Soul Survivor thread 2

[BadSkiingMum]

This is a thread for anyone following the events at Soul Survivor or wishing to discuss their own experiences or the experiences of their loved ones within evangelical, charismatic and pentecostal religious spaces.

https://archive.ph/5vb03
Quite concerning that a meeting applauded the perpetrator.

Very concerning that they applauded. Many people still don't get it and are on Mike's side 🙄

I've read some tweets though that say the Telegraph misrepresented the applause thing. Apparently there was some applause when someone asked about saying goodbye to MP but even more applause when the leadership replied that it would be totally inappropriate for him to attend the church.

Thanks for the new thread. I was following the old one with interest as someone who grew up going to New Wine and Soul Survivor. I went to New Wine once as an adult a few years ago and had the most miserable time (bad weather didn’t help). The whole worship set up felt so emotionally manipulative. I felt disconnected from it all and it made me question whether I even believe in God.

A memory that has come back to me: once when I was at Club 1 (New Wine’s group for 12-13 year olds) the male speaker made a derogatory remark about women with hairy legs. Can’t remember the context but I remember looking at my legs and wanting to die with shame. It’s only now that I think “wtaf” and feel so angry about it. I can’t believe anyone thought that was acceptable or appropriate at an event for kids.

@CarrotSoupwithCheese I've often found what passes for "humour" in Christian circles can be very cruel and nasty indeed. It's because jokes deemed "inappropriate" morally are off the table.

Quite why it's wrong to tell a racy joke that doesn't hurt anyone, while it's perfectly acceptable to mock people actually in the room, I'll never know.

South West London Vineyard have spoken about the Mike Pilavachi situation, at https://swlv.org.uk/talks/colossians-part-3-sunday-24-september
There’s also a transcript, at https://7c3a0c6b-aadd-48df-8367-0981a207eb6f.usrfiles.com/ugd/7c3a0c_ce922ac5a3154d80bb3ffd6c05025883.pdf
Thanks to the God Loves Women timeline.

Indeed, even the one who claimed to be there and said it was misrepresented. Previous tweets show she is a big supporter of MP. The SS congregation that I am in touch with still support him. I honestly have no idea what will stop their blind loyalty.

I think it is a bit like the Stockholm syndrome with hostages. Many years ago I was part of a church where the minister had to leave after misconduct (immorality and abuse of a power differential). To begin with I still felt very warmly towards him ( no idea why now!), but as time went on and I was able to reflect on the situation and understand more of the abuses then I felt very differently.

I think it is pertinent that MP actually set up Soul Survivor church and members and other leaders may well have been "groomed" by him to accept the things he did. Some of them may have no other real church experience with which to compare things. They may need time to understand and realise what has gone on.

Wow. That is interesting.
Hopefully a report being put into the public domain setting out the evidence will assist with this process.
If this had been handed over to an independent investigation at the start, or at least when it snowballed and became apparent there were over 100 survivors, we may have had a report by now.
The longer it takes for this to be fully in the light, the longer the damage continues.

Interesting that journalists are delving in to the finances now. The salary of 100k ish purported to be Mike Pilavachi’s is Duncan Layzell’s? His wife ran the Soul 61 course and I believe they set up SS with MP.

How much money were they taking out between them, raised from mostly teenagers from festivals. It’s sickening.

Agree about Stockholm syndrome theory. Many of them went straight from youth groups to ministry. No experience of real life or real jobs outside of SS.

Hello, sorry not to have posted for a while, I have been preoccupied with 'I was a teenage fundamentalist'. If you haven't been there, it is highly recommended. Not every episode is essential but some are just jaw-dropping. Perhaps I will do a list of my favourites at some point.

I am also thinking of buying Elle Hardy's book 'Beyond Belief: how Pentecostalism is taking over the world'. Has anyone read it?

I think that is a primitive thing about being safer in groups and wanting to ingratiate with and stay close to those with power or authority in the group.

What did new wine say?

I spoke to someone recently who was reflecting on how weird their experience of New Wine youth work was. Purity stuff, very damaging about young women in particular. It was when they experienced something as an adult that they looked back and realised it had always been off kilter. My DC went from the younger groups into being on team as early as they could. They didn’t experience the teen youth work.

Surprised at SW London vineyard . The vineyard culture is super toxic. And the whole "report if anything is not okay" doesn't happen when you aren't away it's not okay....

Women... lgb.... leaders with absolute power. The vineyard I was in was completely run on "god told me..." even one whole move based on a dream. Even less checks and balances than the C of E IMHO.

Can’t seem to edit to update but I’ve now read the thread and caught up with what NW have been saying.

I was curious because a friend worked for them briefly a while back and didn’t have a great experience.

https://premierchristian.news/en/news/article/new-wine-shock-and-disappointed-at-mike-pilavachi-investigation-findings

New Wine's original statement seemed to ignore many links with MP and after a certain date ( 1996? can't remember) labelled him as a "guest speaker" whereas he was clearly more involved. People on twitter called them out on it, linking to evidence he was much more than this. Now they are reviewing all their links with MP but we have not yet had the outcome of the review!

What I despise is the cowardice. Those who gave MP a platform, posted simpering YouTube videos up until last year and are now sticking their fingers in their ears. Does evangelism attract too many of the cringe middle aged trendy type? New Balance trainers and denim jacket brigade?
I don’t understand why they think it will get buried as yesterdays news.

There's a podcast just about to launch called Soul Survivors, this is the Spotify link https://spotify.link/m14PpxOg8Db - it actually sounds really good, not sensationalist but not skirting around the truth.

Oh my word, so glad something has come out to keep this in the spotlight.

I couldn't get that link to work but if anyone has the same problem I have found it on the Spotify website:
Trailer - Soul Survivors | Podcast on Spotify

I'm pleased that this thread is still running. I was on the previous thread but have name changed. I hope it's ok to post here and that it's not derailing, but this felt like a 'safe space' before.

I have recently been made aware of an online Ted-type talk by an evangelical Christian (not ordained but with some kind of 'ministry') about his porn addiction. In it he talks at quite some length about a previous sexual relationship he had with a 'girl'. I am the 'girl' in question - girl being the right word because I was under 18 and he was much older.

I feel utterly violated by him giving this 'talk'.
It was a terrible, toxic relationship, caused immense damage to me and I consider it to have been probably abusive on his part and now it's all been resurrected online. I feel that he's made out me out to be some terrible, evil woman and I have no right to reply. I'm not named but anyone who knew us will know who he's talking about. I feel sick. And very, very angry.

I am so sorry this has happened to you. Does the man work for a particular organisation? You could see if they have any safeguarding policy through which you could report this. However, following those who have reported misconduct on Twitter, I can see that it can be a long and difficult process so take some time to decide what you want to do.

Horrified for you to read that. I'm really sorry.

Thank you both so much for replying, I don't feel able to talk about this to anyone irl. I've gone back and read a bit more of the transcript again (I couldn't listen to his voice) and there's a bit where he describes being prayed for and they call my spirit to come out of him and he says he sees a shadow come out of him and run off. And this is the turning point for him where he's 'cured' of his porn addiction. I mean what the actual fuck?!

I am so angry I can hardly breathe and yet I'm at work and have to act and function normally.