American XL Bully dog

[BettyALJF]

My ex and I have two sons (7&9) and share them 50/50. His girlfriend has an American XL bully dog that now lives with them. I’ve had reservations about the dog as it’s massive but I can’t stop them having it and know all dogs are different etc. I asked my ex to never leave them unsupervised with the dog, which the boys tell me they are on a morning when they go down for breakfast and their dad and gf stay upstairs and god knows when else. I pick my sons up on Saturday afternoon and the boys tell me that my youngest has been bitten on the ear by the dog on Thursday. My ex didn’t tell me this had happened. Once we are home I look at the bite and it’s pierced the skin. I asked them what happened and he said he got on the sofa and the dog barked at him and got his ear. He said it hurt and bled a lot. They tell me they didn’t go to the drs to get it looked at. Obviously when the skins been broken it can cause an infection, so I ring 111 to ask what to do and they send me to the hospital to get it checked out due to it being a Saturday. The doctor cleans the cut and says they have to report it to the police. I let my ex know all this and he has a go at me saying he didn’t know what I was trying to do and that I should have contacted him to find out what happened. I basically think they’ve not taken him as they are worried what will happen to the dog, therefore not putting our son’s safety first.
Regardless of what happened, it’s pierced the skin and as his father he has a duty of care and he should’ve taken him to the doctors for it to be checked, cleaned and given anti biotics. It may have been an accident, but I don’t want to risk ‘a second offence’ which may be a lot worse next time. I’ve told the police I don’t want the dog in the house when the boys are there, I don’t trust them to put the boys safety first anymore. Would you do the same thing in my situation?

Childrens’ Social Care will add this to the kids’ individual files on the computer system. It may be key important information in the future. This may add up to something bigger-picture in the future. Best to get the documentation in their file with a timestamp.

My children would not be going back to a house where that dog lived. It's shown human aggression, luckily it wasn't serious this time but next time might be a different story. Too big a risk to take IMO

Can we please stop rolling out the "bad owner" trope. These dogs are inherently dangerous. They're responsible for approximately 2/3 of fate dog attacks yet only make up around 3% of the total dog population in the UK. It's the breed not the owners. We accept that herding dogs herd, retrievers retrieve why can't people accept that a dog bred for fighting WILL be aggressive?

He’s such a wanker and a shit parent don’t think I’d trust him with the children without the dog, never mind with.

@PickledMumion there's absolutely no role for SS here. Mum is perfectly capable of making protective decisions around the welfare of her children so why should an already stretched to breaking service be brought in? What exactly do you imagine they're going to do?

It sounds like the dog was resource guarding and feels dominance over the child(ren).
A large powerful breed like this one should have very clear boundaries and know its place.
Resource guarding can be very difficult to change and requires a lot of consistent work.
As a dog owner of many years there is no way in hell would I allow my child to be in that house with the dog.
Sorry, but the next bite could maim for life or be fatal. I don’t think the owner will put in the work required to train the dog and most importantly won’t put the children’s safety first and keep the dog separate from them.

You'd still tell the other parent though and get the child looked at, wouldn't you?

Absolutely.Bad owner or bad dog, makes no difference to the outcome if the dog attacks a child anyway.

Just like it was the dobermans and rotties in the 90s? German shepherds? It’s the “cool in thing tough look dogs” picked by owners who want a scary dog and make them so. Or just don’t know how to train them.

What do you think social services will do?

His attitude is appalling. Imagine prioritising your new girlfriend's aggressive dog over your own kids. He wouldn't have got that bite looked at even if he'd been aware because he knows that would bring all this attention to them. Shit dog owners and even worse parents.

Please don't send them there again op, you will never forgive yourself if something awful happens.

If you like, but a paper trail won't mean much if it's just OP telling social services that this happened. They won't do anything to verify it. The police report is far more useful.

Call social services for what?

Nope! Social services won't verify the OP's claim. All they would do is advise OP to stop contact. They won't write a letter or confirm anything.

No, even if there is a court order in place social services would still not be the right people to contact. OP would need to make a new application to court.

Make them aware? For what reason?

All they would record is that mother reports the dog bit the child. That's not evidence.

Draco, yes police too of course. Personally I would tell ss as well wouldn’t want to leave anything out that I could possibly do, it might or might not help, but I wouldn’t want to risk regretting not doing it (eg twat dad’s lawyer asking why I didn’t report to ss if I was worried) as an attempt to undermine me. Maybe I’ve done too much safeguarding training but the message of a always report - little bits of info can add up to a big picture.

Draco - but it would tie in with police report + photo + school speaking to the child.

There's bigger issues with the xl dogs genetic make up. There's a lot of evidence these dogs 'turn' for absolutely no reason at all- no provocation. However, yes a lot of these dogs inevitably attract bad owners making the problem much, much worse. Thankfully it seems to be the owners that eventually get the brunt of the XL aggression in most cases.

If a dc is at risk in a household and the op can say she contacted ss, it will demonstrate she took steps. It’s a known dangerous dog breed and the dc is in danger. I’m surprised you think ss won’t be interested. They do get involved in my experience but maybe different areas vary depending on the prevalence.

@Devilrocknroller Dobermans, Rotties and GS never caused the wave of fatalities that XL Bullies have, though they are all dangerous dogs in the wrong hands. The characteristics that were bred into bullies as "desirable" traits are precisely the reason they are so dangerous. Rotties, Dobermans and GS don't have the same level of inbreeding and instability of bloodline. The vast majority of XLs in the UK come from one specific bloodline KNOWN for human aggression and ridiculous muscle size. Read this and you might understand better. bullywatch.link/2023/08/01/finding-kimbo/

Aside from that, all these stories of xls just "turning without warning"... also a breed specific trait. Dogs who performed better in the pit have little to no outwards signs of attack therefore giving them the upper hand against their opponent. This trait persists today seemingly giving the illusion that the dog just turns without warning. That's not true, it's simply that they're very good at masking impending intent to attack.

A quick google shows that agencies do refer dog bites to ss.
OP - I think you need to follow up and check that the hospital has reported to the police and that police have contacted ss.

www.safeguardingcambspeterborough.org.uk/children-board/professionals/procedures/dangerous_dogs/

Is this not guidance for social workers who are already involved with families who may own these dogs and aggravating risk factors?

I messaged my ex making him aware of the situation and received a reply that I was over reacting so I have screenshotted it. I’ll show you my reply and his.
FYI the pets at home incident a dog snapped at my son, there was no contact with the skin so yes very different 🙄.
There no court order for those asking x

• [Post edited to remove screenshots as content was potentially identifying]