Gorton and Denton, what have you done?

[Imdunfer]

You have elected as an MP to stand in the UK&NI parliament a person who said in a panel interview with Annabel Tiffin from BBC Northwest Tonight that the Manchester Arena bombing was caused by people sewing division by questioning immigration.

That statement is so outrageous I don't even know where to start.

How do you feel about Reform sending out leaflets in Wales which are only in English?

I listed things she worked on.
You just don't like my answers. Up to you.

I wouldn't engage with someone who wrote 'I expect you to list them' either.
Plenty like Kemi, and her popularity is growing.

She wasn’t closely involved in the Post Office Horizon) bill, she just attended debates. She was more involved in the other two and the CPTPP is probably her best known and substantive achievement. She also wasn’t secretary to the treasury (which is the chancellor), she was a junior minister during Covid. I think it’s a valid question though why you find her achievements persuasive. I personally don’t find KB that impressive, although she’s grown on me of late. I liked the way she stitched up Jenrick and she is very smooth at accepting criticism.

Working on isn’t achieving. However it’s obvious that you can’t name anything she’s achieved so it’s pointless engaging with you.

The election observers , Democracy Volunteers, who reported this did not alert polling staff in any of the polling stations in which they claim this took place. The polling staff did not witness any events themselves. They would have been able to react if informed at the time. There was a police presence in all polling stations throughout the election. Any breaches of the law could have been acted on if reported at the time. And the votes could have been challenged and cancelled.

Electoral Calculus, a well-known, respected and independent polling predictions organisation, have questioned the methodology used by Democracy Volunteers in calculating the percentage of illegal voting.

Even assuming the figures quoted by Democracy Volunteers are accurate, the amount of illegal family voting would not have affected the outcome if all those votes were cancelled. The Greens would still have a majority of thousands. Many informed observers have stated that family voting is a grey area, and hard to define, unless another party accompanies the voter into a covered ballot booth.

There is a post earlier in the thread from someone complaining that the polling booth was a table with a cardboard partition. Easy to see how a family, maybe unacustomed to voting, had moved towards a similar table set up, giving the impression they were going to vote in unison. And recorded as family voting.

Which is all waffle. The mathematical facts of the matter is that the voters of Gorton and Denton rejected Reform by a stunning majority. Even if all the "disputed" votes were discounted.The idea that Farage is claiming that the election was stolen, and is supported by sections of the media, is an attack on British democracy itself, and the British voting public. The Mail was the paper that supported Hitler, up to the eve of World War Two. I personally would prefer to wait for the findings of the Police investigation. Which is being supported by Zach Polanski. The leader of the Green Party.

Maybe the fact that the loser of the election is saying it's been stolen, despite the evidence to the contrary, is a confirmation of why the voters of Manchester obviously distrust him and his party.

No, they are fine as far as they go. What did she achieve though? How far did she get, for example, with the recommendations of the Jay report when she was Women and Equalities Minister?

because working on Acts that get passed isn't achieving anything?
This is so bizarre 😂

Lots of people work on them. Did she lead?
In my own work I’ve ’worked on’ projects but I wouldn’t claim them as my achievements unless I’d been the lead or contributed something well out of the ordinary.

I’m assuming you understand how legislation is drafted? Many government lawyers and civil servants will be the ones drafting it and checking it. The Minister or SoS will set the direction and the CS/GLD will tell them what exists and what route to take - primary or secondary legislation, what’s legal, what’s viable etc Do you rate all of them as highly as KB for working on two Acts of Parliament?

someone has a bee in their bonnet about the Jay report......why don't you just be honest about what you think about that and say it instead of dancing round my post - moving from what has she done, to what has she LED on, to what has she 'achieved'. Spit it out.

Your mum - hey Cardiback, what did you do today?

You - well we've all been really working hard on the Post Office Act - the Horizon Scandal, and the Act got passed today! It quashes everyone's convictions!

Your mum - meh, but what have you really achieved?

Unbelievable.

Yep enjoy your evening instead @pineapplecrushed

It's alright, pineapple already told me she doesn't want to engage with me any further, and I will respect that.

I shall lower my expectations.

@pineapplecrushedthere’s a point where engaging on Kemi posts isn’t worth it, they’re going to dislike her regardless of what you say.

Outside mn she’s picking up supporters and Starmer is losing them so I wouldn’t worry too much about it.

It's interesting that in your original post you are so anti-Green Party, but what you wish for in this post aligns with their views so well!

While I don't agree with somethings that are The Green Parties official policies, in my view they got in because more people were in the "anybody but Farrage and co" group than any other consideration. So people chose the candidate they thought could best stop Reform.

a couple of days before the vote I saw an opinion poll putting Greens on 30%, Reform and Labour both 28%. A second poll asked if any of those asked would be willing to vote tactically. Only the Labour voters said they would.

Why?
Most swimming pools have unisex changing rooms, unisex toilets are common now

I just can't help but lol at this.

If it was sectarian Reform would have won.
There are a larger than average number of South Asian and Muslim voters in the constituency bút they are still the minority. There are also areas which are more affluent and white. But there is a very large white working class population who are disillusioned with Labour.

Reform.are arguing that a lot of the Muslims in the area voted Green in response to Gaze and that "beat" the white working class Reform vote. But while it is likely a lot of Muslims voted Green, so did lots of white people. Because the Greens wouldn't have won otherwise.

If it's true that a lot of votes were a response to Gaza then that's not ”sectarian" voting. It's single issue voting. And the reality on the ground is likely to be more complicated than that any way because it always is. (Muslims can care about cost of living, housing and bins as much as anyone else).But even in single issue voting - you have a gay man of Jewish heritage, a white working class woman and some Muslims who all object to the same thing. Maybe they are wrong, maybe they are right. But it's not sectarian it's the exact opposite.

What they are really mad about is that the left behind working classes didn't do as they were supposed to and vote for them.

I don't mind unisex changing rooms if there are individual cubicles. I'm less keen on unisex toilets because a lot of men are gross. But the point of my post was to say that I don't want men in any single sex environments, regardless of how they might "identify".

Ironically the labour supporters didn't need to vote tactically. If you shift votes around between Labour and the Greens one of them always wins. But I think people expected the results to be much closer than they were.

so we are now on 'did she lead?'

sounds to me like you wouldn't accept her 'achieving' anything unless she was the sole person doing it - which of course isn't the case in any government.
Getting the post office convictions quashed was heroic - Hollinrake himself said that he approached her to intervene to get things moving and as a result of her input he backed her leadership bid.

But I get it. You don't like her. Could have just said that.

Excellent post, thank you.

I’m not sure what you mean here, one of them won’t always win in say the local elections coming up.

I worked for Manchester Council 20 years ago and they were making leaflets in different languages back then. There were something like 27 languages spoken across the council, and leaflets produced for the most common.

I'm a little confused as to the outrage around this, doesn't it just make sense that if you want people to understand your message, write it in a language they can read? It wasn't ALL the leaflets solely in Urdu 🤣