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Original poster

Second EU referendum. How would you vote?

250 replies

JasAnglia94 · 11/07/2017 19:09

Sorry if this has been asked before.

I hear this statement made over and over again - that people would "vote differently if we had a EU referendum today". Would you though? Hmm

I was REALLY on the fence re. the referendum. I'm 23 and from a comfortable middle-class background.

In short, I think there is a surplus of people competing for jobs - both at graduate and service level - and that the situation is exasperated by free movement. I also think the problem of housing is made worse by free movement; that there isn't enough housing for people at the middle-lower end of the pay scale and that the number of people in this bracket is ever increasing.

However, I voted to remain last minute (after much persuasion). This was due to economic and environmental reasons. I don't trust the current government with environmental policy and I don't think price rises and fewer jobs (or jobs at lower pay) will help people like me. Confused

Would I vote differently now? No. However, I would definitely be more on the remain side than the leave (e.g. my shopping bill depresses me!). Sad

Was anyone else who was on the fence vote differently now?

OP posts:
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Peregrina · 15/09/2017 12:04

And if the vote had been Remain, which was the status quo, Farage for one said that it would be unfinished business. No talk of OK we lost, we'll move on.

And I'll not take any lectures about patriotism when a one off advisory Referendum is seen to trump Parliamentary democracy, thanks.

Sandycarrots · 15/09/2017 12:05

I think having loyalty to your country means desperately wanting what is best for it. Therefore, I would vote remain.

Jumping off a cliff won't be made better by holding hands when taking the leap!

SleepFreeZone · 15/09/2017 12:06

Leave.

purits · 15/09/2017 12:07

We had a referendum in 1975 with a very clear vote to remain. Why didn't the Leavers let that go?

Because:
a) I am so old that I am nearing retirement age but I wasn't old enough to vote in 1975. That decision was made a looooong time ago
b) because in 1975 it was the EEC / Free Trade, which I am happy with. In 2017 it was the EU / Single Market which is an entirely different thing. Did you hear yesterday when they were coming out with the Ever Closer Union stuff again. The EU is all about mission creep.

TheElementsSong · 15/09/2017 12:15

I love this thread. Fills me with nostalgia for June 2016, because it's exactly like posts from June 2016 Grin

We won, you lost, shut up, get over it...
Get behind your country and pull together...
Unpatriotic moaning...
Stop talking the country down...
They need us more than we need them...
EU bullies, dictators, unelected...
Sovereignty and democracy...

and of course

Nobody has a crystal ball...

ironically often in conjunction with

The EU will fall apart following our lead!

Viviennemary · 15/09/2017 12:16

In 1975 the vote was on a free trade agreement. Not moving towards a federal Europe. Big difference.

Peregrina · 15/09/2017 12:20

Since when was taking an interest in Politics unpatriotic, especially one where we want to protect Parliamentary Democracy, which has been our system for many years?

Why should I get behind people like Farage, Johnson, Gove, Fox, Redwood, who are all wealthy men, and whose money will shield them from austerity? I don't see them making any plans for investment in the regions, to bring good quality work there. I don't see them championing the NHS and bending over backwards to find money for it. Why is calling them out on their hypocrisy 'unpatriotic'?

Violetparis · 15/09/2017 12:24

Would still vote remain but despite my huge concerns about leaving I don't believe another referendum will happen and don't think it should happen unless millions of leave voters show that they have changed their minds or are unhappy with the negotiations.

All the calls for a second referendum are coming from Remainers and I just don't agree with having further referendums to get the 'right result'. The working classes and women fought and died for the right to vote and it just doesn't sit right with me to admire that and then try and change a vote that didn't go the way I hoped.

Peregrina · 15/09/2017 12:25

I was old enough to vote in 1975. There was no detail about Free Trade on the ballot paper. The 2016 referendum didn't have any questions about moving or not towards a Federal Europe either, or European Armies or Turkey gaining Entry, or 'Sovereignty' - this last is a pity, because it seems that we could be throwing this away.

Theworldisfullofidiots · 15/09/2017 12:47

It's amazing though. Twitter is full of people who said they voted remain but would now vote leave. If you have a look at their twitter feed they are quite clearly lying Hmm.
Why lie?
If leave is so brilliant why lie? (And why lie so blatantly in the campaign.
Brexit is quite clearly disaster capitalism.
I cannot see why anyone thinks leaving is good.

SleepFreeZone · 15/09/2017 12:57

Theworld I'm afraid IMO the European Union will not continue. It will exist for a short time, perhaps 5 years, perhaps 10, but there will be another worldwide recession and countries such as France and Germany will not continue to prop up countries such as Greece and Italy. They will leave them to their refugee problems and will go it alone as the people will vote that way.

There are going to be very turbulent times ahead. Global warming is happening right now, there is going to be millions of displaced people in the future and I can see a battening down of the hatches.

Peregrina · 15/09/2017 13:02

I don't believe in Refernda either and I hope, like Germany, we ban them.

However, how do you decide what people really want? In the last GE many people were voting on the local issue of getting more money for road improvements, which the previous MP had promised but constantly failed to deliver on. In the Witney by election last Autumn the closure of a local surgery (because two of the partners were retiring, nothing to do with floods of immigrants), was a big local issue.

PsychoPumpkin · 15/09/2017 13:05

I was Remain & still am.

Flyingflipflop · 15/09/2017 13:11

If there was a second vote, what would people be voting for? To leave as we are, to remain on the terms we had with the EU before June last year or for closer integration?

Theworldisfullofidiots · 15/09/2017 13:18

SleepFreeZone everything you described is all the reasons to work together. I believe the only way forward is to cooperate and work in partnership.
It feels like we are moving to be a nationwide version of Morton Vasey.

Peregrina · 15/09/2017 13:19

One would hope that Parliament would do a better job, of a) defining the questions, and b), put out some proper information about the decisions which needed to be made, and c) ban false or empty statements like the £350 million a week for the NHS.

Violetparis · 15/09/2017 13:19

Think it is very difficult, if not impossible to know what the majority of people want. Unless millions of people take to the streets over an issue then who knows for sure, because this hasn't happened and also because the Lib Dems didn't do great in the election I am presuming most people have accepted the result whether they like it or not.

Theworldisfullofidiots · 15/09/2017 13:20

Royston Vasey!

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 15/09/2017 13:25

Flying if we were to remain now, - say we had another vote - we would be in for a far closer union imo. Juncker has that sole aim. Expand Schengen, expand the number of countries using the euro, expand the number of countries in the Eu. Have one president overseeing the whole thing. European army etc etc

Peregrina · 15/09/2017 13:25

I suspect for most people, it's the day to day issue which matter most to them - will they be able to buy a house, will they get a school place they are happy with? I suspect a significant number haven't given Brexit a thought since. I would love to know approximately how many voted on the basis of giving two fingers to Cameron/Osborne and their austerity package, but it's not a piece of research that the Tories will commission in a hurry - although if they want to gain traction with younger voters they need to. I don't doubt that Corbyn's surprisingly good showing had something to do with anti-austerity.

Violetparis · 15/09/2017 13:32

Peregrina agree most people don't give Brexit a second thought and are probably bored to tears with it all.

Peregrina · 15/09/2017 13:34

We had opt outs for Schengen and the Euro. We would have a vote on whether to allow other countries access. Juncker will be gone within a couple of years. No plans for a European army, although France and the UK already co-operate in that respect and May is likely to want to keep that.

MyNewHobbyIsGin · 15/09/2017 13:36

Pensioniata

MyNewHobbyisGin.........I think you have been drinking to much gin.

Why?

purits · 15/09/2017 13:38

There have been plenty of attempts at European empires over the years and they always eventually fail.

Flyingflipflop · 15/09/2017 13:53

Peregina

We had opt outs. I'm not sure we would keep those.

I also think an EU army is likely. Defence spending gets ever more expensive and most EU countries have shown an unwillingness to commit those resources. I actually think Trump was right when he questioned why Germany and such like aren't spending but relying on the US to prop up NATO.

As I said before, I voted remain but whilst I wanted to remain in the EU, I didn't want ever closer integration. Looking back, I actually think we were in an unsustainable position. On the periphery but not actually part of the club. We either jumped further in or withdrew.

The die has been cast and we have to withdraw.