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210 replies

CardyMow · 22/06/2010 13:13

Could they POSSIBLY hit low single income families worse? Freezing child benefit for 3 years, abolishing the Health in pregnancy grant from April 2011, Getting rid of the baby element on CTC (how that helps us when I'm 3 months pg and DP only earns £16,000 is beyond me...), Lowering the thresholds for Housing benefit (we won't be able to pay our rent without the money we get on housing benefit), saying that people in social housing may no longer have a reasonable housing benefit allowance or entitlemnet for a suitably sized property. I note that they are CUTTING tax rates for businesses. Nice to know that they are hitting the poorest of us that chose to work. We are now in the situation where we are really going to have to consider whether we can AFFORD for my DP to have the luxury of having a job when we will be so much worse off than we would be on benefits, I think we may end up homeless otherwise. It might make DP feel like more of a human being to go out to work and slog his guts out for £16,000 pa, but if we can't feed our kids and pay our rent....

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Remotew · 23/06/2010 18:11

If everyone only had children that they could afford the birthrate would drop dramatically then we would be stuffed in the future.

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SanctiMoanyArse · 23/06/2010 18:13

Well Riv- I didn't need to be told so LOL, I wouldn't vote for them if tehre were no otehr options!

2.7 million cuts to HB and DLA. I'm trying to find a palce at nursery after school for ds1 and if he hjits someone it won't be my fault, I have to make sure I can pay the bills. Starting to look afterwards is too late.

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SanctiMoanyArse · 23/06/2010 18:15

And LL it's all very well saying more cash to go around but we know that medical assessments of this kid work against people with non visible disabilities

ASD, MS, the list is huge.

That's not sepparating it down for the needy, it's being happy to discard the needy if tehy don't come with a big label saying :Look at me! I'm disabled'

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londonone · 23/06/2010 18:16

abouteve - do you feel the world is underpopulated then? That seems an odd view.

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claig · 23/06/2010 18:16

agree with abouteve

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londonone · 23/06/2010 18:17

sancti - that is a problem with the systems though, not with the principle

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SanctiMoanyArse · 23/06/2010 18:18

Londonone there isn't an answer to that debate; the world has too many people but in order tom miantain pensions and any vestige of a care system for odler people we have 2 choices- maintain birth rate or start comp[ulsory euthanasia! Which of the three would you rpefer, cutting pensions / care, or euthanasia I wonder?
Tough chocies indeed.

WRT to asd / DLA concersn JIC anyone thinks I am over reacting it ain't just me

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SanctiMoanyArse · 23/06/2010 18:19

LO it is a problem with the systems

The Coalition managed systems that they know this new rule brings in to play

The principle of tests is fine- but teh reality is not. And it is reality governments deal with, not principle.

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londonone · 23/06/2010 18:23

sancti - Then we should tackle the systems and as we have no idea how the new system will work it seems premature to judge it.

maintaining the birthrate will actually exacerbate the problem. I for one would rather supplement our workforce with immigration than simply fund more and more children.

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Remotew · 23/06/2010 18:23

Everyone is entitled to have children, it's a fundamental human right. Just because you can afford yours atm rather than rely on some help to get you through the early days doesn't mean you are more entitled, or your family more valid. Children need to be born to keep the economy going in the future. Governments should help with the bringing of them up because of this.

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londonone · 23/06/2010 18:25

Of course everyone is entitled to have children. It is my view that eveyone isn't entitled to have someone else pay for them Have as many kids as you like just don't expect the state to pay for them.

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londonone · 23/06/2010 18:27

there is no such thing as "governments" abouteve there is only money that people earn and/or generate and then pay in tax. The "government" has no funds it is simply the money of the people.

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claig · 23/06/2010 18:33

londonone, we are a society and we need the next generation to look after the current generation. There is a lot of propaganda about overpopulation in our country. It is elites who spread this myth, the same people who introduced the census to keep track of what they thought were the feckless masses who were increasing in number and might threaten the resources of the elite.

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londonone · 23/06/2010 18:37

claig - we are a small nation that is densely populated the population cannot continue to grow larger and larger. Or do you foresee the world population simply continuing to grow forever.

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SanctiMoanyArse · 23/06/2010 18:40

I though birthrate in UK was dropping?

I am trying to change the system londonone, just volunteered to help NAS campaign on this, but if we just shut up and campaugn quietly in teh background nothing will happen and possibly even mroe damaging the disabeld and carers will take ever bigger hits becuase the majority of people can close their eyes and think of it as soemthing that happens to otehr people.

fact: I did not ask for the boys to become disabled but cutting the money off won't mean a cure, just poverty at a depth I cannot quiite comprehend- certainly homeslessness to start with, and a move away from our community. That's something I dread and will shout about very loudly indeed.

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SanctiMoanyArse · 23/06/2010 18:41

There's something riven always says on here that I always remember (and am roughly paraphrasing):

if we want world population to fall we should enable the education of the worlds women, that is what limits births, not fairly random policies in tiny countries like ours.

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claig · 23/06/2010 18:43

I don't believe the doom mongers, the global warmers, the death and destruction peddlers. In Ancient Roman times they had a few who said that there was impending doom and it didn't happen. Then Malthus spouted the same lies and the ecologists and greens are inheritors of that tradition, many of these movements founded by the elite from Eton. Nature has a way of coping and providing its own solutions. The Kissingers et al. want to control nature, they want to decide who is overpopulated. They think they are worth more than us, they describe us as feckless scroungers. Don't believe them.

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londonone · 23/06/2010 18:44

TBH the whole birthrate thing is a bit of a red herring as people do not have children out of an altruistic desire to support society, they have them because they want to for themselves.

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SanctiMoanyArse · 23/06/2010 18:52

I've sat through endless debates on this at Uni and you know what, there is no answer (that happens a lot LOL- refers to my post on international aid therad as well )

It may be that humanity has no effect on global warming and the guy who solves any resource issues is due to be sixth kid of someone.... or that we will run out and all die.

On a personal level, should I die tomorrow completeing my family left me personally fulfilled mfamily wise and I woudl not regret it for a second.

Prety muche verything I do ahs soemone elses benefit on teh end of it: am having to reel in teh SEN advice I give as the pot shrinks on DH's request, spent time nursing, guiding, charity sector....... but you have to do the things to make yourself happy too. DFor some that's big holidays with carbon costs and otehrs jumping out of ;alnes at the cost to the NHS.... for me it was my family, and as it happens ds4 seems (fingers tightly crossed) the only totally NT one so there may even be a societal benefit in that he may choose to help ds1 / ds3, and pay tax towards ds3's care. It aslo emans I am experienceing a worry free toddlerfhood for the first time and whilst that's not a right, neither is it much to ask tbh.

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susie100 · 23/06/2010 18:53

OP you seem to have ignored the few intelligent posts that outline the changes and how it seems you would actually be better off.

Also you state why could they not raise tax for those who earn over £100,00 to 50%? THEY HAVE.

I think from the tone of your posts you have a real sense of entitlement which is depressingly common. YOU and your DP are reponsible for your children. Having 4 children is something only the very rich or the very poor comtemplate.

Especially with all your health problems and chidren's health problems, what were you thinking?

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tartyhighheels · 23/06/2010 19:04

Lots of people have posted informed comment on your predicament (which you constantly blame on anything else but yourself, and let's face it you do have some part in it) and with this in mind, I think I might be subscribing to the 'shut the fuck up' school of psychology here OP but really, even faced with the facts you bleat on and on.

You voted for them and now you have them, so stop being a whiney bitch and suck it up.

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claig · 23/06/2010 19:09

I think Loudlass is just venting some steam. No harm in that.

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IngaLand · 23/06/2010 20:40

Bloody hell, there are some nasty people on this thread. Listen to yourselves. Do you speak to people like that in RL? Horrible.

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CardyMow · 23/06/2010 20:53

I have realised my mistake in voting tory. And Sancti....the medical assessments may well hurt ME personally....unless I happen to have a seizure in front of the medical assessor, I may not have my DLA renewed. And to tartyhighheels, I'm not being a 'whiny bitch', I thought the whole point of MN was to have somewhere to vent about your worries etc?

I sincerely hope that those of you who are saying that having the first 3 of my dc's is wrong, when I wasn't in this situation then, never find yourselves in a situation where you are no longer able to support your family for reasons outside of your control. (Like being diagnosed with epilepsy, or having an SN child or 2)

While, yes, I am inclined to agree that it is not the most financially prudent thing for me to be pregnant again, the fact that this is my first contraception failure in almost 7 years surely says that I have been trying to be careful? And as I will definately be getting sterilised after this baby (through choice), I fully intend to enjoy my new baby.

No, I didn't read the leaflet on the pill as a teenager, my foster carer handed me the pill each morning, I wasn't allowed to hold onto my own medication back then. And I honestly don't remember what it was like to live under a tory government in the past.

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IngaLand · 23/06/2010 21:43

Loudlass, I think you have been talked to in a disgusting manner on this thread. Some really low remarks. Hope those posters are proud of themselves for coming accross as nasty, scummy people.

Just dont ever vote Tory again!

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