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Politics

Is Matt Goodwin correct about this?

195 replies

molanasulfi · 22/03/2026 09:52

Is professor Matthew Goodwin right that that middle-class leftists are so angry at Brexit, because it is the first time they have lost a major thing and it infuriates then to see the working class get one over on them?

OP posts:
BIossomtoes · 23/03/2026 09:41

By making being on benefits more lucrative than work. They’re not.
By taxing people who do work so heavily that people are working less so as to avoid the higher punitive tax rates. Tax rates are exactly the same as they were before the 2024 election.
By discouraging working to pass on assets to family after death. Inheritance tax is exactly the same as under the Tories.
By wrecking family farms succession. By taxing farmers less than the rest of us on inheritance.
By incentivising people on benefits by giving them huge discounts to entertainments which many working people cannot afford (today's report in the Telegraph). I’ll believe that when you can link to a less biased source.
By increasing ENI which means it is too expensive for many business owners to grow their business and employ more than 4 people including themselves. How many businesses does this apply to?

BIossomtoes · 23/03/2026 09:45

Dymaxion · 23/03/2026 09:39

By incentivising people on benefits by giving them huge discounts to entertainments which many working people cannot afford (today's report in the Telegraph).

I can't access the Telegraph online, can you describe the article in a bit more detail ? What entertainments are they discounting ?

I’ve just scanned today’s Telegraph - no sign of this report.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 09:49

Dymaxion · 23/03/2026 09:39

By incentivising people on benefits by giving them huge discounts to entertainments which many working people cannot afford (today's report in the Telegraph).

I can't access the Telegraph online, can you describe the article in a bit more detail ? What entertainments are they discounting ?

Well, since you asked so nicely using the magic words....

Whipsnade and London Zoos 75% off.
Cutty Sark £14 for four people (usually £60)
Kew £1/person (usually £59.50 for a family of 4)
50% off train tickets to the attractions

Asylum seekers are included in the beneficiaries.

Big discounts are also extended to those who work for tbe public sector, including civil servants who work in the Environment Agency.

Obviously these discounts are funded by higher prices for the rest of us.

BIossomtoes · 23/03/2026 09:51

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 09:49

Well, since you asked so nicely using the magic words....

Whipsnade and London Zoos 75% off.
Cutty Sark £14 for four people (usually £60)
Kew £1/person (usually £59.50 for a family of 4)
50% off train tickets to the attractions

Asylum seekers are included in the beneficiaries.

Big discounts are also extended to those who work for tbe public sector, including civil servants who work in the Environment Agency.

Obviously these discounts are funded by higher prices for the rest of us.

Can I have a link, please? I’m a subscriber so it will work for me. 😌

Dymaxion · 23/03/2026 09:54

I don't think being on benefits is more lucrative than working ? DH receives a benefit that is approx. £90 a week, this is a huge drop from his previous working income.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 09:55

BIossomtoes · 23/03/2026 09:51

Can I have a link, please? I’m a subscriber so it will work for me. 😌

Voila!

Why do civil servants and the jobless get so many discounts?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/03/22/why-do-those-dependent-on-the-state-get-so-many-discounts/

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 09:56

Dymaxion · 23/03/2026 09:54

I don't think being on benefits is more lucrative than working ? DH receives a benefit that is approx. £90 a week, this is a huge drop from his previous working income.

I think there's been a lot in the news about this. Particularly recently re the 2 child benefit cap. Have a look.

Itsmetheflamingo · 23/03/2026 10:01

Benefits are only ever lucrative to low earners, which isn’t the same as being working class.

i don’t see the problem with people on benefits getting reduced entry to attractions- this has always happened and doesn’t increase prices for everyone else.

BIossomtoes · 23/03/2026 10:48

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 09:55

Voila!

Why do civil servants and the jobless get so many discounts?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/03/22/why-do-those-dependent-on-the-state-get-so-many-discounts/

OK, I’ve read it. Why are you blaming the government for non government bodies offering discounts? Even the extremely biased author of the article didn’t do that.

DrMickhead · 23/03/2026 11:00

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 08:35

Just going along with the parallel discussion this thread seems to be having, how do you define yourself as "working class"? What job do you do.

The most typical of WC jobs! I was a care assistant in my local nursing home. I am now a carer for my son. My husband works with young adults who have behavioural issues who are in-between homes. It’s like £1 above minimum wage. Prior to that he was working in Tesco but he hated the amount of people he dealt with daily, so then he became a builders mate, making tea and moving shite around and realised he was definitely not the type of bloke who enjoys the company of other men. At all. He lasted a few months and found this job. He loves it. I loved mine, I truly did, I loved my residents, my colleagues, I even loved my manager. I pop back now and again to sit with the residents and see everyone but it’s rare I have the time. By the time my DC is in supported living, I’ll probably be too old to be caring on the floor again so I’ll apply for a job doing activities coordinating.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 13:09

BIossomtoes · 23/03/2026 10:48

OK, I’ve read it. Why are you blaming the government for non government bodies offering discounts? Even the extremely biased author of the article didn’t do that.

Well Kew is owned by the state for a start. Or is at least sponsored by the state.

Its just part of the general culture of this country. Free stuff. Don't reward the workers, reward those that live off the work of others or haven't contributed to society in the case of asylum seekers. It acts as an incentive to not work and goes against the concept of fairness. That's my own personal view obviously. I work very hard, employ people and am shafted by the tax man for very little of decent standard in return. I would like to take my family to these attractions but cannot take time off work and cannot afford it.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 13:11

Itsmetheflamingo · 23/03/2026 10:01

Benefits are only ever lucrative to low earners, which isn’t the same as being working class.

i don’t see the problem with people on benefits getting reduced entry to attractions- this has always happened and doesn’t increase prices for everyone else.

Of course it increases prices for the rest of us. How do you think discounts are funded? Are we really still believing in the magic money tree?

Work should lead to treats. Not not working.

catinateacup · 23/03/2026 13:17

No - many of us (whether middle-class or not) are angry about Brexit because it was clearly an economically and historically ill-informed and counterproductively stupid thing to do. No class envy bollocks here. Just anger at its needless stupidity, which has hobbled our economy, politics, culture and defence and will negatively affect us for decades to come.

Plus, I cannot stand lies. The Brexiteers knowingly admit their entire campaign was built on lies, from the crappy NHS bus to Johnson’s columns to Farage’s racism. No decent political project is founded in lies and voted for by the gullible.

TopPocketFind · 23/03/2026 13:37

Goodwin has just released his latest book

https://thecritic.co.uk/suicide-of-an-authors-credibility/

BIossomtoes · 23/03/2026 13:57

Kew Gardens is a charity. Over 50% of its income is self generated. Letting a few people in with a discount is unlikely to have any effect on its finances.

Itsmetheflamingo · 23/03/2026 13:58

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 13:11

Of course it increases prices for the rest of us. How do you think discounts are funded? Are we really still believing in the magic money tree?

Work should lead to treats. Not not working.

Well I know how they’re funded,it’s part of my profession to know such things

Pricing is never as simple as “we have reduce 100 tickets by £5, add £5 onto the other 100 tickets we sell” fixed costs need to pay paid whether 2 tickets are sold or 20.

it’s really no different to any other discount. Do Kellogg tokens increase the prices at theme parks? Tesco club card points? Senior citizen discount?

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 14:02

Itsmetheflamingo · 23/03/2026 13:58

Well I know how they’re funded,it’s part of my profession to know such things

Pricing is never as simple as “we have reduce 100 tickets by £5, add £5 onto the other 100 tickets we sell” fixed costs need to pay paid whether 2 tickets are sold or 20.

it’s really no different to any other discount. Do Kellogg tokens increase the prices at theme parks? Tesco club card points? Senior citizen discount?

Well I don't know what profession you are in obviously so I will have to take your word for you knowing such things.

If you are discounting fees for vast numbers of people including civil servants and have fixed costs, those costs have to be paid by fewer people. Those people will need to pay more to fund the non payers. Typical Britain.

Itsmetheflamingo · 23/03/2026 14:12

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 14:02

Well I don't know what profession you are in obviously so I will have to take your word for you knowing such things.

If you are discounting fees for vast numbers of people including civil servants and have fixed costs, those costs have to be paid by fewer people. Those people will need to pay more to fund the non payers. Typical Britain.

No, it’s about utilising spare capacity. It’s done for everything where you can fit more people/ revenue in at incremental cost.

Theatres, even universities. Once you’ve paid for the building and the teacher, you may as well cram as many students in as you can, even if some are at discounted fees.

Theyreeatingthedogs · 23/03/2026 14:26

NotDavidTennant · 22/03/2026 10:13

He was the Reform candidate in the recent by-election.

Ah, that explains it. Another right wing loony!!!

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 15:00

Itsmetheflamingo · 23/03/2026 14:12

No, it’s about utilising spare capacity. It’s done for everything where you can fit more people/ revenue in at incremental cost.

Theatres, even universities. Once you’ve paid for the building and the teacher, you may as well cram as many students in as you can, even if some are at discounted fees.

I think the point in the article is that these government bodies or charities even are incentivising people who don't work and/or don't contribute. Why not give the treats to people who work for low wages but aren't on benefits? Or people who work in the private sector for example rather than civil servants who are already paid well by tax payers and who have mostly better pensions than the private sector worker. Plenty of people in the private sector would love to take their family to one of these attractions but can't afford to.

This country is infuriating at the moment with this bovine largesse to anyone that holds their cap out. It's creating a weak society reliant on the work or money of others which we can ill afford in the world as it is at the moment.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 15:02

Theyreeatingthedogs · 23/03/2026 14:26

Ah, that explains it. Another right wing loony!!!

As opposed to all the left wing loonies we have at the moment, mostly in government.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 15:03

BIossomtoes · 23/03/2026 13:57

Kew Gardens is a charity. Over 50% of its income is self generated. Letting a few people in with a discount is unlikely to have any effect on its finances.

Thats not really the main point of the article though. Look..I get it. Treats for all the people will a bit of time on their hands during the day. Or who work for the state.

TopPocketFind · 23/03/2026 16:14

I'll take left wing loonies over right wing racists any day

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 16:34

TopPocketFind · 23/03/2026 16:14

I'll take left wing loonies over right wing racists any day

Really? I suppose neither are ideal, given the left wing anti semitism.

TopPocketFind · 23/03/2026 16:36

Pineneedlesincarpet · 23/03/2026 16:34

Really? I suppose neither are ideal, given the left wing anti semitism.

You can back up that claim of left wing anti semitism?