My children are badly behaved and I don’t know what to do

[magpiemagpuy]

DH and I have two children. Boys aged 6 & 8 and I feel I finally have to admit their behaviour feels beyond my parenting skills.

We’ve done our best but it seems we’ve missed a step somewhere and now they’re very difficult at times. I’m not sure if that’s parenting in general or just our children.

Individually they’re reasonably behaved (most of the time) but together it feels like we’re verging on them being feral.

I feel bad for them and myself if I’m being really honest because they’re actually living kind little boys but I can see why other parents may not see that.

They can be extremely boisterous. This morning they were hitting each other at home and name calling, this continued in the school playground with my youngest kicking my eldest.

At pickup they were being rough with another child whose parent looked understandably unimpressed. Pushing and shoving and because there are two of them they look like bullies.

They come home and eldest just doesn’t listen. Needs to be told numerous times to do anything and backchats/calls names and youngest slapped his brother so hard he left a handprint in his back.

Im at the end of my tether. Their behaviour is on their terms and we give time out and remove screen time as a punishment and make them apologise to people when they’re unkind but it doesn’t sink in. They just do not care.

Hoping not to be roasted for my offspring and could really do with some advice on how I can turn this around.

I have no idea because mine are the same age and they’re exactly the same!

Every time you see that kind of behaviour, sharp verbal warning to make your displeasure clear, then physically separate them

If they are pushing another child, physically intervene, tell them to apologise, then remove them from the situation if it isn't school.

When they get it right, lots of enthusiasm from you. When they refuse to stop, cancel a treat because naughty boys do not get treats.

Over and over and over again.

@magpiemagpuywhat do school say and do they get invited on play dates?

The kids I know who behave badly have parents who constantly groan, threaten consequences but don't follow through.

Just simple, clear, reasonable, not shouty 'if x happens again, y will happen'. Then do it, again in a calm and clear manner.

I see the best behaved DC produced by parents who give plenty of positive encouragement coupled with very clear rules, expectations and boundaries, modelled by the parents.

Do you ever think that you had them too close together to know if you could actually cope with all the demands of parenthood at different ages?

This seems a bit harsh jeez 😬 she's asking for help, she knows she fucked up.

I am an old crank, so please ignore me if this doesn't resonate- my kids are in their 20s...

I would get rid of all screens, for everyone, for at least a month. Not as a punishment, but as an opportunity to see how life is without the option of looking at a screen. I think this would only work if parents also put away their screens (except for working in separate room from the kids).

Then I would interrupt and immediately stop all really bad behaviour (so hitting before school- immediate horrified reaction from parent- kid goes in room alone or in the car with the door closed, parent standing outside the car watching, even if it means everyone is late). I would try to turn anything merely boisterous or slightly obnoxious (but not unkind) into a good direction, if possible.

I would try to find ways of letting the boys save face if they are being annoying, while also making it clear that they need to stop. If mine were throwing toys rather than cleaning up, I used to occasionally have success with things like saying: 'OK you can throw 3 more things - throw them out the window! let's see how far they will go, and then you are going to pick everything up'. ... this may not work for yours, but I found that if I accepted the annoying behaviour but put a limit on it, sometimes the kid would control it.

When dealing with annoying but not mean behaviour, for my children, doing something unexpected sometimes got their attention, and then they were willing to help me out by doing what I needed them to do.

I think it helps parents in this position to know that it isnt down to anyone else so they know who has to do the work. It's not dissimilar to dog owners actually.

No judgment from me. You could be doing everything perfectly for all we know and you've asked for help - well done.

First, I would suggest getting your hands on a copy of How to talk so your kids will listen. There's a version for little kids. Get both.

What are their personalities like? Eg. Does one over stimulate the other, does one feel one threatened by the other? Is there equality between them and does Dad treat them the same? Are there things they worry about?

A good telling off is not going to make a difference. I would approach this as a problem that is a problem for everyone and start with the feelings. Say what you see and acknowledge them briefly. Find out why they misbehaved. They may be at the end of their tether about something and need space from each other. Look at how they responded and the consequences of that. Not just the consequences you impose but how it leaves everyone feeling, including them.

There are often excellent parenting courses run locally and online. It's well worth going to one. Make sure Dad is on board. Practice being assertive.

Don't set a negative tone. If you're anticipating bad behaviour, it's easy to use language and tone that put the child into that role without giving them a chance to be different. Speak to them as if they're likeable and trustworthy she make it clear that's how you see them. If their behaviour is not up to scratch, you're disappointed but they are still likeable - you just have a problem now to solve together.

Regarding feelings, there might be systems you can try where they can alert you if they're starting to feel overwhelmed. You can then step in and help them try other solutions - walking away, going outside, going up to their room, talking to you.

I don't think their lives sound as interesting as perhaps they could be. Walking the dog on a daily basis is harmless but swimming lessons, judo, dance, football could all be more entertaining and help them to feel engaged and proud of themselves.

Alrighty then. Think we can see why things are the way they are...

Full moon soon doesn't help

My pair are WILD two days before the full moon 😳😳😳

OP my kids are not allowed any screen during the week - it’s unnecessary and causes bad behaviour. Take away screens during weekdays and I bet you’ll see an improvement in their behaviour.

Do they get enough physical exercise? DD needs a LOT. She used to be absolutely frightful at that age on a Saturday if we weren't up and doing asap. We signed her up to a ridiculously early swimming class in the end.

Personally I wouldn’t allow them to have the iPad at all moving forward. I don’t think it does many kids any favours. Screen time generally really.
As others have asked, are they getting enough physical exercise? Positive direction for all that energy, and all that.

You need to stop them doing something they really care about.

My mum would have belted me good and hard for that behaviour and i would have been too terrified to do it again.

This is good advice. Plenty of activity and out of the house as much as possible - but they’re still hard work!
I’ve read every time parenting book - follow all the advice but the best thing is physical activity and separating them as much as possible.

Like vicious, reactive dogs?

My dc are older now but I've seen people suggest getting a jar filled with balls/tokens of some kind. Tokens can be won or lost as a consequence of good and bad behaviour. After an agreed amount of time if there are x number of tokens left there is an agreed upon treat.
Being able to win as well as lose gives motivation to behave and its important to 'catch them' behaving well as well as pulling them up on bad behaviour.
I haven't tried it so it's just a suggestion.

You sound like a great mum and like you’re doing a great job. I completely understand how overwhelming two boys that age can be. I also understand worrying about being over the top with punishments and consequences and how easy it is for that to backfire.

I wouldn’t focus on consequences, taking away iPads etc., or even awards - they only seem to be a temporary solution.
At the time behaviour is crossing boundaries you tell them that and if you need to physically separate them/ take away their device because it’s supper time, you do that.
It helps to show empathy - I understand you’re tired - and then you stick to your rule without aggression/ threats - x, y, z needs to happen now. And just help them follow the rule - help with completing tasks, keep away unwanted temptations, be supportive and firm.

A lot of one to one bonding - mummy and child time 20 mins a day? - will work magic. You play with them for a bit and they end up actually hearing you when you say put your coat on! Also, little chats on their own to see if there is something worrying them and is bringing up all this fighting urges, etc.

So consistent authority, with real empathy and understandbig; lots of intentional bonding time. Keeping calm is an extra bonus - I know how hard it can be and you start scolding etc but then they just backchat… It’s hard! You’ve got this.

Yes that’s why we all behaved ourselves but you’re not allowed to do that anymore.

Look, I don’t know who you are but will you fuck off and let us reasonable people who actually parent and have had children to deal with this one. You’re clearly some old bloke with dogs and nothing better to do.

Punishments don’t work for mine. They raise the general stress levels which means they are more inclined to lose it and less capable of handling minor irritations. Letting go of the punishment concept was hard though.

Assuming they are old enough for a decent conversation, I’d sit them down at a calm time - together or separate, whichever works best - and ask them why they lose control, what they want people to think of them, how they would like life to be. Try to identify triggers. Maybe they need to spend more time apart, or maybe it’s resentment about something. And I asked mine what they would do if they were me, since my job was to bring them up to be the best versions of themselves.

If they are listened to, they are more inclined to try to behave. If they understand why it’s necessary- and I do spell it out, tell them people won’t like them and they won’t get party invites/PE partners etc - again they are more likely to try.

But they may simply clash and need to be separated more.