Disciplining 2 year old

[Roxyrocks]

Hi all,

I'm currently completely at my wits end with my 2 1/2 year old.

She's lashing out frequently- hitting, pinching and pulling (main targets are her 6mo brother and me)

When we tell her off and explain She's hurting people she just laughs and says we're making her sad if we shout at her

Just before she lashes out she sometimes verbalises the thought ie "I hurt mummy, I hurt brother"

Really struggling to know how to put an end to the behaviour as so far she has found all efforts hilarious. I've tried shouting, calmly explaining and time out

Thanks

This mad "tap" concept is a nonsense, as already said. Either it's gentle and therefore meaningless, or it's hard enough to hurt which is the intended mechanism to "discipline" the child.

Let's assume you mean "tap" in the sense of causing pain to the child as a consequence. There is plenty of evidence that physical pain-based punishments are ineffective and cause long term poorer outcomes for children.

There is no evidence that other methods such as removing attention are cruel or harmful.

What? That’s abhorrent, you mean you hit a child who is an infant in nappies, so hard they feel it through their nappy?

why are you saying tap . It’s clearly not a tap if a child can feel it and it causes pain. That’s a slap. Is there an language barrier here?

and the child isn’t isolated, you’d think the poster wrote they locked them in a dungeon. Isolating them for goodness sake

when you move to downplaying assuaukting your child , even an infant, is a tap, and removing them from the situation you escalate to cruely isolating them, you lose all credibility

at least have the balls to stand up and say, yes I assault my children, I hit them so hard it hurts.

If it was genuinely a quick tap on a nappy they would barely feel it so it would be completely pointless and not achieve anything

So we all know that when people are talking about smacking "working" they mean hard enough to cause pain

So the only reason those who are advocating for it are backtracking to euphemisms about tapping is because they know its wrong.

Exactly. Tap a child on the bottom and they will think you’re playing, or trying to get their attention or encouraging them, it is not a form of deterrent or punishment,

the only way for it to work is to slap them one so hard it hurts, and that’s assault.

calling it a tap fools no one. The people hitting their kids aren’t tapping them, they are assaulting them so hard it hurts.

Lol. I'm very glad that sensible posters can tell that when I said move away, remove the attention etc I did not in fact mean lock the child in a dungeon until she's obedient. 😂

Imagine insisting that smacking a two year old is not damaging at all but moving into a different room for a short time is "incredibly cruel" 🙄

"I don't play with people who hit me"

This is so incredibly powerful too

So many people stay with abusers because they question whether its their fault, did they do something wrong, should they change their behaviour to stop it happening again

All the kind of thinking that is reinforced when a child is smacked because they did something wrong, it was their fault and they are being taught to change their behaviour to stop it happening again

Where as "I don't play (associate) with people who hit me" is such an important life lesson to learn young. That its not your fault, you haven't caused the hitting and you know absolutely that it's fine to stop spending time with the person doing the hitting

So you've never done it but you know a tap on the backside doesn't work.

Very clever, who mentioned dungeons?

Trapping the child in one room with a gate and going off with the baby to another room is cruel, it is rejection and will probably make the 2 year old resent the baby even more.

Not sure if you deliberately twisting it or you genuinely don't understand. My point was that a tap on the backside isn't going to hurt a child particularly if they are wearing a nappy not suggesting you'd hit them hard enough to hurt.

Maybe you could have the balls to admit that trapping a child in a room with a gate and walking off an leaving them is hurtful and it lasts a hell of a lot longer than the split second the tap on backside lasts.

It doesn't have to hurt, it is the surprise of you doing something they don't expect. Only works once.

Isolation is a punishment don't pretend it isn't.

@Iwasafool "So you've never done it but you know a tap on the backside doesn't work."

There's plenty of evidence that physical chastisement (using pain as a deterrent) is ineffective and can cause longer term issues for children.

If you mean a "tap" on a nappy-covered bottom that doesn't cause any pain, well, .... that is going to be barely perceptible by the child and so, clearly, pointless. If you are using verbal redirection at the same time, then I would suggest that it is that verbal response that is having the desired effect rather than a bit of gentle tapping.

Exactly. Shutting them off in a room can be emotionally damaging.

"It doesn't have to hurt, it is the surprise of you doing something they don't expect. Only works once.

Isolation is a punishment don't pretend it isn't."

This is just more nonsense justification of physical pain as a deterrent. So now it's not pain, it's surprise. So why the need to make physical contact? Can't you surprise them in another way? Would any kind of surprise work?

No one is isolating a small child ffs. Using a stairgate as a barrier is utterly normal, standing the other side of one to your child is not isolating them.

Note that these kinds of "tapping" obsessed posters are totally failing to acknowledge any of the ongoing preventative and pre-emptive strategies that have been described.

Give over. The surprise of being patted on the bum. Is a deterrent. Something you escalate to. Sure thing.

Aw cute but you missed the part where I talked about my childhood...

Clapping suddenly would probably be a suprise. But sure let's hit them and say its because it will be a "suprise"

OP while you work this out, you need to safeguard your 6 month old.

At 2, your DD understands being sad, as she herself tells you she feels that when you shout at her.
So im assuming when she says that you are explaining that feeling for you and DS when she hurts you both.

Does she play with gentle hands with her toys, lots of praise and stickers etc for gentle hands.
Remove her from the room when she hurst. A quick " no we don't hurt eachother we use gentle hands" pick her up - put her outside the room.

Blimey, where have all these creepy smacking advocates come from? If you hit your tiny child, say ‘hit’. What’s all this ‘tap’ nonsense? Either it hurts, in which case it’s hitting, or it doesn’t, in which case what’s the point? Calling it ‘tapping’ doesn’t fool anyone.

I think it's clear who is attention seeking and acting up here (and I don't mean OP's 2 year old). Seeing as we can't use their favoured method of punishment - 'the tap', let's put them all in time out and ignore them, seems that their childhood has affected them more than they think and it's tragic and sad but it seems unlikely they'll ever realise what damage they're doing (until one day it's done to them).

Cruel? Give over. I suppose "trapping" a child in a cot is cruel too? Nope, it's a well established way of keeping them safe and contained. Ditto playpens, buggies, reins and the odd locked door.

Who mentioned rejection? You can go with the two year old on their side of the baby gate, to talk about behaviour/consequences while the baby plays safely on their baby-proofed side.

But anything to justify smacking a two year old eh.

You missed the bit about her going off to another room with the baby, possibly because it was a bit inconvenient for you.

Isolating people certainly can be abusive, listen to some women on here who are distressed about getting the silent treatment but you think leaving a 2 year old alone in a room they can't leave is fine. No wonder kids get clingy.

Listen, we get it. You want to hit your child to discipline them and you think others should do the same. The OP has quite clearly said that she is not going to hit (slap, tap) her child. So your "advice" is not wanted nor helpful to the OP.

Good grief. Nothing I said is "inconvenient" for me but I'll spell it out again if it helps.

I said you can simply move a hitting child away from the other child. "No, that's not safe, I'm moving X away now."

I suggested baby gates with regard to a PP who queried what would happen if the hitting child kept running back and hitting.

I did not suggest keeping the child away for any considerable length of time. I did not suggest isolating the child. Baby gates are not generally a solid sheet of floor-to-ceiling metal. You can see over them, speak through them, keep talking to the child. You mentioned rejection, so I said you can go with the hitting child to talk it through.

But regardless of which side of the gate you're on, a child being separated by a baby gate for a short time so the parent can diffuse a situation is not being left alone in a room, isolated, rejected or any of the superlative nonsense you've suggested, any more than a child who is put in a playpen while the parent stacks the dishwasher.

In any event, it doesn't matter; even if you were right and separating with a baby gate were bad, that wouldn't make smacking any better, so this is whataboutery at its finest.

Anyway, I'll await the news that sixty-odd countries have criminalised separating kids with a baby gate. I won't hold my breath though. Have a nice night.

news.sky.com/story/alfie-phillips-murder-mother-sian-hedges-and-her-ex-boyfriend-jack-benham-jailed-for-murdering-toddler-in-frenzied-attack-13045247

Just leaving this here - when 'disciplining' goes wrong...