If someone claimed to be the Son of God today…

[Nutcracks]

If someone claimed today all the things that Jesus did/said, would you believe them?

Curious about how people would respond in today’s world.

No, none of us have lived sinlessly and none of us would go to Heaven, but for the fact that God graciously sent his son Jesus to shed his blood for us, to wipe out all our sins once and for all.

Substitutionary atonement is an odd concept when you think about it. God saying that your sins have been absolved because Jesus was crucified is like saying "You stole my car so I dropped my kitten into a mincer. You're welcome". It's really rather bizarre.

Great stories there about the psych wards, surely there have been plenty of cases of people claiming that they're all the son of God but why has the Jesus of Nazareth message endured, been debated, fought over for two milennia? Why have people willingly died for it? Why have great works of charity (hospitals, etc) grown out of it? Why have educational institutions grown out of it?

We're all (all Christians over the past two thousand years) either stupid , delusional, ignorant, too lazy to think for ourselves, spend our lives indoctrinating each other and our offspring, or there's something to it.

It's all over the Old Testament (Torah) from Abraham onwards so it wasn't a new idea.

It's really unclear that Revelations 19 is talking about the Second Coming - as far as I recall, it's said to be on the basis of the monster's leg tattoo. I can't be bothered to go back and look at all the various translations, but anyway: the Second Coming of Revelations is a blood-soaked monster riding a white horse. A giant sword protrudes from his mouth, which he uses to kill everybody who manages to escape the general burning with sulphur, etc.

Nina Paley made a fantastic animation series of the apocalypse. If they've uploaded OK, these are illustrations from Rev 19.

I don't believe the first one when he said it so I certainly wouldn't believe anyone else.

why has the Jesus of Nazareth message endured, been debated, fought over for two millennia?

This is one of the many things that fascinate me about humanity, @Boohbooh. You could ask exactly the same questions about Marduk, Assur, Astarte, the Ancient Egyptian and Hindu gods; dozens of others. Most of them lasted much longer 2,000 years - as, indeed, has JWH or whatever you want to call it.

I think it tells us more about people and civilisation than anything supernatural, but respect your personal perspective. I see the Enlightenment (rise of logic with scientific investigation) as humanity's greatest leap forward since we started asking questions, which were first answered with theories about otherworldly beings.

However ... this is a philosophical reply not a religious one, so I'll leave the religion part to you!

Jesus is recorded in the Gospels as saying he'd be back. The book of the apocalypse was a revelation to John, much later. Great imagery though!

Anyway this whole thread has been interesting, thanks everyone. Just as in the time of Jesus when people chose to not believe him despite the evidence presented at the time in terms of miracles, fulfillment of prophecy,etc, it is still the case today that people doubt him. So be it. You have all got free will and the right to do that if you want. I guess we'll all see at our natural ends to see what the real deal is!! Until then argue on folks 😜

Thanks Garlic, I'd love to get into this but I've spent enough time on it for today and I need to relax for the evening. I love the topic of the Enlightenment! Let's keep it for another day, I have way too much to say on it!

He’s done everything to forgive your sins and reconcile you to Himself, to bring you from a reality where you are presently cut off from Him into a good relationship of Father and child. He did that at great personal cost and He offers this to you as a gift.

If, having heard all this your final response to Him is to reject the gift, then so be it.

You have refused the only way to the Father and you stay where you are, cut off from Him.
Forever.

How do you know anyone? You meet them, and then you develop a relationship which grows and deepens. You spend time together. You communicate.

Why would it seem strange to you that I know Him?

Here’s an example- when my mum phones me she always starts by saying “hello AgileGreenSeal, it’s your mum”. But she doesn’t need to tell me that it’s her, because I know her and I know what her voice sounds like. It’s like that with Him.

“My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.”
John 10:27

No, I don’t want his “gift”. This god has a very conditional way of expressing his “love” to humanity, and the threatening tone of his message, the “worship me or else”, is not an entity that I want to spend eternity with. I definitely respect your right to believe in all of this, and it’s great that this gives you comfort. But don’t see it the way you do, and just because you believe doesn’t make it true. Like I said up thread, if this god was an earthly father, and he played such mind games with “his children”, and made them suffer every time they disobeyed his orders, or threatening them with hell, because they didn’t worship “him” enough, social services, and probably the police would get involved.

Whether it's a 2,000 year old idea or a 4,000 year old one it's still fundamentally unjust and perverse.

Thanks for your reply, but I don't really feel that answers my question. How does God speak to you specifically? You recognise him because you know him, but how did you know it was him the first time he spoke to you? Can you give an example of a time that he's spoken to you and how he did it?

Also, you didn't explain what you meant by this "His Spirit consistently bears witness with my spirit that I am His and that what I read in scripture is reliable."

So why didn't God spread the word himself? Why did he just have the word in certain areas?

Isn’t this thread about Jesus’s return? There is your clue to the context and meaning of what I wrote re mutterings on social media.

God chose to spread his word by others rather than himself directly, not just humans but also via angels, dreams and visions. God still works in a person's heart when they hear the Gospel message. It's up to us Christians to evangelise and spread the word, we were commanded to do so by Jesus. This is the way God has designed it to be. I suppose he wanted the personal touch of humans conveying His message onwards.

@AlteredStater Can you explain why you believe what has been written and not just a made up story?

Surely even if you're religious you can objectively see the difference between literally meeting someone in real life amd 'meeting' a deity for whom there is absolutely no proof if their existence and no proof beyond what's in your own mind that you have 'met' them?

Oooof. How long have you got? 😁Leaving the personal 'feels' aside, which I think is far harder to convey and not necessarily that convincing to someone else, there's a lot of logic in the Bible and a ton of fulfilled prophecies that it would be very hard to 'make up' as stories, especially with many different authors over a long time period.

Moses wrote the first copy of the Torah (the first 5 books of the OT) on scrolls and these were faithfully copied by subsequent priests and passed down to the people. These are real physical things, documenting the events that happened. Onwards from there, others also wrote various documents of their experiences. There are several books of prophecies (many of which have come true, some are yet to do so, but will in the end times).

By reading the whole Bible you can learn of God's nature, his characteristics and how he interacts with his people. I find it very moving, to be honest. He loves us so much, he always pursues us and doesn't want us to perish, although he must punish evil as he is a just God. Also I love God's amazing mind for detail and his artistry, in his temple design and priest's clothes, all documented in the Bible.

I could go on for a long time about it, but I won't bore you! I just know the more I study and learn from the Bible, the more amazed I am at God and his plans, and how much he loves us.

Aw, you didnt answer my question @AlteredStater

Erm, but why not just have his word spread worldwide, wouldnt that make more sense?

Oh sorry i see you did make an attempt.

Because these days anyone in the know knows that the son of god, was the sun that was worshipped before Christianity.
anyone in the know knows that we are all god.

As an atheist how will I be punished?

The lake of fire.