13 year old son tried to black mail me

[rob38]

My son mostly lives with his mother, he has missed most of the last two - three months of school. Since June when he has been in school he has had a detention nearly every day and has had 5 or 6 suspensions. He has had support from Camhs but just seems to be acting this way for fun, and has repeatedly told me he is choosing to mess around.

On Tuesday he stayed over with me after he said that his mother had hit him and he had hit her back (he has a social worker at the moment who I reported this to).

I got him up for school on Wednesday morning, and found him a pen to take as he didn't have a pencil case with him, and his teachers had complained about him coming to class without a pen. He refused to take the pen unless I gave him £20, I though he was joking and said to him 'are you joking? I hope you are joking', to which he replied he wasn't. He then said that he was going to mess around at school unless I gave him £20. I am aware that he blackmails his mum, and I said to him that that does not work on me and that I wanted him to tell me that he was joking, to which he said he wasnt.

I explained to him how much distress his behavior had been causing everyone and that I could not believe he was acting this way with me.

On that day I had planned to go Christmas shopping for him and was going to spend up to $1000. After more attempts at blackmail in the car I said to him that I was going to drop his stuff off at his mums, that he doesn't behave like that with me, and that I was going to give him £100 for Christmas instead of spending £1000.

"Months" is not enough, mate. It needs to be done permanently and change will be slow. Obviously, due to the issues being deep seated and traumatic. There is no quick fix. But, sure, go ahead and try a harsh, authoritarian approach and regularly threaten to abandon him to his abusive mother and cancel Christmas. That will go well, for sure.

@fedupandstuck

Months, for some responses, years for others and his whole life for others.

What has worked, with his current behavior is being harsh with him.

Continuing to approach his choice to mess around for fun, with humor, empathy, curiosity etc. is not real world.

He appears emboldened by that approach to mess around more. His head of year who has been very supportive and understanding has come to that conclusion as well.

Where he has acted like a prat, trying to blackmail his dad for 45 minutes with the threat of doing something he knows causes everyone around him serious concern and distress, I have tried a harsh response and it worked at improving his behavior.

The thing about patience and consistency is that there is a degree of irony when someone says “but those aren’t working!!”.

Jfc. Boundaries and consequences, applied with firm loving consistency. Use humour and warmth to defuse situations and de-escalate, then apply the boundary and or consequence.

You have decided what you think needs to happen, so stop wasting your time talking to the ChatGPT bots here (!) and crack on with your new harsh disciplinarian authoritarian regime. It'll go brilliantly I'm sure, after all, you've done so well with him so far.

*I don't see you as people. You are letters on a screen, it doesn't matter to me if you have taken time to respond.

This site is similar to chatgpt to me.*

Why does it not suprise me that you see (mostly) women not as real life human beings with feelings, and worthwhile life experiences but instead as service providers and emotional support machines.

@fedupandstuck

As I have posted a few times now I usually use PACE which is a therapeutic parenting technique (Playfulness Acceptance Curiosity Empathy), but he seems emboldened by it, and it is not real world.

In a few years he may need to work. And an employee is not going to use PACE after my son has messed around for fun, they are going to give him warnings and then the sack, or the sack straight off.

What do you mean by 'firm' consistency?

Jfc again. You need to re-read any material you've been given about the PACE technique. It's not about replacing boundaries and consequences with humour/curiosity or whatever. It's about how to engage with children in a way that is constructive and confidence building rather than oppositional, confrontational, aggressive, controlling. You use the techniques given by the PACE methodology to enable you to apply the boundary or consequence.

The point is, by applying PACE or any similar kind of technique, that by the time your child reaches 16, 18, they have learnt to manage their feelings and understand that there are boundaries. They will also be able to trust that their parent(s) are calm, reassuring and trustworthy adults. Rather than frightening, intimidating, aggressive, hostile and untrustworthy.

@fedupandstuck

So with PACE if my son is upset, angry, misbehaving etc. I use PACE to resolve the situation, and that has worked in the past in the way you describe, but as with school that therapeutic parenting technique seems to embolden him to misbehave at present.

The consequence I use is a screen ban after warnings, but that doesn't work as he is big enough to leave my house and go to his mums, and use screens there.

School use detentions and suspension but those don't work either as he does not care about getting an education and his best friends all get suspensions and detentions.

Bearing in mind my son is almost 6 foot, confident and intelligent, and can leave my house and walk to his mums if he doesn't like a consequence I implement, how would you reinforce a boundary?

He feels unsafe - so he's taking control - that's what I think.

He's stuck with a mother who hits him, a grand'mother' who is abusive - and then a dad who is inconsistent and sends him back to the abusive home when things get a bit hard - he has NO control here - and he is trying to get some back - using money and threats.

It's not surprising his behaviour is poor at school - my bet is he feels safe there and so is doing everything he can to prove that they will also, in the end, reject him.

He is crying out for consistency, safety and calm. When love and communication don't work - it's because they aren't a magic fix - they take TIME - so when you are being this 'amazing' dad who tries all the things for five minutes - and it doesn't work - you return to type and it shows him it's fake.

When things don't work instantly you KEEP DOING THEM - he needs to feel it's real, lifelong and reliable - do better - both of you parents.

@ghostyslovesheets

Nope, I think the reason he seems to have been emboldened recently by therapeutic parenting at my house and a therapeutic approach from school is that there arn't effective consequences at my house or school at the moment. If I give him warnings and then a screen ban, he just leaves my house and goes to his mums (she doesn't give him screen bans). At school where they give him detentions, he sees his mates in detention and where he gets a suspension he is happy to be suspended as he can game all day at his mums and sees his mates after school.

The reason that saying to him that his behavior in my care was not acceptable, and sending him back to his mum worked to improve his behavior, was that it was an effective consequence.

yeah - no

it's a short term solution - you don't need advice though as you seem to think this worked - so great - until the next time - you tried the techniques for 2-3 months - it can take years.

You just showed him that if he doesn't do what you want he'll be shipped back to a mum who hits him - way to make him feel safe

It is not an effective consequence. You're deliberately sending him back to an abusive situation. How do you not see how harmful that is?

You're also abusing him by doing that.

Your poor son needs love, firm and consistent boundaries, not a parent who deliberately sends them to an abusive situation, just to make him conform.

Effectively, you're showing him that you will only accept him if he's good and that when it gets tough, you don't care and so you'll send him someplace else that will also hurt him.

Regarding school, I am actually begging you to look up a Facebook group called not fine in school. So many children struggle with school and maybe this will give you more of a perspective as to why he is behaving how he is.

You're very much gaslighting your child's mental health and ignoring the massive whys behind it!!!!!

Effectively, you're showing him that you will only accept him if he's good and that when it gets tough, you don't care and so you'll send him someplace else that will also hurt him

absolutely this

Yeah. Sure, it's the therapeutic techniques that have really fucked your son up. For definite.

What exactly is CAHMS doing to support your son?

@fedupandstuck @ghostyslovesheets @Divanshi

What would be a better consequence to sending him to his mothers when he is in my care? Bearing in mind he is able to leave my house and walk to his mothers to avoid a consequence such as a screen ban.

What would be a better consequence at school to detentions and suspensions? My son is not bothered about getting detentions or a suspensions.

Therapeutic parenting works when it is implemented alongside enforceable boundaries. At the moment with no effective consequences, he appears to be embolden by a therapeutic approach.

@Swishyfishy

He has a check up meeting with them every two weeks, he is on a waiting list for a phycologist.

Why did there have to be a consequence for the stupid nonsense about the pen? You should have been able to ignore his behaviour and move on from that without getting dragged into a childish row and threats about dumping him at his abusive mother's or reducing his Christmas gifts.

Regarding school, eventually they will go for a permanent exclusion, when he has been through enough short term suspensions with no improvement. He might be accepted at another school, or possibly end up at a PRU if not or if he gets excluded again. You could look at a managed move to another school before getting to the permanent exclusion stage, if that's possible which it may well not be.

What would be a better consequence to sending him to his mothers when he is in my care Sending him back to a home were he is hit and were his grandmother threatened to distribute indecent images of him to other adults is NOT a consequence it's abuse. You are just showing him you don't care.

What would be a better consequence at school to detentions and suspensions? My son is not bothered about getting detentions or a suspensions I would fight the suspensions tooth and nail - it poor behaviour by a school BUT I would (and did) meet with them, discuss my concerns, work with them to get a better plan to support your child.

Therapeutic parenting works when it is implemented alongside enforceable boundaries. At the moment with no effective consequences, he appears to be embolden by a therapeutic approach Well therapy takes YEARS it's not magic - you don't have 2 sessions with CAMHS and your cured - he is traumatised. If his mums home is bad you involve social services and the courts and you step up.

@rob38 What do you want from this thread, exactly?

You've drip fed, insulted everyone, ignored advice, got defensive, repeated the same things and omitted some really relevant info.

So... What? Is this cobblers, or do you actually want advice?

I daresay nobody is going to give you a laundry list of examples of really harsh punishments to try, if that's what you're really asking.

I explained to him how much distress his behavior had been causing everyone and that I could not believe he was acting this way with me.

DS: Oh sorry dad I didn't realise. I'll change my ways forever and be a model son from now on

WTAF are you doing? No 13 yo cares about the impact of their behaviour on others!!

@fedupandstuck

Thank you for your response about school. A managed move is an option. His school have also talked about moving him temporarily, so that he gets a taste of what it is like to move school. Any other ideas?

Do you have any suggestions for consequences I could use at home? Bearing in mind he can leave my house and walk to his mums if he wants too.

@takealettermsjones

Ideas for consequences, they don't have to be harsh.

My only effective consequence at the moment is to take him back to his mums.

@ghostyslovesheets

I have done therapeutic parenting for years.

You are very critical of me taking him back to his mums, what consequence could I use instead?

A move to a new school is not something I would agree to - they tried it with us - I asked specifically what that school would do that they couldn't - that would make the behaviour miraculously change - nothing - so my child would 'fail' there as well.

All it means is another rejection for him - they don't want him either - chances are his behaviour would escalate in a new school because he'll feel the need to assert himself and probably expect them to reject him as well.

That is not consistency it's just more rejection, stress and change.

If you can be bothered I'd suggest some research on ACES and I'd also watch Helping Our Teens on I Player - Marie Gentles is pretty good at explaining why kids do what they do and how to support them to change.