and therefore what length days would the children be doing in childcare? What time would they be getting home, eating and going to bed? (that part scares me, I reckon mine will be eating and sleeping an hour later than they currently do once I start uni). Factor in the detrimental effect that could have on family life and weekends if they are tired and crabby because they need ot catch up from the week. Draw up a simple housework rota and indicate what he would have to do. Eg my usual rota in the week has alternating hoover/dust and declutter/tidy plus of course days when bathroom or kitchen needs to be done. Typically one of us will hoover all the floors downstairs or fold the laundry while the other one does bath and bedtime with all 3 children so we can both sit down at the same time as each other in the evening. I think he needs to be presented with the whole picture. At the moment he seems to see more work=more money=better and he can't see that actually, even if there is a little more money it may be detrimental to family life to be working.

Not to make you feel like shit but jsut to back up that he is being totally unreasonable. My dh gets jealous at times, he would love to go skiing or have other nice holidays, eat out more than once a year or buy steak just because we want to rather than wait until a birthday to treat ourselves but the difference is he shakes it off because the life we have is the one we BOTH chose. I may have carried the children but he created them too. Oh and he does stuff with the children voluntarily, he has looked after then himself when I've been away (pre ds2 of course) and he will again when ds2 is weaned from the breast. On Saturday morning he took all 3 of them out tramping through the woods on an adventure just to give me some peace and quiet. No agenda, no complaining, no nagging, he just decided to go, got them in their wellies, stuck the baby in a sling and went.

Indith Its totally the green-eyed monster. Where he works they are very 'this is my new car', 'look at this house we're buying' 'where shall we go on holiday'. Alsolots of I bout my child x, y, and z this Christmas. Lots of women he works with work there PT and earn very good money. I think he thinks I could be earning that...not that I could do their job in a million years mind!! So good on em I say.

Re: the household chores etc. The bulk would still fall on me.

He is good with the children but he seems to think it has to be £££ on them all the time. When it doesn't!

It would never be worth me doing a normal job round ere. Even using 2 govt grant vouchers on 1 day with wrap around fees it's about £30 for the day. It'll be this then working from home for me. Childcare is highway robbery.
Vag how much? It came out all weird but might be just viewing on the iPhone app.

Good points Indith.
I'd tell him if you work full time (when the kids both at school) the housework / kids bathing etc gets split 50/50. What would his response be to that? Will be interested to hear.

Sorry Rubes I was in a bit of a huff. By the time we took into account childcare in all its forms (including holiday club) paying someone to take the boys to violin as that was not something I wanted them to give up. Taxes, losing my government allowance (I get ?2000 for being a unpaid mum) and a cleaner we would have been left with around ? 12, 000. I realise this is a lot of money, but it's not a lot to get paid to work 40 hrs a week and to end up with the boys having less time with their parents. We figured most of it would get taken up buying a car which we currently get by without and paying more for holidays as we would need to have more relaxing ones (ie not making the kids lunches every day and pay the extra to leave them at ski school over lunch and eating out every night because I would definitely not be cooking dinner on holidays)

Indith I know what you mean ski trips are very expensive but if you would be willing to drive to the slopes I can give you some tips on keeping costs down. Not going to the big resorts is a big reducer.

Thanks Vag. I know places we can go though, could probably blag a few beds in a chalet owned by another branch of the French family if we really planned ahead but it is all the other bits, the warm clothing purchase or hire, the ski hire, the passes, the petrol to get there. With the exception of last year and France holidays tend to be within around 4 hours drive max!

Doesn't matter though, in a little over 3 years I should be working too so there wil be more money around and having started young our children will be grown when we are still pretty young so we are just doing things the other way round and when our peers and colleagues are still up to their eyeballs in nappies and sleepless nights we will be spending the kids inheritance .

Ooooh, DB, I am so with you on DH rage, although things a bit better again yesterday. But yours is being so unreasonable. On the days you work, does he help getting the kids ready in the morning? Suspect not! Anyway, all been said more eloquently than I can. Although I did silly wonder about your comment on not still being married to DH if you didn't have the kids!

And Rubes, yes, I do tend to be meaner about DH on here than perhaps he deserves and don't always talk about how smashing he can be. Plus it's easier to remember the shit stuff than the nice! Par example, DB, I still remember how horrid your DH was to you after his Mum died. In fact, bore it in mind when Dad died, so tried to be nicer to DH than I often felt like being!

Anyway, on a positive note, the girls are being totally heavenly at the moment and am actually really enjoying their company. Suspect it's because term has started so I don't have to see them all day every day, and DH back at work, so no stress on trying to keep him busy too! And dog is being nice too, so life feeling a bit more normal and on an even keel. Just wish DD2 would sleep through now!

It was 3 months yesterday that Dad died. The significance didn't really hit me til this morning, but weirdly, last night I had the biggest bawl I've had for some time. And today I told Dad everything that's going on out loud. Felt a bit of a weirdo, but really enjoyed it!!

Wow, I'm boring myself! Girls are in the bath playing various octonaut toys while I do this. Need to finish Me Before You for book club on Friday. Have read it before, but am reminding myself. A jolly good twist on chick lit. Enjoying it! My other book club is next week and despite deciding on the book at my suggestion last September, I still haven't managed to read it. The God of Small Things. So beautiful, and have read it before, but I just don't seem to have the energy for it this time round!!

Yawn, sorry!

Jam, am interested in your NCT training thing.... Is it hard to do? It's definitely something I'd be interested in doing!

Ladies apologies for lack of catch ups but just a quick question: DD1 has several times recently (at night) suddenly got all hysterical and complained that her bottom hurts.. Judging by the way she grabs at it and wriggles its maybe an itch rather than a pain as such but can't see anything out of the ordinary.. It's more front bottom than back but not sure exactly as she's too busy wailing.. She has a tendency to total drama queen-ness with any ailment so don't think it's bad (she was absolutely fine all day at nursery) but any suggestions would be very welcome

Beans I love god of small things. I was going to suggest it for my bookclub but I resigned last month. The women in it were giving me the hump. They took it all a bit too seriously and if one liked and another didn't they could get quite catty with each other. Also I'm hopefully doing this course so will be a bit busy.

KP have you changed toiletries, bubble bath or something? Or could it possibly be worms? They do tend to irritate at night, I believe...

I think you are dealing with that anniversary in a very healthy way, Beans. I talk to DH still. In my mind.

Oh, DB..........I am so, so, SO infuriated for you. However, before we all start sticking pins in his effigy, I would just say though that his views are very commonplace, and a lot of people (not just blokes either!) just DO NOT understand what goes into being with littles at home (As well as doing all the effing householdy things). Tons of people don't! Sometimes DP thinks I have a lot more 'time' than I do though I can't complain as he is supportive of me being at home and doing whatever odd bits of freelance work I can glean - even though money is tight. I have so much to say on this topic but we are just about to have supper - but I just really wanted to add my voice to all the ladies have said above - doing what you do and working 15 hrs a week is brilliant! Once the anger has subsided I think you will simply have to blind him with the figures and stats. (Also - it's a recession - jobs are hardly growing on trees...) And remind him how EFFING lucky he is to have you! When the kids are both at school, doing more hours will be easier. Until then - he's got to suck it up. The posher holidays/house/car will have to come later on (same for us, and same for so many). Big hugs to you, hope you can batter a bit of sense into him.

More tomorrow - have been a busy bee today. DD2 is now COVERED in the cocking POX.

Oh lady not more pox. At least it's out of the way now, which I can say given that I am now out the other side!

Kiwi, has she been drinking plenty? DD had a phase of not drinking much at all and not wiping properly after going to the loo. She had a water infection. She never could quite articulate the pain just kept saying it was hurting and writhing about.

So DH is home. He reckons I have misunderstood him. He is hugely appreciative of what I do with the house kids etc. But he feels I could achieve more career wise. He says I should think about what I want to do when DS starts school. I'm not convinced and still fuming with him which he is well aware of. I will calm down but it's hard to give a shit when I'm not sure he actually appreciates anything I do!