No more tax rises petition?

[Mountainbetweenus]

Has anyone else seen this petition?

www.whatlaboursaid.com/no-more-tax-rises?dm_i=7XP6,2XATP,62F9PD,7DA6V,1,0,0,0

Sorry, that’s patently wrong.

in terms of economic growth they actually aren’t, it’s almost like there aren’t that many options once in power.

https://theconversation.com/have-labour-or-the-conservatives-run-the-uk-economy-better-in-the-past-50-years-new-research-233370

@MountainbetweenusIm happy to read something that disproves this

You are wasting your time with petitions.
We need a national strike involving everyone until this government changes course.
They are going to have to raise taxes as long as they are ignoring immigration and also because Ukraine keep demanding support every couple of months when Zelensky feels it is not headline news and getting enough coverage.

That was a short flounce!

I didn't mentions benefits, so no.

I have now benefitted from realising who you are, though. 😃

Not on individuals.

That’s not what you said.

You said Historically if you look at fiscal policies labour & tory governments have been broadly similar.

Well done PS, or should I call you Columbo?

LOL.

Is it not? Once in power labour & tory tend to become more centrist with hiring fiscal policies which results in similar economic growth. How should I have phrased it?

This thread is not really about tax, it's about Reform's policies wanting to take away benefits isn't it?

I was actually a little surprised when I first read these articles but it makes sense as parties want to stay in power and the electorate don’t like big changes despite what they might say. Hence why I think we need cross party census, no one party will deliver growth. I’m not sure it’s even possible but what we have been doing certainly isn’t working.

Petitions are fairly pointless but I don’t think the electorate are as amenable to more tax rises as some threads suggest.

One thing at a time.

You said that Tory and Labour have followed similar fiscal policies, historically.

Please accept that this is incorrect - we can then address growth.

This thread is about tax, however.

The electorate are most certainly not amenable to more tax rises.

https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/share-britons-backing-personal-tax-cuts-grows-particularly-among-conservative-and-reform-voters

Of course, some posters on here probably rely on state support, hence their stance.

That's probably true, but the electorate also want champagne service for lemonade money.

I am not sure what your stance is yet. Do you object to tax in general, or that you have to pay so much tax, or that the government do not spend what the receive efficiently, or all of those? Or do you think that the amount you pay is disproportionate? You've made some sweeping statements, which superficially we all agree with in some form or another, but we all recognise the need.

Successive governments have damaged the economy, public services and then made bad decisions which, when coupled with pandemic and war have been fairly problematic. It will be a rocky road to recover from if we ever do.

Meow 🐈

What does the fox say 🎶

Good one 👍 I'm reminded to play my fave Cat Stevens 🎵 Father and son

I said when in power

How are their approaches to growth not similar once in power? fiscal policies are a method of stimulating growth are they not? How can you measure the outcome of economic action without looking at growth? They are intrinsically linked.

”Labour and the Conservatives define themselves through vastly different social and cultural values and every modern British election is portrayed by some as an existential battle between “socialist” and “capitalist” philosophies. Yet differences between the modern parties when they have been in power appear to play an insignificant role when it comes to economic performance and decision making.
Despite their polarised campaign rhetoric on various economic issues, once in power, each party’s governments tend to gravitate towards relatively centrist economic policies that lead to highly converging economic impacts over tim”

This is from the article & what my original post was referencing.

And again please link to something saying once in power their economic approach is very different as google is bring up nothing…

He uses the name Yusuf Islam now.

It is a great song, I agree.

"some posters on here probably rely on state support, hence their stance."

False causation. It is perfectly possible to be a relatively high earner, not rely on State support financially and support tax rises. As I said, I am one of those people myself.

I don't think there's any shame in relying on financial state support though. I am a realistic person with life experience that tells me anyone can end up on the skids, even you.

I also think systems work better than individuals at providing services and profit-making systems don't really do the job in a lot of cases (c.f. public transport), so I am happy to rely on state support for my healthcare and children's education etc, I'd just prefer everyone paid more tax to improve them.

It's a shame nearly half of British adults support personal tax cuts as your link shows. I disagree with that less-than-half because I think you have to pay for services if you want them, and hopefully the current government can illustrate this works.

Reform voters though will probably not be convinced of this because their level of education tends to be quite low and they don't realise they use services. Unless Nigel Farage tells them it, then they'll believe anything.

Who would you increase taxes for? Which tax brackets

Patriotic Millionaires are very keen to pay more tax. Maybe take them at their word?

Then, let them go ahead. They can simply make ex gratia payments to HMRC. No need for the song and dance when others are struggling to make ends meet.

There are philanthropists who act discreetly - you don’t hear a peep.