Grandparent slapped grandchild

[bluestoneboys]

How do you deal with a grandparent who slapped a grandchild round side of face, left a handprint, then claims ‘it wasn’t hard’ and ‘it was the only way to prevent further harm from angry dog’
child has autism and adhd as well as history of SA on fathers side so has no contact with them. He was shouting, swearing and hitting at the time (struggling with self regulating usually but these episodes are getting worse)
grandparents see him as disrespectful and rude
Currently he now has no unsupervised contact with said grandparent, he has lots of outside agencies involved due to previous abuse and very worried now that my own family will end up being the nail in the coffin when it comes to social services due to their lack of understanding and support, but also feel so sad for him because he doesn’t seem to now have a solid relationship with anyone but me.
Family place all blame on me and say that he’s just got a lack of discipline (which is not true imo)
Just about losing my mind now as I just want him to feel safe and happy - hes only 8 and already classed as suicidal by medical professionals and he’s had all the therapy he can have but it’s no use when everyone else is on a different page 💔

Call the police, obviously. An adult has assaulted a child.

I suspect said Grandparent would have a very different version of events.

I'm actually a bit sick of adults telling their children (within earshot) that they're ADHD/autistic / have demand avoidance blah blah. and I say that as someone who DOES have a child with autistm and ADHD.

Those conditions do not gie a carte blanche for shitty behaviour and it's quite possible that your grandparents feel (rightly or wrongly) that he does just need tougher parenting and simply needed a good clip round the ear, old school style parenting.

He may or he may not.

I"m in no way saying what they did was acceptable as we now don't parent like this - but we had a lot less badly behaved children in the 80's and none of this pathological avoidance demand crap (that I just don't buy exists and you can't convince me it does)

Given the huge backstory which has conveniently been left out, I'm probably sat on the fence with this one saying are you absolutely sure cutting off the one last bit of support you have is the right thing to do?

My child has issues with self regulating but he sure as hell doesn't swear, shout or hit because he knows damn well that's not how to behave. He did it once - as a three year old and I've made damn sure that behaviour is not happening in my house. We have a protective room he can go into and he can punch the punchbag in there. My child is kind and incredibly well behaved and a bit sick of other ADHD kids making out like it's ok to be a little git.

We as adults need to stop giving these children excuses for shitty behaviour.

I am so sorry that you and your child are going through this, sending you big hugs. You sound like a lovely, dedicated mum 💐

I'm in no way saying what they did was acceptable as we now don't parent like this - but we had a lot less badly behaved children in the 80's and none of this pathological avoidance demand crap (that I just don't buy exists and you can't convince me it does

Oh lovely.
And from a parent who says their child is autistic.

"MY child does fine. Therefore, other children with similar diagnoses should ALSO do fine. And if I had my way I'd make damn sure they behaved."

Soooo insightful and helpful.

Crazy. There may have been a lot less badly behaved kids in the 80’s but there is a LOT more adults now, who were those 80’s kids, suffering with anxiety, depression, receiving late diagnosis of Autism/ADHD.

Parenting through fear might look good at the time if your kids behave but believe me those kids fucking hate you 20 years later when they’re in therapy with no self-esteem, crippling anxiety, insecure attachment issues and depression.

I also don't buy that there were fewer badly behaved kids in the 80's, or any era. How on earth would anyone work that out? What metric are we using? The standards of the time period or the standards of today? It's just self-indulgent "back in my day" golden age fallacy as usual.

And as you say, who's to say that the kids who were scared, shouted or hit into submission of the 80's aren't the traumatised or unhappy adults of today? There's a reason that parenting and educational practices evolve.

But the slapped child ISNT afraid of the GP- he is asking to go in the house and see her!

The child has been assaulted.

The only thing that would make me question whether it is a case of 'no unsupervised contat ever again and no trust left for mum at all' is the dog. If it was a case of:

• child in meltdown resulting in
• dog getting angry, distressed and dangerous and
• the only adult in sight is a (possiby) quite elderly, (possibly) not very strong woman.
• Woman can't touch the dog in case it attacks
• and is frightened that dog is about to attack the child in meltdown.
• So she tried to shock the child out of meltdown by slapping them.

Not the right approach of course but I could see how it would happen out of desperation (kind of how people used to try and shock people out of hysterics by slapping them).

If it wasn't a situation like that then no, I would be severely limiting contact between them from now on.

And if it was a situation like that then I would be forbidding any contact between the dog and the child in future.

You are colluding and enabling open abuse of your child that in your own words has complex needs. I am speechless as to how you consider the grandparent ever having contact again.

That’s horrible — the people you think you can rely on and they do this . Sounds like they don’t understand your child’s additional needs. They don’t need to be experts in autism to know that removing the dog and calming the child was the best option.
All you can do is either supervise their contact very carefully or cut contact altogether. Hopefully as their tenant you’ve got a tenancy agreement and all the paperwork which gives you protection in law.
And angry dogs and children never go together, your parents should know that at least.

I'm so sorry for what you are going through though glad your DS is more peaceful at home.

I wanted to say something about the mental health issue. When our son was a little bit older he expressed suicidal thoughts too, and as he also has ADHD the paediatrician took a look at his meds and worked out the stimulant he was on was at a very high dose for his age, and was causing his anxiety to ramp up. I wonder if you might be able to look at that?

We got rejected by CAMHS despite him having clear plans of how he thought he could commit suicide - gives me shivers now thinking of it.

The child has also assaulted the parent in the past. Back story has been left out in the post.

I think calling the police for a one-time event by an otherwise known and respected grandparent is ridiculous. MN in LTB totally unrealistic mode. Utterly and totally disproportionate. The child will live and has not suffered grievous bodily harm. This has never occurred before

If you think it unforgivable, simply prevent said GP from ever looking after them again.

On a pragmatic level, it is a sign that they are struggling to cope now. An 8 year old child with ADHD and poor emotional regulation, who is now strong enough to resist any physical redirection who is swearing and kicking, and you say it is getting worse. I mean it's a struggle to manage a toddler in melt down. I can imagine an 8 year old is very hard to cope with, especially an older person. Even dangerous to them if they get in the way of a kick. I am very sorry OP, but sometimes joe blog people, even family members, do not always have the best skills to look after children with challenging needs, neither is it necessarily fair to expect them to be able to manage, though it would be ideal if they did.

So I would see this more as, they are out of their depth? or it is becoming harder for them? What can be done to help facilitate smoother interaction than purely focusing on the slap.

Could they do with more support when they do have supervision?

I think you feel torn as to dealing with the pragmatics and facilitating an important relationship and being seen to protect your child. But I think you need to put things in context.

i can’t even imagine how awful this all is for you to cope with. I know you feel lonely as a single parent and undoubtedly suffering your own trauma knowing what his dad did to him but you absolutely have to cut contact. His need for safety and to be shown that he is safe- from anyone at all who shows him harm- is paramount. It sounds like they might be your own support network but they aren’t. Not with that attitude and actions.

💐 do the right thing, probably for both of you.

My parents are in their 50s and both lead active lifestyles… the dog I do not believe would have gone for my child, both mine and my parents dogs will choose to protect a child over an adult

‘it was the only way to prevent further harm from angry dog’

How true is this I wonder?

Your son was being harmed by an angry dog & the only thing to do was slap him hard around the face?

Even when smacking was considered acceptable, was that ever a hard slap around the face?

Stop all contact immediately and report to the police ..that is so bad ..grandparents these days thinking they have the rights to your child because your their child it's vile behaviour..I would be so so angry 😡

@bluestoneboys please can you explain exactly what happened with regard to the incident with the dog.

Jeez!

Your parents are younger than me!

Omg! Slapping a child round the face is horrible, just horrible. I could never let that GP near them again. Your poor child!

No, smacking was only ever a sharp tap on the bum in our house. Slapping round the face??? Jesus.

Oh wow, I am surprised to hear they're in their fifties. I feel like the benefit of the doubt could be more easily given if they were elderly, rightly or wrongly, but fifties?? I expect a slap round the face to be given by someone who has grown up with drastically different life experiences.

Yes he can be hard to handle. But also social services have said that any contact with them that is unsupervised would obviously be seen as me not protecting him and they would be forced to ‘take action’
I didn’t personally report it but did stop contact, it was reported by his therapist who saw him literally the day after, so even though I would have made calls for support etc, it was out of my hands.
my family believes that ‘if he wants to stay with me then he’ll learn when to stay quiet’ which is a huge red flag to me and obviously would be the nail in the coffin for social services hearing things spoken about like that, that’s basically emotional abuse or manipulation of some sort.