Lily Philips - can she be a 'true' Christian?

[mids2019]

https://www.premierchristianity.com/opinion/lily-phillips-has-been-baptised-i-pray-its-accompanied-by-change/20772.article

This article made me think about what it means to be Christian especially about the concepts of sin, judgment and redemption.

In my view Lily of course is a Christian being baptised but to not give up a lucrative adult film career possibly does cause angst amongst more traditional Christians.

We are taught not to judge 'Let those without sin cast the first stone' and to accept the universal unconditionally of forgiveness. (We pray every day about the forgiveness of sin) so it is difficult thologically to condemn others.

However does any fellow Christian need to remind Lily she makes money from a profession where many women with less choice are coerced and manipulated for thr gratification of men? Wr have moved away from a less judgmental Christianity but how do you view participation in Christian life with such a job?

I don't know what will happen to her so I can only reply generally.
If one is seen to be a believer and has their name in the Book of Life they will get eternal life. If they have conditions where they are afflicted they will pass from them in time.

Revelations 21:4
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away."

If someone does not receive eternal life the Bible says that they will be judged and seen as an unbeliever. The Bible says that the unbelievers will undergo a second death and will have no part in the kingdom of God (Revelations 21:8) and that hell awaits them.

Come on, @RedTagAlan -- you know @Justmerach's typical responses from other threads. She googles, and pulls up random websites, 'sermons' etc without the remotest capacity for evaluating her sources, and your (perfectly valid) questions are not going to make her able to think clearly about her religions beliefs, the text they're supposedly based on etc.

And what happens to her if she does not ?

Yup. I am not trying to de-convert anyone though. Or even to get them to question their faith, whatever it is.

I want to know what the individuals think. The same individuals incidentally, who would like to see everyone else live under their system.

You keep adding more and more into this instead of just answering the question. Why can't you just give straight answer ?

@RedTagAlan I want to know what the individuals think.

No you don't. You just want to pull peoples' ideas to bits and deride their belief systems. You repeatedly put posters down because they can't come up with the "proof" you want for God or the format of answer you want.

The same individuals incidentally, who would like to see everyone else live under their system.

Don't lump me in with your erroneous train of thought. (I've no idea where that stupid idea came from) I couldn't give two flying bollocks what other people believe or don't believe, it doesn't affect me and isn't my responsibility.
We live in a free society and religion is not compulsory in UK., neither is non-religion.

I think you are obsessed with this and just want to pick an argument about it. Maybe you've got too much time on your hands ?

The same individuals incidentally, who would like to see everyone else live under their system.

Christians would like to see people saved and have eternal life, not 'live under their system' !

There are the far right parties that want Britain to be more Christian. Does that count as wanting others to live under their rules ? I think so.

As for the rest of your attack.... is this Christianity in action?

And how would you know what "Christianity in action" was/is ?

And how is one saved ?

Can one be saved if they reject the Christian system ?

Are you not demonstrating it ?

Or are you just here to defend a belief system you don't believe in ?

You will not be saved if you reject Christ's offer of redemption. He is the only one who will save you. There's no 'Christian system'. Once Jesus returns as King then He will rule over His Kingdom with an iron rod. Those who do not bow the knee to His authority will not live in that Kingdom. This is talked about in Revelation 2:27 and Revelation 12:5. He will exercise His divine authority and evil will not be permitted.

I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about and I don't think you do either.

But that's your system. You think there's a supernatural deity who is bizarrely hands-off about the welfare creation on a day to day basis, but nonetheless monitors everyone's behaviour to see if they get eternal damnation or 'eternal life'. That's your worldview and 'system'.

Not believing in any of it, despite/because of growing up in a devoutly Christian household in a devoutly Christian society, I don't think any of that is any more than a farrago of delusions cooked up by a pre-science society with a fear of death, a sense of vague dissatisfaction with contemporary Judaism, and an understandable longing for freedom from Roman colonisation.

Jesus was one of the many little local messiahs who emerges from Second Temple Judaism. He just lucked out on PR after his death, with the ghastly but effective Paul and a cadre of very committed believers that led to Christianity being adopted by the Roman empire after Constantine's conversion, and disseminated via it.

You have literally just described the 'Christian system' according to you. Do you not understand the term 'system'?

You have a set of beliefs which have no impact whatsoever on people who don't believe them. You thinking I am going to be condemned to Hell by your deity is like me thinking that my DC's imaginary friend is going to decide who goes to heaven or hell.

You're welcome to your beliefs.

You just described a system.

The verses you quoted -

Rev 2:27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. (KJV)

Rev 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. (KJV)

A man Child. Trump is a man child.

There is a bit there that is relevant to this thread.

Rev 2:20 - 23 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works. (KJV)

Kill her children ? Is that what will happen ?

Am I correct in thinking, that for you to have eternal life in your belief system, everyone who is a non believer will be killed by Jesus ?

@RedTagAlan

What you said may or may not apply to the person you were questioning, but it doesn't apply to me. First of all, there isn't one singular pagan 'system' (paganism covers numerous traditions) and I would not want it to be imposed on everyone else. I would not wish to see everyone living under paganism.

Paganism (as well as occultism) is for those who choose to be pagans and occultists. No one else.

Fair enough. I used a bad choice of words.

Do you agree however there is a Christian Nationalism issue afoot ?

When looking up those verses, I saw this.

Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. (KVV)

So Jesus is the morning star. That rung a bell.

Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! (KJV)

Different things ? One is venus, the other is dawn ? No.

The Term "Lucifer": The Hebrew term translated as "Day Star" or "Morning Star" in Isaiah 14:12 is helel ben shachar, meaning "shining one, son of dawn." The Latin Vulgate translation rendered this as Lucifer, which literally means "light-bearer" or "morning star." It is from this Latin translation that the name "Lucifer" became commonly associated with Satan.

Why Are Jesus and Satan Called Morning Star in the Bible? Su (biblewithlife.com)

So we have Jesus saying he is the morning star, when Lucifer means "morning star" in Hebrew.

@RedTagAlan

I do agree that there is, but I think the problem is that you implied that the people you are conversing with in this thread share Christian nationalist views.

"I want to know what the individuals think. The same individuals incidentally, who would like to see everyone else live under their system."

There's no reason to think that all the Christians in this thread have the desire to impose it on all of society. If you were specifically questioning members of far right Christian nationalist parties, what you said would make sense, but it seems more like you're presuming that anyone who is a Christian has an Xtian nationalist viewpoint, which isn't the case.

This is about the best paragraph on how I feel Christianity/Christian faith should work that I’ve ever read. Far better than I could write. Thanks and Brava.

Point well made, and I retract that statement.

Having wisdom has nothing to do with any god.

Saved from what?