Lily Philips - can she be a 'true' Christian?

[mids2019]

https://www.premierchristianity.com/opinion/lily-phillips-has-been-baptised-i-pray-its-accompanied-by-change/20772.article

This article made me think about what it means to be Christian especially about the concepts of sin, judgment and redemption.

In my view Lily of course is a Christian being baptised but to not give up a lucrative adult film career possibly does cause angst amongst more traditional Christians.

We are taught not to judge 'Let those without sin cast the first stone' and to accept the universal unconditionally of forgiveness. (We pray every day about the forgiveness of sin) so it is difficult thologically to condemn others.

However does any fellow Christian need to remind Lily she makes money from a profession where many women with less choice are coerced and manipulated for thr gratification of men? Wr have moved away from a less judgmental Christianity but how do you view participation in Christian life with such a job?

This is an interesting point. Homosexuality is technically a serial sin if you read the Bible literally and on 2026 we wouldn't expect gay men and lesbians to pray for forgiveness and repent their sexuality. So is there some sort of arbiter about what is swxual sin? You may sleep with 100 men in 24 hours but if tou are not married where is the 'rule' that you are fundamentally crossing a line. There seems to be an obvious human a morality here but I think it gets interesting when brining theology into it.

Personally I feel the damage is to the standing of Christianity if people view the behaviour as somehow within a Christian remit yet it is ultimately a redemptive religion. I think some branches of Christianity and maybe all of Islam would say simply 'out'; we cannot recognise the woman as a person of faith

At the end of the day no-one can judge us but God and only He knows what's in our hearts.
At Confession there must be an intention of renouncing that life, otherwise it's pointless.

So I've just googled the two passages below which would certainly seem to indicate that prostitution does not align with Christianity:

"The New Testament groups prostitution under general sexual immorality. In 1 Corinthians 6:18–20, the Apostle Paul strongly warns believers against visiting prostitutes, teaching that the act joins a person's body improperly to the body of Christ. 1, 2]"

"Grace and Redemption: While the lifestyle is condemned, Jesus showed mercy and compassion to individual sex sinners, teaching that tax collectors and prostitutes who repented could enter the Kingdom of God ahead of self-righteous religious leaders (Matthew 21:31). 1, 2, 3, 4]"

So the last passage clearly says that tax collectors and prostitutes "who repent" could enter the Kingdom of God.

I should point out that I have no particular faith and perhaps I am very much misinterpreting the Bible here.

We are all sinners.

Yes, an intention.

For context, are you a Christian yourself, @mids2019 ?

Or are you judging from the outside what Christianity should be?

@mids2019 One requirement of mortal sin is full knowledge of the sin being committed. So if Lily Phillips (or anyone else) is unaware that fornication is a sin then she can't commit it. In other words no-one can sin by accident.

However, if she has decided to be Baptised then presumably she will have attended some classes/period of instruction to make her aware of what she is agreeing to and what 'sin' actually is.
I'm sure there is some promises that people make directly before baptism to "renounce sin".
If she doesn't choose to amend her life that is her affair and no-one has the right to judge her on that.

So you can essentially live your whole life as a unscrupulous con artist, thief, wife beater, arsonist, pimp or even murderer without actually having to repent. You simply have to tell the priest that you're thinking about repenting. Then rinse and repeat for as long as you like. Is that the basic principal?

No, you’re not, but in practice all kinds of godawful people are not only observant Christians, but hold high office in their various churches.

@ginasevern "So you can essentially live your whole life as a unscrupulous con artist, thief, wife beater, arsonist, pimp or even murderer without actually having to repent. You simply have to tell the priest that you're thinking about repenting."
No, you have to tell the priest that you do repent.

Whether you actually do or not is up to you. You may fool the priest but you don't fool God.

But it seems rather a waste of time to go through this process if you aren't genuine. Far better to spend the time outside the Confessional, mugging old ladies or whatever floats your boat.

Having said that, it is worth bearing in mind that this behaviour on your part stops you having a meaningful relationship with God and tells Him that you reject Him.

God will remember this when it comes to the Final Judgement and will grant your wish to stay separated from Him for Eternity.

I think it's important to point out that the Church isn't a club for saints, but a hospital for sinners.

Hi

Yes I am Christian.

I thought it was an interesting article on the nature of sin and redemption and what is required of a Chrsitian. I do find from a Christian perspective sexual son is a difficult subject as how do we define that particular sin on 2026? As I said earlier homosexuality isn't perceived by a significant number of Christians as sinful yet a literal reading of the bible reveals it is. I suppose Lily's sin is technically prostitution but in biblical times you obviously didn't have internet adult entertainment. Lily is promiscuous by definition in terms of her career but what level of promiscuity pushes a woman into the sin bracket?

I brought up the subject as someone was using Lily's baptism as a means to ridicule Christianity by suggesting an atheist virgin would never get to heaven yet Lily as a Christian would. I don't know if there was an easy answer to that one.

I agree but does having an active adult film star as part of a congregation undermine the church to some extent? I am think of Christians being role models to other Christians.

Thanks.

Yes, who gets to heaven is a perennial topic of debate, isn't it?

https://premierchristian.news/en/news/article/lily-phillips-hits-back-at-critics-over-porn-work-after-baptism

Lily has an interesting defence and I guess she is saying that her personal relationship with God is most important not public approval. Do we have the ability to pick and choose what is sinful from a sexual perspective as Christians?

I think its a really thorny question in modern relgion. In a modern era with a much less condemnatory Christianity how do we couple what many would regard as amorality with redemption? I find this difficult as to accept her argument that in her particular version of Christianity that adult film work is legitimate however I guess other people will say in their Christian world view sex before marriage isn't necessarily sinful and will continue to have pre marital sex and be committed Christians. Maybe Lily is taking advantage of current ambiguity of what constitutes sexual sin?

Ummm some of us Christians would expect repentence from homosexual sin - and adultery and sex outside marriage. Basically any sex outside marriage. A lot of Christians have caved to the secular pressure to be accepting of something that is clearly proscribed by God.

That's a really interesting point and there has been huge pressure on the church to disregard homosexuality as a sin. I suppose a by product of becoming less dependent on literal text when defining sexual sin is that Lily can argue if homosexuality is no longer a sin then I am not sinful as the whole thing becomes a matter of debate.

Also a homosexual Christian would possibly repent yet stay in same sex relationships i.e. the act of repentance or asking for forgiveness may not necessarily be connected to abandoning a particular acitivity.

If people want to disregard the Bible's core teachings there's not much to be done. My church takes a literal, grammatical and historical view. We'd be delighted that someone has come to Christ but it's not enough to just carry on life as before, because salvation is a continual process for the rest of one's life, and ideally Christians who grow in their faith will show that in the way they live their lives. We can't know Lily's motivation, only God knows what's in her heart. I've found the more I study the Word the more my life is changing. Which doesn't necessarily make one more popular!

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/jan/20/gay-priest-church-of-england-civil-marriage

You can be gay and a priest so iit seems like homosexuality isn't inherently sinful yet the Bible says it is and a lot of the description of sexual sin in the Bible does unfortunately lump homosexuality in.

Jesus did leave a list of things to do. Two things. To love the Lord your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your strength. And to love your neighbour as yourself.

Im an atheist but I can’t help noticing that this indicates we shouldn’t be speculating on another person’s relationship with God, but instead working on loving her as our neighbour. Ie the change we seek should be in us. The change in her is her own business.

Well, there's plenty of argument to be found online as to whether homosexuality is a sin or not - I prefer to look to God's word about it. However as we know Jesus said we are to love one another and this means of course we shouldn't hate homosexual people! At the same time though I cannot honestly say I think homosexual activity is OK. I've copped flak on MN for saying it, very unpleasant attacks, but it is what it is.

I think one point is that some branches of the church accept gay priests who continue to commit (prwsumably) homosexual acts yet are devout Christians i.e. I would guess they would not consider their behaviour sinful in 2026. I guess Lily is making a similar point but substituting adult film with for homosexuality

Yep, does sound like a parallel. I just wouldn't want to be them on judgement day!