DD (16) physically retaliated in a fight with DS (6). I don’t know what to do.

[CandidPearlWasp]

Hi everyone. I’m having a very tough time with my children and hoping for some advice.

My DD is 16, and my son (her half brother) is 6. DD splits her time 50/50 between our house and my ex husband’s house.

Recently my son has been having behavioural challenges. Our physician suspects he has ODD and ADHD, and we are awaiting therapy and services for him. In the meantime, he has explosive and sometimes violent meltdowns and everyday tasks are a battle when he’s not getting his way. He has hit, punched, pulled hair, bit, etc. all of us and it’s been awful, but we can usually deescalate the situation, but since he’s a tall boy and weighs 65lbs it does hurt.

Two weeks ago my DD was in her bedroom watching something on her iPad, which her father bought for her. We do not have one for my son, so he’s been very intrigued by it and she’s let him use it before. This time, he went in and said he wanted to play on it. She said no. He started to have a verbal meltdown and she said “I said no, get out of my room please”. This escalated into him climbing onto her bed, hitting her in the face and pulling her hair. She then grabbed him by the hair, got off the bed by standing up while holding his hair and dragged him out of her room and across the hall by the hair. He was screaming in pain and fear and she threw him into his room, said “that doesn’t feel good, does it?” and slammed the door.

I was outside as this happened and alerted by the nanny cam we have downstairs. I rushed in and ran into my 6 year old’s room to calm him down, as he was wailing. My 16 year old came in and got angry with me saying it’s all always about him, even though he was “a little psycho who attacked her”. I told her that I understood it’s not okay he attacked her, but he’s a small child and what she did wasn’t okay. She left for her father’s that night and hasn’t been back, is barely speaking to me and won’t speak to or apologize to her brother. She’s made it clear to me she thinks she did nothing wrong.

I’m at a loss - about how to handle my son, how to reconnect with my daughter and how to move forward as a family.

I’ve got bigger age gaps than this in my sibling group and that’s a situation I can relate to. It’s probably better he learns within his sibling group that this won’t be tolerated than in the big wide world - maybe this is why siblings often fight like cat and dog. I’m not saying it’s right, and they might need some help to make things ok again, it this is take as old as time.

I feel she went a little too far but perhaps he will think twice before doing it again :/

Agree...

OP prob wont be back but I'd be surprised if he didn't think twice before laying hands on his sister again...

Children with additional needs NEED extra stricter parenting with more rules and a parent to be on to them all the time! NOT letting off with a there there and dumps the y for his bad behavior!!! Your poor DD is having to attacked in her own bedroom and her own mother doesn’t even protect her or stop it!!

Everything said here.

It's clear from your actions who your favourite child is.
Your daughter's room is HER space. That is HER sanctuary and if she doesn't want her brother in there dicking about and touching her things, then NO means NO.
Why are you rushing to comfort him when he was the one in the wrong? And why is she expected to apologise and not the other way round?
You are teaching your children that she has no right to boundaries (false) and that he can get away with murder (also false)

How do you normally handle his getting violent? And what strategies have you given DD for dealing with him when he’s behaving in a way that isn’t fair on her?

Does her comment that it’s all about him have some validity? If so, I think the reconnecting with her probably needs something along the lines of - taking just her out for some one on one time (likely while she’s still staying with her father). If she does a sport of some other hobby you can go and watch, ensuring you make the time to do that, not just no but for the rest of her time before she goes off to uni/gets a job/etc. Talking to her a bit more about her life, her friends, school, friends, what she’s hoping to do over the next couple of years. And, of course, talking to her about what you can do to make her time in your home tolerable. Does she, for instance, have a lock on her bedroom door? If not, that would be a good first step. Is she strong enough to restrain DS if she gets taught some decent techniques? Is there a bribe she could use on him? Do you have a way for her to signal you when it gets too much for her?

And how do you deal with DS now? When he’s attacked her in the past, have you made him apologize or otherwise make it up to her? (Once he’s calm, of course). You say you normally descalate, but that he still hurts people - sounds like it’s not descalated fast enough? Do you have ways for him to focus his emotional distress on things that aren’t people? Ways for him to ask for things when it feels too much? A place he can go and scream and punch where he won’t get in trouble? Does he have rules or a schedule that minimizes his opportunities to target his sister when she’s there?

I don’t think there’s much point in forcing her to apologize. It won’t be sincere and it will breed a lot of resentment. She over reacted, but she did have cause to defend herself and, it sounds, little support in handling his outbursts in a way that doesn’t leave her in an unfair position. I would just talk to her (once you have established an effective response for her when she is in that position in the future) about how hard it is for DS and how his responses are not the same.

I’m not sure about the responses saying maybe he’s learnt a lesson. If his behaviour is down to ODD and ADHD then that won’t work, will it? Or does fear overcome that lack of self-regulation? I know it’s a strong and primitive response.

To move forward you need to mediate apologies. Him first and her second. Hopefully it will reach them both about violence, consequences and apologising.

you need to have strong words with your son to not do this. Would he do this to someone external to your family? I bet, they would react much worse.

Also OP please don’t listen to everyone saying this is a lesson and he won’t do it again. As long as the underlying issues prevail he WILL do this again no matter how many ass beatings he receives. Most people who believe contrary probably are scared of fighting so they avoid physical altercations (nothing wrong with this btw), but some people are about that life and they don’t seem to comprehend that.

Honestly good for her. He won’t do it again. Sometimes a taste of your own medicine is a good teacher.

Sorry but I’m on your DD’s side. Why is he going in her room with you “outside” when you know he is violent??

Better he learns a harsh lesson from his sister than someone at school etc. I don’t condone violence usually but she probably reached the end of her rope. And your first thought was to go to him adding more rejection. If I had been upset enough to physically assault a child I would be devastated. Yet your first priority is that she apologises and gave you even said sorry to HER? And checked she’s ok?

Heartless

Obviously, it wasn’t right but I would be interested to hear if he ever does it again to her?

Why are you leaving him when you know he’s violent? Your DD isn’t his parent and should not have to deal with that.

suggest getting a lock for her bedroom going forward so she can keep DS out.

400+ posts and no reply from op...and a kid who weight "65lbs" ...

She won't apologise, but does he....ever?

I have a 5m and a 15m. They occasionally get into physical altercations. Most always started by the 5yo. The older boy will put up with a lot from his little brother.
It sounds like your daughter has put up with a lot from her little brother. I don't think she needs to apologize to her little brother as he started it. He is a bigger child and could seriously hurt her. She is only 16 and lost her temper, so I would draw a line under it and maybe put a lock on her door so she can be in her room without having to worry about him coming in.

It’s the same old story isn’t it? Women (and men) who favour the child they have from their latest partner. Another happy blended family. Poor daughter, no wonder she left to her Dads and isn’t speaking to you. Be careful you don’t destroy the relationship with her.

And you are straining the relationship between her and your son too, neither of their needs are being met.

Tbf, I have a cousin who, when he was a child, was "a right bruiser"', as the family referred to him (I'm going back about 40 odd years now). Bloody massive. 😅 Not overweight, just very tall and big for his age - e.g. he'd be mistaken for a six year old when he was three. His mum struggled with him as well, as I recall. OP describes her DS as tall. Perhaps his dad is 6' 5" and bulky and DS takes after him. Who knows.

I really feel for you. It is very hard managing children where one has additional needs, particularly when there’s an age gap . As a Mogher you want to protect your child but when 2 children have conflicting needs it’s an impossible task . No criticism here from me but I would say I do tend to side with your daughter and I do not feel she should be made to apologise . Whether you agree with that or not , surely you must see your son absolutely should apologise ,without question . There is not justification for his behaviour . Yes, he probably has little or no impulse control and is unable to control his violent response to a large extent , BUT what he did was wrong and unprovoked and that should be made clear to him . He can not go through life attacking people and being unchecked because of his condition .
I have an 18 year old son and he was similar to yours in his younger years . He now has a much younger brother who will goad him to the nth degree. Because of their physical differences I’m glad I decided to come down hard on any violence when he was young . You can’t stop it completely but you can try and manage it and put systems in place to try and avoid it. I know it’s not the easy thing some posters on here think though. Best of luck

Exactly. The idea that one scary physical altercation is all it takes to correct behaviour is so simplistic and unrealistic. It’s more of a fantasy people tell themselves.

And sorry for your own situation. It must have beeb very tough for you all.

I've got an autistic child. I really do hate to see people say that ND is used as an excuse and the problem is parenting. Jumping on someone and violently attacking them because someone does not get their own way isn't really a meltdown though is it? It's a violent tantrum to get their own way. It's not like a retraint collapse after masking, sensory overload or struggle with transitions. It's anger from not getting his sisters tablet.
What your DD did was technically wrong and she needs to learn that, now she is 16 and approaching adulthood she could be prosecuted for assaulting a child. In all honesty though I don't blame her. Many parents would struggle to keep their cool in that situation, never mind a 16yo who probably feels that she always comes second best to the child attacking her.

Not that, more that the post is written in British English but most people outside of the US use either kgs or pounds and stone. I don't normally play post detective but it seems off to me

The weight thing I can just about believe, there are kids in my 7yo's class a bit bigger (though it is heavier than my smallish 10 year old)

It is tough to parent a ND child with this profile with siblings and keep everyone safe. I speak from experience.

DS was wrong to attack her. You need to give him appropriate support and ways to manage his emotions. All the people saying this might teach him, it probably won’t. Teaching a child with this ND profile to regulate and not lash out is a long, slow process. You have to take measures to keep other people safe whilst he learns that. My younger children know if I tell them to go to a room and stay there because ND eldest is having a meltdown it is for their safety, not because they are in the wrong.

You need to discuss with DD measures to keep her safe e.g. lockable door (make sure you can open it from the outside in case of emergency). DD can defend herself physically but it shouldn’t be excessive or punitive. This time is understandable, but you need to give her strategies for what to do in different scenarios, with priority being safety of all and quick escalation to a grown up. Understandable that she feels unfairly treated on this one.

You weren’t wrong to try to calm DS and ensure he would not hurt himself in his meltdown (not uncommon for a child with this profile). You need to explain to DD why you made that choice, due to his age, and risk factors. She was not as hurt so less risk. A quick check on her ideally before you run to him, but when you don’t know what’s happened in the run up it’s hard, but you should assess both re risk, regardless of fault and communicate with her. Teach your DD that DS won’t go uncorrected/without consequence but ensuring safety and then calming and regulating him/others is needed first. The teachable moment will be later. But you do need to follow through on that.

He's still six, and DD is still much heavier and taller than him. Not OK to abuse a young child by dragging him around by his hair. DD had many other options.

I’m going to start OP by saying that I was the eldest DC growing up and I still to this day resent my parents for always saying ‘You’re the oldest. You should know better’

You say your DD retaliated, she wasn’t the instigator, your DS6 was. What consequences has he faced? Are you expecting DD to apologise without DS doing it first? Violence is not acceptable at any age and whilst I don’t condone DDs response your DS is old enough to know that you do not put your hands on another person.