shocked - mum left 9 yr old at home on own

[katiekittlemouse]

was at a sports centre today with dd's and shocked to hear that whilst taking her youngest 2 dd's swimming had left the eldest dd who is just 9yrs old at home on her own!!!

I am shocked! would you do that??? I wouldn't for sure!

Charlie - from what I remember, the dangers outlined are:
a) suddenly becoming ill.
b) the house catching fire
c) some unspecified threat posed by Eastern European ironing board cover salesmen.

a) strikes me as being unlikely in the extreme - but even if it did happen would only mean that the child rang you and you came home.

b) - also extremely unlikely - but presumably the sensible 9 year old concerned would hear the smoke alarm going off, and leave the house immediately - just as we have practiced (honestly - we do practice this!)

c) - not even worthy of a reply, really!

Have you put the risks listed in my previous post in order?

you forgot the Aliens!!!!

How could I have been so careless - the shame, the shame!

tbh I think a child who is clued up enough to ride a horse or sail a dingy- both of which activities require an ability to remember instructions and a certain presence of mind in the face of potential danger- might just be clued up enough to remember not to open the door to a salesman.

Or to say "No thank you" and shut the door if for whatever reason she did open the door!

I left my 9 yr old alone twice today for about half an hour each time.

He wasn't well and I had to take ds2 to and from school. Had it been ds2 who was ill I would have asked another mum to take ds1 to school, but as it was I felt that ds1 would be fine alone in the house.

After all he is allowed to go out on his bike for hours on end and I think that is actually more risky than leaving him in the house for 30 min.

(he is in fact ten in a few weeks)

Now I can see that the argument is that if the man is a paedophile or something else creepy, he might prevent her/him from closing it once it was opened (yes I know unlikely but a small risk). But that is easily circumvented by asking the child not to open the door.

'Look, at the age of 9 my ds could sail a dinghy alone. She could ride a horse over jumps, swim in the sea, ride a bicycle, cook a meal, do single back and double front somersaults on a trampoline and walk on stilts. She was also occasionally left alone for an hour on the sofa watching television in her own house with a phone next to her. Would anyone care to put these activities in order of risk? '

I would go as far as to say that any 9yr old should be able to do these things, if they wanted to and if they got the opportunity.

Anyone would think that we were suddenly forcing a 9yr old to stay at home, in a frightened state, for hours with no preparation or warning! You don't suddenly do it-you gradually work up to it.

I started by saying that I was going to post a letter, did they want to come or stay at home? It was a 2 minute walk , at the most to the post box and it was there choice. This went onto popping to the local shop, 2 mins in car, parking outside, 10 mins absolute max. Also their choice. Eventually after this sort of trip they ask if they can stay while you are further away and up to an hour. That is the point to have the rules and who to contact in an emergency.It gradually goes on from there. It is much better IMO, than waiting until they are 13 and having to start to give quite a lot of freedoms all at one go.

My DSs think I am a fussy, over protective Mum! We have a family catch phrase of 'I'm a big boy now,' when I get too fussy, started by my DH who also thinks I am like a mother hen! Little do they know that I am actually over liberal, will let them have their own way because I am too lazy to put up with a tantrum and am taking away their childhood and they will be out at all hours having sex and smoking at 13yrs!

sorry their choice.

Actually my issue is more to do with a child choking, or a bash to the head, like my son did and I was upstairs only to find him covered in blood and lying on the floor. It was awful and I as an adult panicked and felt terribly guilty I had not been there to stop it from happening. I think if this happened with me out of the house, there's no way you could say a 9 or 10year old would not panic. I feel that would be too much for them to have to face at home on their own. My issue wasn't so much the fire/ stranger at door/ explosion!

And as for all the fantastic activities your daughter can do, I have nothing but admiration- but I don't consider that is relevent... sorry

They aren't fantastic activities - they are just things she does - and things which any child lucky enough to have the opportunities she has would do. I only listed them (I'm sure everybody's children have similar lists) to point out the lack of rational though behind thinking that it's dangerous to leave a 9 year old alone for an hour.

Do your children never wander down the garden with an apple? What if they choke then? How often do 9 year olds choke anyway?

Should I stop my dd riding because there is a significant risk of her sustaining an injury doing it?

And why will they suddenly become less likely to choke when they hit 12?

It always worried me when I was alone with small DCs that I might fall downstairs and knock myself out etc. It didn't mean that I refused to be alone with them just in case! My teenager might cut himself when I am out. You really can't live your life with all the 'mights'-you would have to stay in bed all day! My DS went sailing and capsized when he was 10, he stayed calm and did exactly what he was told. I think seekers activities are very relevant-no one put them into order but I would put sitting on the sofa next to a phone last.

Of course they don't become less likely at 12, but I would hope they would be less likely to panic and perhaps have more life experience to deal with it calmly.

Yes my children frequently play in the garden, but again they're not out of earshot and I would be aware if they were choking.

I assume when your daughter rides, she already has riding experience, which I should imagine was built up over a period of time and under some sort of adult supervision?

I'm not saying children should never be allowed to take risks, just that I would try to avoid unnecessary dangers if it's possible. And I'm sure when my child is 11 I will be more than happy for him to pop to post a letter and other such things... just not at 9

And as for me falling downstairs and knocking myself out- that's beyond my control

I think the relevance of seekerdd's activities are that they are not activities that can be closely controlled by a parent. When seekerdd is on horseback her safety depends on her being able to handle the situation, noone else can do much to save her. And the dinghy is probably one of those tiny dinghies with no room for an adult.

As for the bash to the head scenario, various thoughts occur:

One, this could happen at any age- anyone who is left alone could knock themselves out. If they become unconscious they will clearly not be able to call for help. It is not a particular reason for not leaving a 9yo as opposed to a 14yo.

Two, it could be you knocking yourself out and then your ds would have to deal with that. I imagine my 8yo would deal with it.

Three, if the child was conscious, then I think on past experience that at least my dcs would be able get help. I remember accidents happening to my brothers when we were little, and we coped. We got our parents or alerted a neighbour or did whatever needed to be done. I see no reason to believe that the children of today are somehow a different breed to the children of 30 years ago- or the children of northern Europe.

charlie1000 on Fri 13-Mar-09 17:46:29
"Of course they don't become less likely at 12, but I would hope they would be less likely to panic and perhaps have more life experience to deal with it calmly."

I did not panic when my little brother knocked his head open playing in the fields when I was about 7 or 8. I got help. I knew I had to.

I think activities like taking out a dingy alone are very good in building nerve and teaching you to keep panic under control. It is one of the great sorrows of my life that dd's ability to do these things is restricted by disability. But I am all the more eager to ensure that she does develop independence in all possible areas: the last thing she needs is to be clingy and anxious.

So is there nobody watching when she takes the dinghy out seeker? I imagine she stays close to shore and people can still see her so at worst she could swim back?

Cory, I know (hope) what I have described is unlikely, but it did happen to my DS2 and evn I was panicking, there was so much blood

Hang on, charlie - your ds will not be popping to post a letter until he is 11? How is he going to get to Secondary School, then?

My dd and her friends' outdoor activities all, I suppose, count as unnecessary risks. Does your ds not do any sport?

ANd frankly, if you're choking there's not much you can do for yourself, however old you are.

I know accidents can happen. My brother came off his bike and there was blood everywere. I know it was dreadful for my mum. But I also know she felt this anxiety was a price she had to pay for our happy and adventurous childhood. I honour her for that.

He will go to school on a school bus. I will go through the route with him nearer the time and perhaps do a couple of run-throughs when he's ready.

My son does swimming and gymclub all of which are supervised by an appropriate person, as I'm sure your daughter's are

"ANd frankly, if you're choking there's not much you can do for yourself, however old you are."

If my child wasn't at home alone and if I was with my child,of course I could help them!

But what I want for my children is not just outdoor activities supervised by an appropriate person. I want them to have a chance to roam with their friends and have adventures.

And btw, there are no school buses around here. Dd does get taken up on the disabled taxi, but most kids go on public transport. Dh went on the tube to school by the time he got to secondary.

Dd (12) goes on the bus to town for shopping expeditions. Because she does have a disability and can collapse suddently, I make her take a mobile and her 8yo brother. I am fully confident that he would be able to get help in an emergency- as I was at his age. I really don't see that he is any more stupid or helpless than I was, and I coped.

So with all these risks that are never going to happen, why not leave a 5 year old at home then?

Cory I agree I want my children to have the chance to have their adventures but for me I can see it happening more at the age of 11. I would have more confidence that they would be able to handle a situation, so of course I'm not going to be breathing down their necks continually

Because a 5 year old might very well try to boil a kettle and spill boiling water on themselves - unlike a 9 year old who might boil a kettle and make a cup of hot chocolate. Because a 5 year old might very well get lonely and frightened. Because a 5 year old might go out of the house to try and find mum and get run over. Because......because.....because lots of reasons.

Are you really going to wait til your ds is 11 before he's allowed to go out and post a letter? Going to Secondary school is going to be an incredibly steep learning curve for him - it'll be very hard if he hasn't at least gone to the swimming pool with friends a few times, honestly.