Son (12) is causing trouble as part of a gang and messing with knifes

[Alyson1991]

My son turns 12 tomorrow (18th of may). His behaviour for over a month or so has been horrendous! Lying, manipulating, sneaking out when grounded, searching for his device when it’s been taken off him etc. then last week he had friends at home, thought his dad and I were both at work and his dad caught him handling a knife (big kitchen knife) in front of his friends in our house. Every consequence is ignored or broken, we’ve taken away pocket money, limited his devices, grounded him, gave him extra chores, asked the school to discuss his behaviour with him, cancelled days out and outings but nothing seems to be getting through to him. Yesterday he snuck out whilst grounded and I found out him and 4 of his friends had knocked one of their other ‘friends’ to the ground and had punched and kicked him as a gang (5 against 1!). He also lied at first and said he wasn’t there until I caught him out. I have made him apologise to the boy and his family, today I have taken away his devices and grounded him. However we have a couple of nights in a cabin booked for tomorrow for his birthday and I don’t feel he should go. I think he should get 1 present, a small cupcake or something and a half decent dinner at home but I feel that sound be it because he needs a short sharp shock and needs to take it seriously. What are everyone’s thoughts? Do I keep him at home? If so how do I handle his bday without ignoring it but also without making it too special as I think he needs a real fright. All advice appreciated, an overwhelmed and out of her depth mother x

OP I know the replies on here are hard for you to hear but you really do have to act now before your son is either a killer or killed. You need to make sure that boy is never alone without an adult. Check his school bag every single day before you take him to school and when you pick him up. Your kitchen knives need to be locked away as do any tools, after a he is going to get very angry with you ! Your doors and and windows need alarms. No more tik tok, snap chat, youtube and violent video games. You need to be calling the police and social services today. This is seriously dangerous.

I agree as well. A few days (or as long as possible!) Away could do him a lot of good!

I would take him away. Talk to him 1:1 and take no devices with you, so he has no contact with these friends either. Properly talk about solutions and ways forward. Get to the root of it. He’s very young for all this

No birthday at all. No present, no cake.

as a pp has suggested I’d take him to the cabin with no devices. And try to find out wtf is going on.

You need to be really careful as he is a mini criminal now. Assaulting people, messing with weapons. If you can’t put a stop to this now, he will end up in prison or at least completely useless to society.

OP's not been back...

If this was my child I would be thinking the following ; moving house, changing schools, finding a boarding school far away from his ‘friends’ or even in another country (rates may be cheaper) if you can afford that.

I don’t think early help referral will do much. He won’t engage and most likely find it like a badge of honour amongst his friends

a cupcake and one present will do nothing . He won’t even care. You need to take your child out of the environment they are in. Take away devises indefinitely , sell them or bin them. No pocket money no luxuries at all. Curfew.

not to be blunt but wake up and make a change immediately . Have you not seen the news of gangs of kids stabbing others. A kid was stabbed to death were I live , the person doing the stabbing was egged on by his mates as an initiation into there group

I’m sorry OP, but if it was my son beaten down by yours I’d be your worst nightmare. Cupcakes would really be the last of your worries. You’re the parent ffs! Then parent your child! Connect with him, talk to him, teach him a lesson. Find a way to get through to him before you either visit him in prison or on his grave.

This

Deprivation and punishment clearly isn’t working so if you continue like this where will it end? Your sim sleeping on bare boards in his room, kept in on bread and water?

You may be at risk of breeding defiance and disaffection from the family. He is pubescent, probably trying to prove that he is the big independent male.

I would remain firm and clear that his behaviour is not ok but concentrate on getting him out of it. Reward him for staying away from those mates. Give him opportunity spend time away from them, definitely take him away for his b’day and show him he can have a good time without those mates and without posturing around with kitchen equipment.

Get him into challenges that he will enjoy that address his young male risk drive. Does he like skateboarding? Go Ape?

Rather than impose chores as punishment give him responsibility and reward him for meeting it. An outing for a time sheet of vacuuming or lawn mowing.

Wtf are you doing? He could end up dead or someone else and you are worrying about holidays!! You need to move house and out of area. What is with all this enabling behaviour!!!!!

I am sorry that your family is going through this. It is complicated for your DS as well. Many things in gang-oriented culture are presented in a very distorted way and for a young person overwhelmed with all confusion of puberty and lack of own experience, it is genuinely hard to see the right way forward. But your family has to be very aware of the fact that GANGS (might be machete-wielding drug traffickers might be "harmless" shoplifters) actively recruit young teens to do all the dirty work for them because they can't yet be properly held accountable by law on many things.

The police need to do 'induction days' at prisons etc for situations like this.

Basically call them up, pay them £100 say... hand them your child... and for the weekend they are treated exactly like they would be if they were banged up... bad food, communal toilets, abusive cell mates, no sleep, scrubbing a toilet with their own toothbrush... things like that.

A few nights of that and 99% of kids would be begging for homework!

Go to the cabin.
Zero devices.
Strenous activity.
Walks talks and listen
Why is he behavng this way ? Let him tell you and offer himself what he needs to stop

I totally agree with you. I'm dealing with a 13 year old who is currently being a pain at school with constant low level disruption and I have taken a zero tolerance approach to it, no phone, no xbox, asked school to put him on report. I won't have it. You need to clamp down now, and see it through. No way would I be taking my child away or giving him any birthday celebrations. You won't tolerate this appalling behaviour in a year 7, yes year 7, child. Show him you mean it.

I agree, OP is massively down playing the seriousness of this. I would have involved the police when he assaulted another child and was playing with knives.

12 May be young to you but he’s old enough to know better and he could have been facing murder charges if the friend they beat up had died Ffs!

Move away. Seriously, I've seen what happens when you don't get kids like this right out of the situation and the influences that are fuelling this behaviour.

I would move areas, far enough from the current gang.

The behaviour you describe is serious as you say and rather than think about sticking tape punishments, you need to get to the root causes. Punishment doesn't work. It sounds as though he needs professional psych input - if this is not available, there are various things you can start to do. I thank you for posting about this, a group of kids like your dc are attacking DC at the moment and I wish their parents would step in and try to do something as you are doing.

In your shoes I would take him away for a few days away from the internet and his group of friends and start to talk to him. Children need to be told what is and is not okay (even at 12 years) and the consequences of not treating others well, it is amazing how often this basic first step isn't done. He also needs closer supervision all the time and he probably needs to be removed from the situation and the group he is part of completely. There are probably things affecting him which he cannot express at the moment, and he needs help with that. It might be that he has an attachment disorder or similar and you could look into that and what might have caused it and what you could do to help him, there are some decent sources online.

The kids who are behaving like this at DC's school are playing violent video games and reading Manga - manga read in the UK is full of extreme violence and quite disturbing images and contrary to the woke advice often seen on MN I think people underestimate the effect this has on young minds.

Your dc is unlikely to have changed overnight and it might be worth tracking back to work out when the disrespectful behaviour started, and then when the distrubed and dangerous behaviour started, and working out what went wrong and then how to put it right.

There are charities in the UK with helplines about helping teens with MH problems it is worth phoning a few to get a wide range of advice.

You can turn this around, but it will require a lot of input from you, or you getting help for him

Until your child or family member become a victim of knife crime or serious assault, then you can keep saying it’s harsh. 12 is not young and many 12 year olds are carrying weapons around, knife crime is becoming a huge problem in society and it’s not a problem that’s going away.

Behaviour wont change just thru punishment.
Rehabilitation/one on one psychological support. Address why.

Completely agree. The cupcake brigade desperately need to wise up.

A few choices: move house to get him away for a fresh start, move schools so he doesnt meet these kids at school, get him into some sports to meet other types of kids, ask the police to talk to him and put the fear of god into him. However the latter wont get him away from his pals and that is the key. It will only end badly if he cant get a new start. I think i would be moving house and it doesnt have to be that far.

That's horrendous I don't think you realise how bad. You need to take big serious action. Move house. Come down hard on him like a ton of bricks for disobedience. Substituting a birthday cake for a cupcake is nowhere near close to what you need to do to save him.

Hi all.

I have read all of the messages on this thread and have done since last night. I have taken him to apologise to the boy he hurt and I’ve spoken with the parents. I have taken his devices, I’ve taken his house key and I have taken every freedom I can think of. I am dropping him off and collecting him from school each day. He will not be going to the cabin or having his birthday recognised in any way shape or form today. For those asking what his childhood and where we live is like: we live in a small village which has a small local school and a really low crime rate. We live amongst the countryside in Scotland. It’s a good village to grow up in and it’s very child oriented, lots of events for the kids to get involved in and a strong sense of community. His childhood I think has been good, his dad and I have been together since before he was born and he has lived with us both in the house we have since the day he was born. There is no DV at all, never has been. Son and I are close I believe, he tells me so and we do spend lots of time together although I do have a demanding job in the care industry. His grandfather is a bully who abused me and siblings throughout our childhood, my mum stood by while it happened. So I haven’t got a strong parental example to look towards but I vowed to never be like my parents, to always show love and kindness. Somehow he is still becoming out of control and violent and whilst he was exposed to my parents when he was younger he hasn’t seen them for around 5/6 years as I recognise the negative impact of having them in his life. I’m not a bad mum even though it doesn’t seem like it.