13 year old son tried to black mail me

[rob38]

My son mostly lives with his mother, he has missed most of the last two - three months of school. Since June when he has been in school he has had a detention nearly every day and has had 5 or 6 suspensions. He has had support from Camhs but just seems to be acting this way for fun, and has repeatedly told me he is choosing to mess around.

On Tuesday he stayed over with me after he said that his mother had hit him and he had hit her back (he has a social worker at the moment who I reported this to).

I got him up for school on Wednesday morning, and found him a pen to take as he didn't have a pencil case with him, and his teachers had complained about him coming to class without a pen. He refused to take the pen unless I gave him £20, I though he was joking and said to him 'are you joking? I hope you are joking', to which he replied he wasn't. He then said that he was going to mess around at school unless I gave him £20. I am aware that he blackmails his mum, and I said to him that that does not work on me and that I wanted him to tell me that he was joking, to which he said he wasnt.

I explained to him how much distress his behavior had been causing everyone and that I could not believe he was acting this way with me.

On that day I had planned to go Christmas shopping for him and was going to spend up to $1000. After more attempts at blackmail in the car I said to him that I was going to drop his stuff off at his mums, that he doesn't behave like that with me, and that I was going to give him £100 for Christmas instead of spending £1000.

If everything you have typed is true, the fact that you haven't got a good lawyer and fighting tooth and nail for full-time custody puts you in a very bad light. I am sorry you have trauma for 2020; but your children need you to step up and be the parent that GAFS about them.

Your DD is "okay for now". So, you plan to wait until she is screwed up beyond measure so you can act all shocked and surprised when her behavior goes haywire?

Honestly, though I was sympathetic at first, I am beginning to think both of your children would be better off being with a family who is willing to fight for them. Neither you nor your ex seem up to the task.

Your DD is "okay for now". So, you plan to wait until she is screwed up beyond measure so you can act all shocked and surprised when her behavior goes haywire?

I'm afraid that's what I thought too, if this is true. I am still surprised that the OP says he genuinely can't remember what he attempted to apply for through the courts.

@Nanaof1

I physically cant. I have had support from a domestic abuse charity and therapist through the NHS. Mentally I can, but my body is not playing game. During 2020 - 22 when the case ended I suffered issues like my head dropping suddenly, falling over, chronic heart palpitations that keep me awake at night, migraines including hemiplegic migraines, anxiety, obsession, panic attacks and nightmares.

I report all my concerns about my kids to social services. And I get advice from organizations like the NSPCC.

@UnJardinSurLeTwat

I don't have an option to go to court, I report all my concerns to social services.

@UnJardinSurLeTwat

Okay, what would be another option as a consequence? I was doing screen time bans after 3 warnings but my son is now big enough to leave my house if he wants to and go to his mums who doesn't do screen bans.

Family therapy? You with DS. His mum with DS

Personally the behaviour seems like natural fallout post trauma, abuse, poor boundaries.

Has he any positive male role models outside of school?

He seems unhappy at school and unhappy at home. What does he think the answer is?

@Swishyfishy

He is generally happy when at my home. We game, mess around and have fun. He is usually well behaved though with bedtimes it is more tricky if he is only staying up with me once a week. He has his friends over occasionally for sleep overs etc.

I am not sure that he is unhappy at school, just that he sees it as a playground.

His mother has a boyfriends whom both he and Ava speak about positively, which is great, he likes my brother who we occasionally see.

We cant do family therapy.

You said In 2020, I made an application for emergency custody

You say you can't remember whether it was an Emergency Protection Order - but I am not aware that there is any other. This is a court application. You must have gone to court if you "made an application for emergency custody".

Part of the problem is that your story is so full of inconsistencies.

FWIW, in a situation like yours, I would get a good lawyer (ask around) and make a proper application to have both of your children reside with you full time. It would be easier for you to have clear boundaries and natural consequences for undesirable behaviour if your son can't just flounce off to his mum's - or if you can't just send him there. The entire dynamic is severely dysfunctional as it is.

You say your children are being abused, but you do nothing about it. I'm sorry, but this suggests to me that you are not much better as a parent - any half decent parent would get their children out of that situation rather than come up with bollocks about "I'm reducing your Christmas budget by £900".

This couldn't happen if you got yourself into gear and had both children residing with you.

Unless their mother is not actually abusive, in which case you wouldn't have a leg to stand on, and in which case a lot of your posts are highly exaggerated. In that scenario, you would just both be very poor parents who should seek professional help.

@UnJardinSurLeTwat

I get the twat bit.

His mum was abusive during 2020, since then it has only been very recently that my son has stated that she hit him and he hit her back. He has a Social Worker at the moment who I passed that onto. I have also passed on my concerns about my daughter. My son was a little lad in 2020, he is now almost 6 foot and very confident. Although I have concerns about possible neglect with dentists, haircuts etc. with my daughter I don't want to suddenly disrupt her life unless absolutely necessary. She is a very happy girl and is doing well at school.

Natural consequences don't work with kids unless you have implemented that form of parenting since they were little, which we didn't. They don't learn from natural consequences at 13. The natural consequence for my son of staying up late and not going to school at the moment wont effect him enough for him to change his behavior until years down the line by which point he has missed out on education etc.

@rob38 That's a pathetic little dig, and completely unnecessary.

You either think your children are at risk from their mother, or you don't. If you do, you need to take appropriate action. If you don't, you will just have to muddle on as you are doing at the moment.

You still can't answer the question as to whether you have or haven't applied for an Emergency Protection Order, and you can't explain how you did apparently apply for this but haven't been to court. Your whole story is utterly garbled.

FWIW, £1k on Christmas presents is too much anyway. £100 is more realistic. But don't use it as a bribe or a punishment.

@UnJardinSurLeTwat

Its not a pathetic little dig.

Rather then provide a suggestion in response to my request for ideas on effective consequences, you want to pull my story apart. If you don't believe my story, or you don't have a suggestion don't post on the thread.

If you read back, you will see that I have made some sensible suggestions (most notably that you need to decide whether or not your children's mother is abusive, and take appropriate action).

I think that's a pretty clear suggestion.

Asking you how you didn't go to court yet applied for "emergency custody" is not pulling your story apart. If there's a straightforward answer to this question, you could just explain. As things stand, your information is very muddled and this makes it difficult for people to make useful suggestions.

If it's the case that your children's mother isn't abusive, then you and she both need to find ways to become more effective parents. Family therapy (for you and your son, and her and your son - not necessarily the three of you together) is one suggestion which you rejected.

@UnJardinSurLeTwat

I have told you that she was abusive, and that I don't remember the exact order I applied for apart from it was for emergency custody. What are you doing questioning that, go away

Natural consequences do work - they worked on my child at this age and at 18 when they refused to return to college even when a staff member turned up every day to take them in - they are now in their second year of university.

Family therapy works as well - when my eldest was in year 6 all 3 of my children ended up on a CP plan due to concerns about the impact on them of the eldest's behaviour - it taught me so so much about what I was doing wrong and how to be a better parent

You keep saying 'I can't do this and I can't do that' but why?

I now work in a field that promotes trauma unformed education and supports schools, parents and young people - nothing will change unless you do - you seem obsessed with consequences yet plenty of people have given you ideas and explanations of what is and isn't going to work - you ignore it.

One thing that always stuck with me is this 'Your child needs your love the most when they deserve it the least' step up and parent.

In that case (of your children's mother being abusive), you have no alternative but to take action to ensure that they can reside with you full time. This might be lawyer/court, or it might be via SS. I chose to take the legal route to ensure that my ex husband couldn't have unsupervised contact with our children. If you don't take any action to protect your children, you could also be regarded as culpable.

Basically, if you see that your children are being abused, you have to remove them. Otherwise, an external agency will remove them from both of you, because it's impossible to hide these things forever (and why would you want to?)

Your son's behaviour won't change until the adults around him change their own behaviour. He needs a parent who will give him very strict boundaries but will love him and make him feel safe however much he acts out. He currently just bounces between you, depending on who's the "bad guy" at any particular moment. There's nothing positive about it. You also need to keep money out of your dealings with him.

BTW, it's pointless to tell someone to go away because they're not telling you what you want to hear.

I would also say that your petulant response to my pretty sensible suggestions might shed some light on the dynamic with your son. Rather than engaging thoughtfully, you become flustered and tell me to "go away". If you react like that to a difficult and/or troubled young teenager, you're on a hiding to nothing.

@ghostyslovesheets

Every person on here will have experienced a consequence from their parent at some point during their childhood.

I am interested in a suggestion for a consequence that I can implement with my child, given that he is able to leave my house and go to his mums if he doesn't like it.

I haven't ignored posts, I have clicked thanks or replied thank you on the ones that have been useful.

Natural consequences may have worked on your children, but allowing my son freedom to find natural consequences to his behavior could lead him to engaging in worse behavior, lead him to harm, and could take years.

My son for example went out recently at 4am with his mate to a inner city park to mess around while he was staying with his mum. The natural consequence to him feeling free to carry on doing that could be death.

He also vapes, that natural consequence to that could be a collapsed lung.

I use therapeutic parenting techniques with him but I don't have an effective consequence, and that is what I am looking for.

@UnJardinSurLeTwat

Please stop posting on this thread.

I am interested in a suggestion for a consequence that I can implement with my child, given that he is able to leave my house and go to his mums if he doesn't like it

and you had a really good answer 'you impose the consequence and if he goes to his mums it still stands when he is next at yours'

You talk about weekends gaming etc - so maybe it's no gaming with you for 2 hours on his next visit and some chores

You still wont say why you 'can't' got to court or family therapy

You can't impose sanctions at his mums - so if he goes to mums fine but that sanction remains at your house - when he comes back.

As to going out at 4am - did you call the police, is he subject to MAACE meetings via his social worker - I'd be taking that seriously.

You have a TEAM around your son - ask them for help, ask for a meeting with them - CHAMS, School, SW - ask for support and suggestions

Just repeatedly asking hoe to punish an obviously distressed child (his behaviour is an expression of this) ask for HELP to help him.

Oh and my child - I could write a book - repeatedly smashing up the house, beating me, school refusal, refusal to engage with CHAMS, suggestions of managed moves, exclusions, endless detections, self harm, missing episodes, hearing voices, it was horrific at times (I am a single parent to 3 children) - father next to useless and harsh (abusive) in punishment, vaping, drug use

They told me last night (aged 21) that I am their best friend in the whole world and 'thank you for never giving up on me'. They are bright, brave and kind, I love them beyond anything and I always did - even when I was threatened with broken glass.

I always knew, whatever pain, fear, turmoil and sadness I was feeling due to their behaviour - what they felt was a billionty times worse - never give up and just love love love.

@ghostyslovesheets

Thank you, I wasn't aware of him going out until the next day and I reported it to social services. I do ask for help, and report my concerns.

This is a good response 'you impose the consequence and if he goes to his mums it still stands when he is next at yours', however it is unfair on him to drag a consequence out over a week I think.

And if he knows that if he comes to mine he still has a screen ban, he is likely to stay with his mum.

I have trauma symptoms from 2020, which haven't been resolved through therapy such as chronic heart palpitations, and coming into contact with his mum brings them on or makes them worse. Also his mum has repeatedly declined similar things such as mediation since 2020, so I think she would say no.

There have been a lot of people in this threat basically stating that I am a dick for sending him back to his mum, but that was an effective consequence that saw an improvement in his behavior
Whilst you're patting yourself on the back that your actions improved his behaviour, you totally neglect to see that the threat of less money spent on him is probably the bigger motivator here. You just bribed him really. So no, not an 'effective consequence' 🙄

What kind of message do you think sending him back to his mothers sends? Seriously? What do you think you are telling him?
Engaging over a pen is just ridiculous. Why did you do that? All you did is escalate a non issue. He doesn't take a pen, it's on him. I'd have laughed at his attempt to bribe, I mean it's ridiculous and should have been shut down immediately. He is going to continue to play you like a piano if you keep being so weak and inconsistent in your approach.
You bang on about how he can leave your house if he doesn't like your 'rules' I assume he can leave his mothers and come to you as well. But he's not, is he?

You seem to run to social services with all your concerns but don't take any real action to help your children. If you are going to do nothing and leave them in an abusive home because it's easier for you, you really can't be complaining about their behaviour. They've learnt they have no one to stand up for them and will act accordingly 🤷‍♀️