Ex husband going on holiday with new family

[SmileWithStyle]

Hi All,
I'd really appreciate some support or advice here as I feel in an awkward position. My ex husband and I divorced in 2023 and we have two sons who are now 7 and 10. He has since re-married and had another child with his new wife.
We have shared custody of the boys it works around 40%-60% split, with me having them a little more and usually sorting out all of the admin that comes with having kids.
So the problem started when my ex husband went on holiday abroad with his new wife and their daughter, but the boys were not invited. His mum helped with childcare, but my oldest was really upset and said "we're being dumped at Grans while they go on holiday" which I'm gutted about. My youngest is a bit more laid-back and was upset, but not to the same extent.
My oldest son has been having tantrums at his dad's and not behaving well. He's been great with me, very few issues and we have a really close relationship. His dad asked me to speak to him about the tantrums and bad behaviour. When we had a chat my oldest opened up about not feeling important to his dad, that they don't spend any time together, that the new daughter is the favourite etc. Firstly, I'm not sure how to feed that back to his dad. I feel it's not my place to be getting involved, but on the other hand, I want to advocate for my son and how this is making him feel.
Then there was another incident yesterday. I took the boys for haircuts cuts and they wanted to show their dad, so the boys did a video call and he was away in Ireland with his new wife and child. The boys didn't even know he was going to Ireland. After the video call they were both pretty upset and frustrated that their dad was away in Ireland and they hadn't been invited again.
I've tried reassuring them that they are loved and they know that, but I think my ex husband is really damaging his relationship with the boys, especially the oldest as they're being excluded from trips and holidays.
How can I approach this? It's such an awkward one as I don't really want to be the person telling him how his actions are impacting the boys. Our relationship is pretty fragile, there had been DV and lots of controlling behaviour so I don't think having that conversation will go down well.

By not telling your ex husband how his sons are feeling you are protecting no one but him. You have to tell him and if you don't, you are definitely not advocating for your sons.

Why wouldn’t you attempt to have all your children on holiday with you?

Ghastly behaviour, does he propose a holiday with just the boys minus the other child and wife? If not, completely unfair.

Same dad raised me and siblings alone. He wasn't always a good parent either whilst he provided and took us on holidays he was careless with some of the friends he allowed in our childhoods. He eventually remarried when I was a teenager and prioritised his new wife and her kids over his own kids, if we voiced these things he'd tell us at least he didn't leave us and if we didn't like his choices we were welcome to find our mother or put ourselves into care. I actually have nothing to do with either parent any more

Your Ex has asked you to find out why your eldest child is misbehaving is just another way to get at you @SmileWithStyle he knows exactly why his sons feels the way they do but he acting like he is puzzled and cares. It will all kick off once you explain and of course he will be blaming it all on you and calling it parent estrangement. Don’t fall for his mind games. He might get angry at your son’s for opening up to you and tell them to keep quiet and not shit stir!
Your priority is your boys, don’t pretend everything is ok because your eldest knows it’s not and will mistrust your words. You sit them down and tell them you will always be there for them and love them forever. Let them pour out their heartbreak to you, let them be heard and comfort them but don’t try and make excuses. You are their safety their constant but you see if you can get them therapy.

I didn’t say you were bad parents, no need to get defensive. Thing is a lot of divorced parents do this with their “new” family without thinking about the consequences and upset it causes for the older child(ren)

personally though yes I think if you (the general you, not you specifically) are going on a family holiday you go with all children and plan for when they can be part of the experience. A lot of people will agree, a lot will disagree, don’t get upset by one person on the internet! The hurt comes when it’s when one person seems to have moved on and forgotten the older child which doesn’t sound like your situation so calm down.

Just tell your ex the truth. Why are you trying to protect the feelings of a man who has dropped the parenting ball?

I have mixed thoughts about this. Advocating for your sons - yes. But ultimately it isn't your responsbility to maintain your ex's relationship with his children. And, even if you do speak up, it will continue. And they will go through the hurt over and over again.
Sorry if this next bit sounds naive, but if the DV and control starts up with the new wife you don't want your sons witnessing that. You aren't in their household, you can't control what they see or hear (I appreciate this would have been difficult for you when you were married, but at least you were aware of what had happened. Things behind their closed door- you have no idea). It will hurt them either way, but your ex has already shown his behaviour towards them. I'd be inclined to mention it once, then if it continues try to ease your sons' pain and if they want to cut ties, allow them to do that and get therapy. My sister constantly fights her ex for him to take an interest in their daughter, but I honestly don't know why. My niece knows, and has done for years, what a prick he is and most of the time doesn't want to go to his house..but my sister still holds this belief its important they have a relationship. It's just getting hurt time and time again. I'm not sure why new wives find this neglect attractive and don't think it wont happen to them one day?
It's also telling your son spoke to you about it, and not his Dad.

I think that is a great idea. With drawings too if expressing in words is difficult.

I honestly wouldn’t do this. My “dad” knew, I’d told him and I was very articulate, even at 10. The fact that I had told him and nothing changed was the hardest thing for me to accept.
OPs ex has form for violence and abuse. He knows, he just doesn’t care.

Your oldest is probably old enough to say no to going to his dad’s. Don’t make excuses for his dad’s behaviour and don’t say things like ‘he loves you so much’ because you don’t know and you don’t want your sons thinking this is love. I can see their relationship being even more toxic or non existent when he starts high school.

To the boys I would explain it as : dad actually just wants a holiday with his wife. It’s not about the baby, the baby just goes everywhere with the wife. If he and the wife divorced he wouldn’t take the baby away on her own, he would go on holiday with his friends or his new girlfriend. Also the new wife wants to do trips and bring her husband and she has to bring the baby,
To the ex -
I would feed back verbatim with quotes of what your son has said but don’t tell your ex what to do. Ask him if he’s open to any suggestions or ideas for helping the boys feel more included etc , then if he agrees it could be ideas eg taking them on holiday during school hols (with or without wife and baby sister) planning some special time etc, and including them in babies care/talking to the baby about how great her big brothers are in front of them etc

well done you you sound like a fab mum - I also have a narc ex who moved on exceptionally quickly

as they get older you may want to offer them to be at yours more

As I says in my longer post, I think they key point to make is that it’s dad wanting to holiday with his wife , not that he’s choosing baby over them

The advice I give above aims to support siblings relationships which will be importabt in the future

Ah ha! Someone with some sense!

This is not only an excellent way to explain, but the most truthful too.

This.
I was the pushed out kid
Even when he died the admin went to me because "you're the eldest"

Don't try and hide what a prick he is, the kids already know.

If there were a very valid reason why the older ones would be very sensitive to this, such as their dad has gone and moved in with another woman and seems very busy parenting and being a family with her and forgetting about them, and you’re still taking multiple holidays without the older ones, then yes you would be.

I wouldn’t even bother. Just tell him he has to talk to his son himself. It’s very clear to me (been through it) that your sons will see their Dad less and less until they’re low or no contact. Not the end of the world for you as he sounds like a see you next Tuesday. Sad for the kids but you’ve done your best and they’ll get through it. 3 years isn’t long to be remarried and have another child isn’t really? Shows how deep his feeling run! I left the Dad to my eldest children and I was still a bit sad about the family unit being broken at least 18mths down the line. I think he doesn’t care about them. Some men find boys (especially teenage ones) very difficult. Brace yourself, it’s going to get worse between the eldest and your ex.

Your ex husband is a dick. And will end up not seeing his sons when they are old enough. As I totally agree with your sons - holidays are for all the children. Not just his new one

The topic of the thread is the poster thinking about what, if anything, she says to this violent man. I’m suggesting that she says and does nothing to help him or promote the relationship which is not IMO in the children’s interest. Short term pain for long term gain.

This. This is perfect

I do think it's useful to say that to OP.

Dsis spent years being far to accomodating with her first abusive ex - she'd spent years prior to split being taught to say how high when he said jump.

I think the kids often see the situation before adults are ready to admit things.

It's the ex reponsblity to manage his relationship with his all his kids - and if he wants to go on holiday with his new child and partner - which as PP says it fine and normal in many situations- but then explaining that to the kids is his job and his to manage fall out not OPs.

Op I'd go with I have spoken with DS but it clear it's an issue only you can sort with him - and reassure son you'll be there. Saying the actual issue however neutrally to a violent ex opens door to accusations of parental alienation and it being Op fault.

there had been DV and lots of controlling behaviour

Right, so your ex is a nasty piece of work. He's not going to change OP and challenging him about how he manages his shiny new life with his shiny new wife and baby is just going to put you back in the firing line.

Rather than get involved in all that, I think I'd spend my time gently lowering my kids' expectations that he's going to be a great dad and continuing to ensure that they feel important and loved when they're with you.

Your ex is never going to be a great dad and I suspect his new wife and DD will one day work that out for themselves too

I know that teachers have a lot on their plate, but its always a good idea to keep them in the picture with any change/ issues at home, that might impact your child's behaviour/ performance in school. They DO sometimes pass on feedback to parents, which can come better from a third party.

Tell the dad what they said. The ball is then in his court. They sound like great boys and you a lovely mum

Agree. This is great. If he ignore or kicks off you tried.