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Quotes from Narcissistic Mothers (& support for their victims) Thread 3

395 replies

01Name · 12/10/2023 10:55

Following on from this thread: www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4610023-to-ask-for-your-quotes-from-narcissistic-mothers?page=39&reply=120137262, started by @itsgoodtobehome as a tongue-in-cheek repository for anecdotes of appalling remarks/deeds from parents/siblings with rampant NPD. It morphed into a place where those of us suffering the effects of such behaviour could share experiences, solidarity, advice and support. It continued to a second thread here: Quotes from Narcissistic Mothers (& support for their victims) Thread 2 | Mumsnet I hope this thread can continue the good work of its predecessors. Your voice will be heard; your opinion and thoughts matter. You are welcome and valued here. The world is a better place with you in it, despite what you might have been conditioned to believe by those who brought you into it. x

OP posts:
JohnPrescottsPyjamas · 17/06/2024 15:51

Pantaloons99 · 17/06/2024 14:22

@JohnPrescottsPyjamas he's 12. He is however autistic/ADHD. In his case he is incredibly perceptive, incredibly intelligent but may interpret things differently. I realised because he is so honest and matter of fact that he had figured out certain things already regards my brother's behaviour himself - from having spent time there seeing cousins. He asked me things which I never thought he'd notice for example.

If he’s perceptive, he’s probably got a good idea that ‘something’ isn’t right with your mother. I’m not if others would agree but my instinct would be to be open with him but maybe not overload him with detailed information.
I think children of that age are far more aware than we sometimes give them credit for. My two knew my NM was different from other grannies quite early on. Sadly because I was quite often in tears or very angry after visits.

user1471538283 · 18/06/2024 07:53

@Pantaloons99 - I never went into detail about my DM with my DS because I was stupidly hoping she'd want a relationship (a decent one like his excellent DGF) with him and I tried very hard to facilitate it. Then it dawned on me it was never going to happen.

My DS never questioned why she wasn't around and he tried to manage her (before I was NC).

JohnPrescottsPyjamas · 18/06/2024 08:30

user1471538283 · 18/06/2024 07:53

@Pantaloons99 - I never went into detail about my DM with my DS because I was stupidly hoping she'd want a relationship (a decent one like his excellent DGF) with him and I tried very hard to facilitate it. Then it dawned on me it was never going to happen.

My DS never questioned why she wasn't around and he tried to manage her (before I was NC).

This is a good point.

I also tried to be ‘the bigger person’ for a while and try not let my own poor relationship with my NM reflect on any my DCs might have with her. I stood back believing that maybe our issues were just our particular combination.

However, all that happened was NM then attempted to be divisive and worm herself between myself and DD. She started telling her that DD could always talk to her about anything she felt she couldn’t discuss with me and they would always be ‘their little secrets’ She would tell DD she was going to treat her to a whole new wardrobe of clothes - but it transpired they were only items that NM approved of for my nearly 30 something DD, and on condition that she visited her regularly, so the controlling and manipulation was still an ongoing theme.

RenewableNewt · 18/06/2024 14:01

I’m really sorry to come back again so soon.

We had my parents here Sunday before last which I think I posted about at the time because it was a lot for me to deal with.

My sister has just let me know that mum told her this weekend that I hadn’t told her when my 20-week scan will be. However, I have a clear memory of DH looking at his phone calendar when we were all sitting at the dinner table and telling her and my dad the date!

Apparently my dad was sitting there when mum said this to my sister and didn’t correct her. At all. He just let her lie about us and did nothing.

sorry for the bold, it’s just to show my complete incredulity and bloody anger that she is now lying about me and DH to my sister?! How dare she? Is it any wonder that I’m in counselling and trying desperately to put some boundaries in place?

If they both carry on like this, then they really won’t have access to my children, and it will be entirely of their own making.

It doesn’t help that this week is my due date for the pregnancy we lost, ending in MMC in December. She has not a shred of empathy in her body.

RenewableNewt · 18/06/2024 14:04

I really want to ask my mum why she lied, and to ask my dad why he didn’t correct her, but that’s too obvious that my sister has told me and I don’t want to get her into trouble.

How dare they think they can do/say these things with no recourse? It makes me want to share my pregnancy/baby with them even less than I already did. Jesus Christ.

RenewableNewt · 18/06/2024 14:16

It’s really dawning on me that I’m never going to get any mental space or peace from them. I don’t think it’s even occurred to them that I’m finding pregnancy after MMC hard, even without their selfish behaviour.

I just cannot believe that even now my dad is not standing up for me. I’m 30, FFS, this has been going on my entire life! I’m livid with them.

How can I let them know that I know they’ve lied/not pulled the other one up on a lie, without dropping my sister in it?

AngryLikeHades · 18/06/2024 14:30

@Turquioseblue my mother was very similar. It turned me into a ghost with no personality because I was so scared if getting in trouble!

SomewhereOverTheHill · 18/06/2024 14:30

@RenewableNewt Do you think they were listening when you told them the date of the scan? They could be covering themselves not listening/not bothering to remember the date so they don’t lose face. If you don’t want to expose your sister telling you, there isn’t much you can do. With families like this, you will be wrong no matter what you do. Narcs never take accountability for their actions. My family was like this (I’m NC), no empathy, no accountability and plenty of venom.

RenewableNewt · 18/06/2024 14:52

@SomewhereOverTheHill it’s possible they weren’t listening, I suppose, but we were sitting there face to face across the dining table, so they’d have to have tried pretty hard not to listen.

I’m gutted that they’re making my pregnancy about them, and even more so that my dad still won’t stand up for me. He gave a speech at my wedding last year about how much he loved me and it was love at first sight as soon as I was born and FFS, in that case, why don’t you ever protect me from her?!

You’re right that there isn’t much I can do without dropping my sister in it, and she doesn’t deserve that.

They really can’t see that the way they behave isn’t right or good or conducive to a close relationship. They constantly make out that I’m the mad/bad one.

user1471538283 · 18/06/2024 15:04

@RenewableNewt - when I tried to call my DM out on her behaviour or lies she would just scream. Nothing was ever admitted or made better. I doubt your DM or DF will either.

We always want them to be normal DMs and it never happens.

RenewableNewt · 18/06/2024 15:08

I’m sorry, @user1471538283. You’re right, we always want them/our families to be normal, but they never can be.

I’m really feeling pressure to appease them and keep the peace because my sister said she just wants to avoid any drama happening, and that sometimes people have different/better relationships with their grandparents than their parents did. But I’m thinking long and hard about whether my parents will get a relationship with my child at all, let alone a chance of having a better one with them than I did.

If my mum is willing to lie about me to my sister, she’s capable of lying about me to my child, isn’t she?

I feel absolutely livid that I’m still expected to disregard my instincts and emotions in favour of her ego or whatever it is that makes her behave this way.

I actually feel as though I’m going mad.

reesewithoutaspoon · 18/06/2024 15:12

@RenewableNewt My mum would do similar. It's in their interest to divide you and your sister. Does she ever tell stories about your sister to paint her in a bad light?
It was a tactic of my mothers. Bitch about me to my sister and vice versa. That way she looks like the poor victim to both of us and we think the other is treating mum badly. It took years for us to suss her behaviour out as obviously me and sis weren't that close because of her.
Now we are on the same page we both double check with each other for the true version of events whenever mum is spinning tales.
As for your dad, he's protecting himself. He has to live with her 24/7 , its easier I suppose to shut up and not correct her in front of people because narcs hate to look bad and usually flip if that happens.

RenewableNewt · 18/06/2024 15:16

@reesewithoutaspoon the worst she can say about my sister is that she likes going out drinking (in reality, she goes out every so often with work friends - but mum will make it sound like she’s drunk every weekend). So yes, she takes artistic license with the truth about my sister too, but about relatively inconsequential things.

RenewableNewt · 18/06/2024 15:19

How can I get rid of them if, whenever I try to go low contact, they start creating this drama? I need them to stop this, I will not have my pregnancy spoilt by stress because of their behaviour. If I don’t tell them stuff, they act out, but if I do tell them stuff, they still act out.

They genuinely don’t get it and they refuse to reflect on their own behaviour. I want to move far far away and never speak to them again.

dragoncheeselady · 18/06/2024 16:11

RenewableNewt · 18/06/2024 15:19

How can I get rid of them if, whenever I try to go low contact, they start creating this drama? I need them to stop this, I will not have my pregnancy spoilt by stress because of their behaviour. If I don’t tell them stuff, they act out, but if I do tell them stuff, they still act out.

They genuinely don’t get it and they refuse to reflect on their own behaviour. I want to move far far away and never speak to them again.

Its really difficult to cut them off. You have to have really firm boundaries and block them on absolutely everything and every time they call or show up you need to be able to ignore the call, delete the messages and not answer the door. Be prepared for them slagging you off to all and sundry and trying to get other people involved to reel you back in (flying monkeys). It will take a lot out of you but being strong and sticking to your boundaries is the only way.
When I began to set boundaries with my mother she would do absolutely anything to try and get round them. Creating drama, leaving endless messages, faking sickness, telling her family how horrible I was so they would call to tell me off. It took a long time to get her to back off totally and in the end I believe it was she realised she got more attention telling people about her evil daughter than she would if she continued to harass me, especially as I had repeatedly demonstrated I would not give in to her demands.
You will need to decide which is worst for you at the moment, dealing with the current drama or setting up and keeping those boundaries and dealing with the fall out.

KaleQueen · 18/06/2024 16:56

@RenewableNewt if you play straight bat with them it takes their power away.
Just text and say ‘hey, just a reminder the 20 week scan is xx xx as DSIS mentioned in passing you couldn’t quite remember the date when we’d told you over dinner at the weekend’
power gone. And they’ll tie themselves up in knots freaking about what you and your sister have been talking about.

JohnPrescottsPyjamas · 18/06/2024 20:34

user1471538283 · 18/06/2024 15:04

@RenewableNewt - when I tried to call my DM out on her behaviour or lies she would just scream. Nothing was ever admitted or made better. I doubt your DM or DF will either.

We always want them to be normal DMs and it never happens.

This definitely - or go straight into gaslighting mode.
”I never said that!”
”You must have imagined it”
”I’m so shocked you could even think/say that”
Usually followed by wailing and tears.

I honestly doubted my own sanity on occasions as my NM was such an expert manipulator of facts. So many times I had to ask my DH or DCs if they heard the same version that I did to check I wasn’t losing the plot.

junebugalice · 19/06/2024 00:00

RenewableNewt · 18/06/2024 15:19

How can I get rid of them if, whenever I try to go low contact, they start creating this drama? I need them to stop this, I will not have my pregnancy spoilt by stress because of their behaviour. If I don’t tell them stuff, they act out, but if I do tell them stuff, they still act out.

They genuinely don’t get it and they refuse to reflect on their own behaviour. I want to move far far away and never speak to them again.

Oh @RenewableNewt i hear you. It sounds like you’re at the beginning of truly understanding what it means to have the type of parents you have. I don’t mean that to sound patronising, at all. Speaking for myself, I knew intellectually what narcissism was and the family roles etc. as a result, I thought I could put boundaries in place and practice gray rock and other similar techniques. However, what I noticed is that every attempt at a boundary was run over and the abusive behaviour continued, such as, exclusion and triangulation with my golden child sister. My enabling father stayed true to his role and has never once waivered. So, I think, there is knowing about these toxic people but there is so much pain, hurt and loss in truly being in relationship with these types of people and this was the biggest thing I had to come to terms with.

They say that once you see narcissism you can’t unsee it, and omg, is that true for me. I found that I was no longer willing, or able, to be around people who continually mistreat me.

You said how you are expected to forgo your emotions and instincts in order to preserve her ego, that’s so messed up, and yet that’s what this crazy people need and expect from us in order to be in contact with them. Try your best to work on acceptance of the fact that they’re incapable of self reflection and change. I found this extremely hard, I’m not going to lie. But so unbelievably worth it, I’m like a new person, or the person I was always meant to be.

Engage in therapy, read all the books to try and process this crap so you can be the best parent for your baby. Avoid their drama by refusing to engage, don’t respond to messages or calls. Tell them clearly what you want if they push you, remember you hold all the power here you just don’t see it yet. They don’t deserve any of you in their lives.

RenewableNewt · 19/06/2024 09:55

Thank you all for your replies. I’m sorry, I’m really struggling with this at the moment.

it’s always me who has to give in and go against all of my instincts which scream to get her away from me. My dad said yesterday that it’s time to ‘rebuild a relationship’, ‘put the past behind’ me - they’re just never going to get it.

I don’t think I’m in the wrong here in wanting to protect myself and my baby. I’ve had 30 years of this and still they don’t get it at all. I’m so so lonely.

reesewithoutaspoon · 19/06/2024 11:22

I agree with @junebugalice You are tying yourself in knots trying to understand why they do what they do and hoping that somehow you can change who they are and how they react.
You really can't.
Peace only comes when you accept that the only thing you can change is how you react to it.
They are never going to be the parents you crave and trying to 'fix' things is where madness lies. You will stress yourself out and drive yourself crazy doing that.
Understanding her narcissistic behaviours and the dynamic with your dad helps. There's something about knowing how they will react or respond before they do that almost takes their power away.

I am at the point of low contact with my mother and what she does no longer affects me because I accepted that that's her and she isn't going to change. I don't love her, don't even like her I'm just indifferent to her. She can scream and wail and act out all she likes, but I feel disconnected now, almost like an onlooker, there are just no feelings there anymore.

KaleQueen · 19/06/2024 15:41

@RenewableNewt please don’t feel lonely you’re in good company here and your instincts are spot on and heightened now you have a little human on their way to protect. It’s easier to abandon yourself in these family dynamics, but you won’t let yourself expose your baby to that. It’s so stressful I know. When my first came along the floodgates opened for me and I couldn’t tolerate what I used to put up with. It’s a weird thing but it’s like your instinct over rides things. I had a very strong sense of ‘you did all that to me, no way you’re doing it to my children’. Of course I was told by everyone ‘of course she wouldn’t do that to them’ ….would she not? So she can abuse her own daughter but be mother Theresa reincarnated to my children….and even if she is lovely to the grandchild then actually that continues the abuse of you as I felt really angry ‘how come she loves them but can’t love me?’
do what you need to but please don’t stress at this delicate time of your life. Relax, close the door on them for now. I didn’t tell any of my family my scan dates, my due date (exactly) or when I went into labour as I knew it would just stress me out.

user1471538283 · 19/06/2024 17:57

Things absolutely changed for me having my DS. I didn't even tell her he was born because what would be the point? She found out anyway but didn't even hold him or congratulate me. I remember her saying that she hadn't slept the night before and she thought it was because I was giving birth. I just thought what an odd thing to say and that it was a lie. She didn't have any sleepless nights when she constantly treated me badly as a child, or when she made me homeless twice or when I was in an abusive relationship. I think she'd read it somewhere and it sounded good in front of others. She also went flapping to the nurses about me. Again attention.

I know this because the only time she came to see me when we were home and it was just the two of us she didn't even make me a cup of tea. She sat down and expected to be entertained. Again she never held him. This was so she could tell people she'd been to see me and they would then assume she'd helped.

I wished I'd gone NC with her then.

My DM pulled all sorts to get to me. Weeping and grizzling so people would get in touch with me "to help" thinking it was a misunderstanding and\or she was the victim. Everyone's an expert when they think it's a quick fix. But she never wanted me, she just wanted someone to manipulate or something to gossip about.

I just came to the realisation that I was cutting out the middle man by not letting her upset me. But by then my upset had turned to hate anyway.

I know it can feel lonely. I spent decades feeling less than and wasted time trying to have a relationship with her that was never going to happen. I did the same with her family. But you've got us and your own lovely family and friends. X

JohnPrescottsPyjamas · 19/06/2024 22:26

@RenewableNewt I get what you mean completely - and there’s so many wise words on here.

As children of narcs, we’ve all tried to apply to compare and have the same expectations from our narc parents that we’ve seen other ‘normal’ families have, only to be let down time and time again. We somehow think if we can understand them and why they behave like they do, we can somehow make it right, but it doesn’t work like that. We tend to assume guilt, that it’s somehow our fault that the relationship isn’t working because we’ve been so well ‘trained’ by these parents to assume any failure is ours, because a narc will never accept any responsibility for their own behaviour.

@reesewithoutaspoon Your advice, “Peace only comes when you accept that the only thing you can change is how you react to it” is so powerful - thank you. If my narc mother was still alive, I would have had these words painted on one of those boards in my kitchen to remind myself daily. I literally spent my whole life desperately trying to understand why she behaved and treated me (and certain others) like she did, rather than accepting she was what she was and no matter how I responded or reacted to her, she would never change as she lacked both empathy and the ability to be reflective.

Pantaloons99 · 19/06/2024 22:50

I see alot of posts showing their mum's harassing them almost for attention. My dynamic growing up wasn't like that. It's interesting how differently they can present. Growing up it was absolute rejection, feeling so unwanted and being pushed away continually. I was the needy one; the neediness was with me my entire life. But then pulled in when necessary. Obviously I didn't realise this until very recently.

Even when desperately unwell in hospital during the last 6 years she wouldn't come to visit despite us living doors away from each other, regularly interacting and having a 'pleasant' enough relationship. I'm seriously unwell unfortunately. My last visit in hospital was 6 weeks. I had no clothes, nothing. I couldn't get up to go buy anything. I was in for 6 weeks. Friends had to come and kindly provided things. I wouldn't ask as I hate to do that. But they have been more like a mother during these times. My mum is not old or infirm. ( 65)

I had to watch her drunk in the evening caring for my son and yet would present excellently at the school as this amazing granny. I find this part so difficult. No one would believe it or actually really buy into it so you can't ever tell anyone anyway.

I have taken steps to ensure my son is going to be with his dad/ stepmum and siblings more as my health is poor. I am sharing less and less with her as I see more and more clearly awful things that she has done. She helped with my son ( lifts to school) as I couldn't. Now the power is being taken away and I won't need this anymore, my mum is falling over herself to help me with bits I have always desperately needed help with . She has never ever expressed willingness to do any of these things before. As she has more power she is incredibly unpleasant. Also an alcoholic ( functioning)This seems different to alot of what you describe.

I've been in counselling for about 15 years with the same lady. My mum is 100% narcissist btw. As is brother, created by mum and now deceased dad. I am absolutely not one. I do however have a multitude of severe and horrendous autoimmune diseases.

I'm no contact with brother and feel lighter for it. An horrendous bully capable of pretty scary overt aggression. Also an alcoholic.

I feel so relieved to get my son away from them. It takes a lifetime to ' see'.

user1471538283 · 20/06/2024 06:48

@Pantaloons99 - I'm so sorry to hear you are unwell.

My DM too ignored me most of my childhood and I was needy, constantly begging her for love. Her harassing me for attention was only so she could tell other she had seen her DGS. She never held him, played with him, read to him. Her harassing me on the phone was only so she could tell others my business. I told her very little because I knew she was telling others and either putting a spiteful swing on it (if it were good) or laughing about it (if it were bad).

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