Dog had 'red mist' moment and bit DH, AIBU to think that with training this won't happen again?

[Antalya1]

We are a family with DS17 & DS20. About 4 weeks ago we got a rescue dog, he's about 2 ish and a cross between a shitsu and a yorkshire terrier we think. He's a little thing and has been an absolute joy and has brought a lovely new dynamic to our family.

As I was at home more of less for the first 3 weeks the dog has bonded with me and then next I suppose with DS20, we both have spent a lot of time playing and just generally being loving with him.
DS17 is indifferent and DH has been pretty loving also. We all take responsibility for feeding and walks.

As he was so shy and frightened when we first got him, we allowed him into our bed and he's just sort of stayed there.

When I'm working from home, he cuddles up and spends the day with me.

Over the last 10 days or so, the dog has been growling sometimes at DH, especially when DH comes near me, tries to stroke him, or DH tries to get in bed.

This evening I was sat in bed doing some work and DH came up to the bedroom, the dog started growling at DH so I told DH to pick him up and put him out of the room until he stopped. DH picked him up and the growling got much worse and the dog seemed as though he was going to bite DH, so DH dropped him, the dog sprang at DH and seemed to have a 'red mist' moment, jumping up and bit him, breaking the skin 4 times on his legs and stomach.

We were all really shocked. DH is OK and has been to be checked out but is really shaken and upset and talking about getting rid of the dog.

I'm devasteted, first that the dog who is incredibly loving mostly would do this to DH and also really frightened that DH will insist that we take the dog to a dog and cats home.

I've been in tears tonight thinking about this but I know that if there's a chance that he would do this again then there would be no choice. I've persuaded DH to wait until I can get in touch with a dog behavioural expert tomorrow and I'm pinning my hopes that there is something that they can do...AIBU to think about keeping my dog and that there is something we can do to stop this happening again?

You let the dog INTO YOUR (and DH's) BED? !

Not clever.

Thank you Viva and Blistery and everyone else the advice has been so good. For everone who has said that I was stupid in asking DH to remove a growling dog you are right..I was stupid, I did think it was the right thing at the time.

I can't speak to the the vet's behaviourist until tomorrow afternoon and then will only be able to see her next week.
In the meantime, DH feelspretty nervous around the dog, he has been really good and is trying to show the dog that he is a friend but anytime he goes near him the dog growls, even if very softly...any advice on this?

LittleDog and Bridget both sleep in my bed. Never had a problem, because I know how to behave with dogs, and I understand their body language.

Keeping dogs off furniture and beds, other than for personal choice, is part of the very outdated, and thoroughly debunked, pack/alpha crap.

Is it just your DH, or men in general?

If the dog growls he needs to back away. By doing this the dog will start to trust him but it could take months.

He needs to try and show the dog there's nothing to fear. By backing away the dog will realise that your dh will listen to him and respect his boundaries.

When your dh comes into the room/near him he needs to throw a high level treat in the direction of the dog. Fairly close to the dog. So a dog treat, bit of ham, cheese, something the dog loves. Dog starts to associate dh with nice things.

Equally make dh responsible for topping up dogs food bowl and for walking him when possible.

We also use zylkene capsules for our dog. Not cheap but its made a noticeable difference. So much so that if I miss a day the dogs behaviour is much worse the following day.

OP I'm really happy that you've taken positive steps to get professional help. Make sure the behaviourist isn't practising any of that pack/dominance/alpha crap. I know you would assume that a behaviourist working with a veterinary practice would be practising modern techniques but unfortunately knowledge and understanding of dog behaviour is very variable within the profession, and I have been utterly horrified by the advice some of my clients have received from their previous vets.

Good luck :)

VivaLeBeaver I'm sorry to hear that you have suffered a recent loss, but you managed to put that aside long enough to call those who hold different opinions to you "clueless twats spouting shit"

Ffs.

It wasn't her opinion I was bothered about. It was the fact I pointed out I have not posted on here asking for any advice. I don't need or want any advice. This thread is not about my dog. I politely pointed this out to get a sarcastic comment, which is what promoted the "twat" comment.

And still you continue.

I hope its making you feel happy to carry on having a pop at me.

I was very happy when I posted a thread months ago to hear from people with differing views to mine. Never felt anyone then was a twat. But that was because I'd asked for advice.

For what it's worth VivaLeBeaver I imagine your technique would work. If a man convinces a dog that it is in charge. Backs away when the dog growls, placates him with treats and does all the menial tasks the dog requires it's quite possible that the dog will stop biting him.

Most people would have trouble finding a man who wanted to be accepted as of less worth than a dog so it's probably not going to work for everyone.

You really are unbelievable! So now you want to carry on having a go, saying my dh isn't a man. Are you really enjoying yourself, are you trying really hard to upset me?? Getting a kick out of it?

I repeat this thread is not about my dog but will also reiterate what others have said that the alpha dog, pack theory has been disproven. So its not about the dog been in charge.

Google Daniel Mills if you're interested.

Back you're only underlining your own ignorance here. If you haven't got the specialist knowledge needed in these circumstances then you shouldn't really be offering a take on this.

Viva does you're DH mind being growled and snarled at every day? Respect to him, I'm not sure i could cope with that in my own home

The growling and snarling is getting less all the time. Dh likes the dog and a lot of the time the dog likes him as well. When dh comes back from work the dog now runs to the door wagging his tail and pleased to see him. He used to run up growling.

Dh can see the improvements. They spend a lot of time playing quite happily.

VivaLeBeaver I posted about something you had said because I felt it was bad advice and I feel strongly that such advice should be countered. You objected on the grounds that I was personally upsetting you which I felt was out of order considering that you felt strong enough to have a go at other people who had posted.

That's all there is to it. I don't care what you do, but I do care that such things are passed on as sensible whoever says them.

DeathByLaundry we had a thread on here recently that showed a large proportion of people would place the safety and well being of a dog above that of a child. As a member of the human race and of this society I am qualified to hold an opinion on that. I will endeavour to hold up to ridicule all suggestions that dogs should have more rights than people or that the safety of people in general should be sacrificed for the sake of a pet.

Well thankfully the OP is getting good advice on another thread now. I'm quite happy knowing that what I say corresponds with what leading professors in dog behaviour are saying.

I must have missed the post where you actually gave some advice on what to do BackOnlyBriefly.

I think I have every right to be annoyed with people telling me my dog should be shot on a thread where I haven't asked for anyone's opinion on my dog. That's what I object to.

Yes you did miss it. But that's ok because I didn't spell it out in great detail and there were a lot of other posts. What I said was that it would be irresponsible to keep the dog even if the OP and DH were willing to take the risk for themselves.

That would mean either having it put down or giving it to some place that would eventually have it put down.

What on earth qualifies you to say that, Back? Don't you think it's a little odd that a number of posters who have professional or first hand experience of dogs with behaviour problems aren't saying it too? Did I miss the post where you listed your credentials?

so basically a dog who has problems should be shot dead back if i thought like you my dog would have been put down a few months after we got him, he is great now but he wasnt to start with and did bite

Ah well, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't on this subject - Viva's had to put up with people slating her as irresponsible or worse when she was considering rehoming (and IIRC even PTS) some time ago. I expect the OP of this thread will come across the same sort of diversity of strongly-held opinions.

It's the breath taking level of ignorance you see on threads like this. If you've no fucking clue what you're babbling about, do everyone a favour, and STFU.

I hear you Stratters. It's one topic where everyone's an expert despite having no experience and no knowledge. Where people seem to think that their opinions=fact and aren't willing to listen to science, evidence or genuine professional experience. Makes me mad.

If half of these armchair experts took the time to learn a little about dog behaviour then the improvements to animal welfare and the reduction in dog bite injuries would be enormous.